Take out the volume spacers (maybe leave 1) and pump it up.

 

If I am reading your post correctly, you have lsc open? That would lead to a harsh fork, especially at your weight as this would lead to you riding more in the harsher mid stroke. It’s counter intuitive but you need to increase your compression dampening.

Also, and counter intuitive, you may need to increase your air pressure when you do this for the same reason.

My guess is you are riding in the mid stroke due to too low of air pressure and lsc, which is a harsher part of the compression stroke in an air spring.

Edit: or convert it to coil once vorsprung comes out with their conversion and be happy as a lamb.

 

If I am reading your post correctly, you have lsc open? That would lead to a harsh fork, especially at your weight as this would lead to you riding more in the harsher mid stroke. ...

...you are riding in the mid stroke due to too low of air pressure and lsc, which is a harsher part of the compression stroke in an air spring.

LSC open leads to more supple ride, not harsh.
Mid stroke is the most important part of travel (and also where you ride most of the time if set up correctly). Too low air pressure doesn't put you in mid stroke, it keeps you out of it.

 

I only just got mine so it's not dialled yet, also it's on a ebike.

220lb rider
170mm 29'er 44mm offset

105psi
1 token

Damper (from closed)

LSR - 4
HSR - 3
LSC - 8
HSC - 5

In my opinion it sounds like you are riding in the mid/end of the travel and hence the harshness, more air, less spacers

 

our fork settings are pretty much the same in terms of clickers and psi. same fork specs too. i believe im running 2 tokens.

im tuning for 190# rider weight and you are 220#. surprised our settings are similar despite the 30# difference. maybe im running a firm setup and ur running a really soft setup.

 

I weigh 220-230 and typically run one extra token than what the fork came with. Then I set the high and low speed compression to the recommended settings. I also put rebound in the middle, disregarding the recommended setting. Then adjust air pressure until I get it close. Ride for about 2-3 times, then play with the other settings. At high altitudes, I drop 1lb of pressure. Big mistakes I’ve made - not adding a volume reducer to accommodate for my weight and trying to get full travel when the majority of my trails doesn’t involve super aggressive riding.


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38 Grip 2 160mm. Rider weight 215 lbs.

I've had a few rides so far with two dedicated to setup.

Currently running:
114 psi
2 spacers
LSR 5
HSR 4
LSC 10
HSC 5

Basically Fox's recommended settings with a bit faster rebound. The fork seems really sensitive to small pressure changes. 112 psi gave noticeably more traction and comfort but not supportive enough and a bit harder to lift the front up. I tried a few different compression options at 112, 114, and 116 psi trying to find the right balance between traction and liveliness. I might try 112 psi again with way more compression than I've tested so far and see what that does.

 

Because I weigh about 225 I always add at least one spacer so I can run a lower pressure. I don’t kid myself. I’m not hucking or crushing double black so one spacer is usually enough. I then adjust the settings more or less for a 160-180lb rider per Fox’s setup chart. I then adjust the air pressure so I’m getting all but 20mm travel for my riding style. Then I adjust compression and finally rebound.

Everyone knows the suspension companies use beta testing. There is no reason for them not to recommend spacer usage and other settings according to weight and riding style other than I might get butt hurt by them telling me I’m not a highly skilled rider. They can use generic terms like Trail and Race. That being said if someone is riding a 38 they are probably riding chunk so that so be assumed by Fox.


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i just got my 29er fox38 170mm 44mm offset fork. 190# rider weight, but i have 105psi and i believe 2 tokens(i'll have to check)

hsr 3
lsr 4
hsc 5
lsc 8

did my second ride yesterday and it was great! still dialing it in

 

Are your numbers from OPEN?

 

I can't believe some of the pressures I see on here.

I'm 175-177lb in gym clothes, and I run 100-105psi on my S4 Enduro. And that's down from the 108-110psi I was originally running in search of some better traction/compliance. I've tried less and found it was way too difficult to lift the front end out of situations I needed to, and would dive too much on corner setup, even with the compression almost full-in. I don't get how guys 30+lbs heavier than me are getting away with the same pressure or less.

 

Yeah, even running just a few psi less than recommended made the front too hard to lift/unsupportive. I'm even running a couple clicks faster rebound than recommended. I'm still trying to find the ideal balance between traction and support.

What are your damper settings like?

 

Not that my settings matter because it’s really just preference but guess I’ll chime in. Only had it 4 rides but think it’s just about there if not there.

170lbs rider geared up

170mm
90psi
1 token but need to test with 0
13 clicks out LSC
6 clicks out HSC
7 clicks out LSR
5 clicks out HSR

still need to test 4 out HSR with 8 out LSR and see if that’s better or worse than where it’s at but currently it rides very good and I’m actually surprised how close fox was to where I’ve ended up.

to original op post I think you may be running way too little psi and using tokens to prevent bottom out which is leaving you in the lower harsher part of the suspension stroke. Don’t run the air spring rate super low trying to achieve travel because your not aggressive enough this just leaves you with an unresponsive packed up dead feeling fork. Get the spring rate right and then use tokens as needed. If you don’t bottom out then all well that’s just how it is don’t expect a baja truck to bottom out on a formula 1 track.

 

I have the same experience as OP.

Specialized Enduro S3 2021, Fox 38 Grip2 170mm
Around 90Kg (198lbs) rider geared up.

FOX recommendation puts me at 102psi. With the recommended settings for my weight the fork was extremely harsh and almost unridable...
I had to run 80/81psi (with the stock 2 tokens installed) to get 20% SAG!. Also I noticed that a slight variation in PSI would make a huge diference. 84 PSI would get me around 15% SAG.
Right now I'm running:

1 token, 84 PSI (around 18% SAG).
All settings from fully closed.
4 HSC
8 LSC
6 HSR
6 LSR

It still needs a lot of tune though... If anyone has any tips on what to try would be awesome.

 

might be time to pull it apart and make sure your negative chamber isn't full of grease. I know mine isn't because I rebuilt mine before even riding it. At 170lbs and 90psi and that puts me at 34mm sag in an aggressive position and about 30mm neutral over the bike so something is definitely not adding up. I'm using a digital pump so there is no chance of old analog gauge wear (which does happen I've had pumps be off more than 10psi after a year of use).

And just so we're all clear on how to inflate its pump up to x psi, leave pump attached and cycle fork to equalize chambers, check psi and repeat until psi is at desired value after cycling, disconnect pump.

 

Ok two things. Just because it's new doesn't mean it was assembled right, there are multiple cases of both RS and Fox having excessive grease in the negative chamber. At around 6:40 you can get an idea of how it should be assembled vs what how they're assembled in a production line

second thing your setting your air wrong. If I'm understanding you correctly you are setting it let's just say for example you want 90psi so you set it 90psi and then re check and find it at 85psi so you think your losing 5 psi when you disconnect the pump so you set it to 95 to compensate. This is incorrect and you are actually setting your fork to 95. The air your losing is the air in the pump and hose, the Schrader valve on your fork is closed before the hose o ring is unsealed from the schrader stem. The lower psi your getting when re connecting is the air from your fork re filling the hose and pump.

 

Indeed. I would expect a 1500€ fork to be assembled properly on such a simple task as applying grease.
Understood (see reply above). Something like that, difference isn't as large as 5 psi. 1/2PSI max.

Thanks for the advices guys, I'll certainly have someone service it ASAP.

 

Well, "quick" air spring service and as expected there was way too much grease... I'm now running:

96 PSI - 87/88Kg fully geared (loosing weight)
1 token.
around 18% SAG
settings from fully closed:
HSC 6
LSC 10
HSR 3
LSR 4

Still needs tuning, this was basically setup in 2 runs of a loop but it already feels a massive improvement over before.

Some pictures:

Positive chamber:

Negative Chamber:

There was even more grease inside the air sleeve.

So, again, thx for the great tips about the negative air chamber and the terrible QC at FOX!!!

 

Can having to grease in the negative chamber cause a knocking sound on larger impacts? I am chasing rattles and knocks on my 2021 Ransom 920. Most of the rattles were from cables in the downtube not being wrapped, but I have knocking that I can't quite put my finger on. I suspect it might be from the headset. I don't think it is seated correctly and it's also a cheap headset. Am planning on changing tomorrow.

 

I'm don't think so. At least in my case there was no knocking just poor performance. I have a Scott Genius 2018 and had terrible rattle with the cables after a while that need to be sorted out. If you suspect it's the headset try and retighten it. Doesn't hurt to try.

 

Can anyone comment on how to use a shaft clamp? I'm considering buying one to service my 38. I'm comfortable with servicing normal air springs but haven't done any work requiring a shaft clamp yet. The Fox 38 requires the lower bolt be removed from the shaft though. I guess my concerns are not clamping it tight enough and scratching the shaft when it twist or over clamping (or is that not possible?).

 

So the shaft clamps are made from a softer material than the shaft so it shouldn’t scratch. I actually prefer the rockshox ones because they are made from brass which is non marring (just like the non marring hammers and punches). The bolt isn’t on very tight so once you heat it it should not take much torque, if the shaft spins and you feel you didn’t put much leverage on then tighten the vice a little at a time and eventually it’ll hold.

 

So the shaft clamps are made from a softer material than the shaft so it shouldn't scratch. I actually prefer the rockshox ones because they are made from brass which is non marring (just like the non marring hammers and punches). The bolt isn't on very tight so once you heat it it should not take much torque, if the shaft spins and you feel you didn't put much leverage on then tighten the vice a little at a time and eventually it'll hold.

This is good advice, I also recommend using good clamps, and clean both surfaces with iso to ensure decent grip.

you can crush or slip on the shaft for sure, and I always try to clamp in a zone that is less likely to be sliding through a seal or anything like that.

 

Also clamp a couple inches away from the foot stud (I think that's what it's called).

 

Thanks. I'm going to pull the air spring and see how over greased it is. The fork has been hard to equalize and sucking down a bit when releasing pressure.

 

I'm getting the same issue with my new 38. Am upgrading the damper from a Fit to the Grip 2, and when I was letting the air out the fork it sucked up almost completely. Rather then spend the money on the Fox clamp, a friend made me one on his 3D printer. Hope it works. This is my first Fox fork and am kind of bummed that this happened. I know there has to be way to much grease in the air can as I cleaned about a table spoon worth from the top of the air piston that's visible from top.

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I haven't got my shaft clamp yet but I did mess with the rebound a bit more. I can't find the posts but a couple people mentioned running the HSR pretty slow then opening up the LSR as necessary. I also saw this in Seb Stott's video comparing the 38 to the Zeb. Basically the idea is run the HSR around what Fox recommends for your weight or slower to keep the fork from over extending when unweighted then speed the LSR up so it can flutter over the chattery stuff and make the front easy to lift. This worked like a charm. I went from 5 LSR and 4 HSR to 7 LSR and 2 HSR (Fox recommended 3L 2H). This brought some life into the fork, increased traction and kept the front wheel from bouncing as the front wheel skips through rock gardens. Definitely give this a shot sometime.

 

Thanks for this info. I found Seb's video on Youtube and his approach seems to be working for me as well. He clearly knows what he is talking about and even has dyno numbers to back up what he was feeling in the 38 and Zeb.

2021 38 Grip 2 170mm
200 lbs
100 psi
1 token
20% sag
HSR 2
LSR 10
HSC 5
LSC 11

With much slower HSR (I had it at 5) and much faster LSR (had it at 7) the fork feels so much more plush and smooth. It soaks up small chatter and carries speed well. I tried going out to 12 on LSR and it started to get chattery and I could feel it in my hands. I might split the difference at 11 clicks. My only complaint with this set up now is that it is a bit soft and slow when pushing into jumps but I am hoping 1 more faster lsr fixes that. Needs more testing.

 

Yup. If you're running a higher pressure (if you're a bigger dude) and you don't have the HSR really slow, the fork will bounce you off your line. Although I wouldn't go more than 2 clicks from fully closed. 1 click or fully closed HSR messed with the compression.

 

Ok interesting, I didn't try it below 2 on the HSR. I know Seb said he ran 1 click out so I plan on trying it just for the heck of it but it felt good where is.

 

Finally have it dialed…

took me a couple of months and several days at the bike park. 5’10”, 165 lbs kitted, on Soecialized Enduro with Ohlins coil (TTX 457 lb spring). Running two tokens, 75 psi to get the plush sag. LSR 8 clicks, HSR 7 clicks. LSC 11 clicks, HSC 7 clicks (all clicks from fully closed/damped)

I had found the fork a bit harsh and bucking me in the chunder using the standard settings for my weight. Going to the plush sag, and most importantly kicking up the rebound speed to compensate for the lower pressure really helped. The Fox guide should give rebound settings based on pressure in my opinion. Finally dialing down the damping on the HSC to almost fully open, and just a little less damping on LSC keeps the fork incredibly supportive when it needs to be, and lets me plow through the chunder without getting bucked. I’m a solid fan of the 38 now!

 

most importantly kicking up the rebound speed to compensate for the lower pressure really helped. The Fox guide should give rebound settings based on pressure in my opinion.

Yeah the low speed rebound recommendations were too slow even with me running more than the recommend pressure. I'm 207 lbs and running 115 psi (lost a bit if weight but kept pressure the same so far). Once I opened up the rebound to 7 clicks LSR and 3 HSR if feels so much better. It was unbelievably composed in the rock garden I use for testing.

My recommendation for rebound tuning would be set your HSR to whatever Fox recommends then run your LSR as fast as you can get away with, then go back and see if you can open HSR up any.

 

yeah I'm the same as you SDMiles, this has been by far the trickiest fork I've had to set up but when It's right, it's awesome!

Everyone at the shop, from intermediates to pro level have all mentioned they are using between 5-10psi less than the suggested starting pressure for their weight. I tend to agree with this finding.

The Goldilocks spring rate is a small window though, I'd say there is maybe 3psi between a divey midstroke jackhammer and a oversprung jackhammer. The damping adjusters are effective and definately in a useable range. This is the first fox fork in a long time where I've used some actual HSC instead of just opening it fully.

Great chassis too, I'm using one on my ebike, plus my 100kg of weight, coming from the previous gen 36, was a huge increase in stiffness and line holding ability.

 

Wow a lot of guys running their forks with quick HSR. I found the fork bounced me around too much (got scary at one point) unless I had the HSR about 3 from closed.

 

That would agree with what Fox recommends if you are running around 100 psi

 

im still trying to tune my fox38 as well. fox 38 170mm. im about 185-190 geared up, running 100psi.
all from closed:
lsc: 8
lsr: 8
hsc: 5
hsr:5

fox recommendations:
lsc: 10
lsr: 4 (felt realllllly slow)
hsc: 5
hsr: 3

yeti recommendations:
lsc: 10-12
lsr: 7-9
hsc: 5
hsr: 7

 

Might try a bit more pressure. Rebound seems plenty fast.

I sped my HSR up one click to 3 btw.

 

I did think about doing that since I heard small changes of 2 or 3 psi make a big difference in this fork. I feel like at least now I have a good base setting. Too much HSR when I first adjusted it and the fork felt way way too firm even at 20% "plush" sag.