I think some of the most popular trails in our area have become slower as the dirt get eroded and the rocks "get bigger".

 

I considered that, but these are long segments, on well established trails that haven't "evolved" in decades. And with all the talk of "people dumbing down trails", shouldn't they be getting faster?


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(a) it is trivial for me to write any gps track story I want and upload that fantasy

(b) I can also edit anyones files and make them a hero

(c) real world inaccuracies abound

(d) too many ebike or gas powered false efforts

(e) not worth my time trying to keep up, go for KOM...etc as it is just not reliable whatsoever

but I do know what I do on my own rides and I do not post false tracks for myself ever

however, I have seen multiple times on some segments...impossible numbers, so
it is a hot mess

 

Maybe it’s just the trails you’re riding. Fast people here are still fast and leaderboards still show lots of activity.

 

Well, I'm not riding them anymore because I don't live there anymore, but these segments see hundreds/thousands of users a year, and it's in an area where national level pros live/train. I'm not far away though. Might go up and ride some of them to see if anything has changed. I doubt they've changed though given the soil conditions and terrain. They saw little to no change in the 30 years I lived there and rode them.

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They are in my neighborhood. The few kom's I still hold are only there because no one fast has bothered to go after them yet.

So I guess what I'm saying is that some segments are hotly contested and others aren't.

 

I'm not going to be a KOM - though for some reason I have a couple of segments where I'm the only one who has ever done it, so it's pretty invalid. I do look at MY times, as that's entertaining/interesting. Mostly, it's to see if I've slowed down or to see if different gear makes much of a difference. I'm 71 and on rare occasions I'll eke out a PR. Also, I really only track climb times. There are no times that have survived going from a 26 to a 27.5, and there are only a few that survived going from a 27.5 to a 29 in my case.

 

I always contest Strava times. If I end up in 100th place, I contest the other 99 so I can be 1st!

Modern problems require modern solutions.

 

I always contest Strava times. If I end up in 100th place, I contest the other 99 so I can be 1st!

Modern problems require modern solutions.

Yep....someone keeps doing that to me because of the times I post on an eBike...they seem to not have an eBike classification...I'm not competing with anyone....just posting my ride from my Garmin...

 

I think people are less interested in KOM-chasing. I haven't used Strava much since a couple seasons ago, and I got bored with chasing segments before that. I just looked up a few top-10s I got a few years ago. One I lost due to a local enduro race and a couple others I still have. For one of those top-10s I still have, my time is the most recent on the top-10 list and almost all the other times are from 2-4 years prior. Similar deal with another road sprint segment near me - many of the top 10 times are older than mine and are from 2016-2020.

At first I wondered if this was just due to the local flow trail getting more gravelly and its berms flattening out as it ages, but I looked up a 60-year old trail and some road segments and they all look pretty similar with top times going back several years. All these segments are in the range of 7k-10k total attempts.

I think this is more a reflection of people getting bored of Strava than it is riders getting slower. Some of the fastest people around here that I've met don't use it.

 

I don't know about Strava's user data or anything but I do know after they limited access for free users that I pay less attention to Strava. A lot of stuff is hidden now so maybe people moved to other services or just don't record their rides as often.

 

Do people just not care about KOM's and leader boards anymore?

Yes. That's me.

 

Some of our more actively managed trails are on at least thier 1st major change or re-route (maybe second) if you go back 10 years. Segment times that stood 10 years back just arent comparable any more but the segment hasn't deviated enough from the overall route to invalidate the prior attempts.

I can recall 1 trail/segment that was a fast fall line run that was a lot smoother a long time back. Erosion kept degrading the trail until it go so chonky you needed to step up to an enduro rig to blast it like before. Then the trail go so bad, it had to get rerouted to fix all those years of neglect. Much more fun now but a 10/10ths run is probably 20% longer/slower.

 

I certainly don't pay attention to leaderboards anymore now that they're paywalled. I was never in top 10 territory for the vast majority of stuff I've ridden (though I do have a couple decade-old KOMs I like to laugh about). Back when I did pay attention to them, I saw a lot of garbage data uploaded. Some intentional attempts to cheat, but a lot of "oops, I forgot to turn off recording for the drive home or the shuttle uphill or whatever". Some big local climbs are on gravel roads open to vehicle traffic, so the gravel riders who might care about the KOMs on those segments have to contend with the mtb shuttle riders leaving their recording on while they drive to the top. I imagine they got tired of that pretty quickly.

I've also noticed that of the people I follow on Strava, they're uploading stuff there less often. They're still riding for sure, but they don't put so much up there. The fastest guy I follow there has only ever uploaded especially notable rides. So even though he rides multiple days per week, he might only put a ride on strava a couple times a month. Well, maybe he uploads all of it, but keeps most private and only occasionally makes his rides viewable to anyone else. still, that would keep his private rides off of any leaderboards afaik.

 

I dropped my premium and went free use about a year ago. The all-time stats are still there, but the age, year, weight, etc. are all pay-only.

I also keep most of my rides private, so only "friends" see them, but if there's a KOM to be had, I'll make it public because private rides don't show on leader boards.

Maybe that's it? Most people keeping their rides private and they don't show up on the leader boards?

 

I noticed that the local routes where people have KOMs from 5 years ago are a lot more crowded now. So not as easy to keep up race pace when someone has a baby in a stroller on the trail.

 

That could be a big factor. Population has increased significantly, so it's definitely harder to get a clean run, but there's still not many people out at 6:00am in the summer.

 

I use strava to track mileage and to check on my own progress. It is also interesting to compare my best time to the KOM, and use the difference to determine where I have a lot of room to improve and where I am reaching the point of diminishing returns.

 

In my experience and area, trails change from year to year. The KOM from 10 years ago is on a completely different trail even though it's still the 'same' trail. Therefore, I find more value in the times from the current year and/or riding season.

Having said this, I've switched to only private when using Strava and only use it to evaluate changes/upgrades to my bikes or for a new bike. I find my rides have become much more enjoyable versus going for the top ten.

I also use Strava to see what's open and what's new trail wise.

 

Reasons times are slower in my area

1. Erosion has lead to many trails becoming significantly rougher.
2. Trails have been rerouted and the segment ridden now is simply longer than it used to be.
3. Enduro racing and social media has made XC less attractive to more downhill oriented riding. Many people are on longer travel bikes with more aggressive tires, and don't care about being fast uphill or around full length of a trail. On race weekends where both XC and Enduro are held at the same event, it's not uncommon for enduro to have multiples more racers. XC age category racing is almost pointless now with so few people entering. Getting a podium and trophy for being in the top three when only three people entered isn't very rewarding.

Reasons why some times are getting faster

1. Bike geo, suspension, and tires have improved.
2. Kids are starting much younger now. In some places, mountain bike racing is taking the place of more traditional sports.
3. Flow is a thing now. Some trails used to have tight 180 degree turns, tight gaps through trees, and the trails were specifically routed to go through technical features. These are being replaced with wide smooth trails and berms.
4. There are many more places to train and ride now than there used to be.
5. Training knowledge has improved. People who have KOMs on big trail systems typically have quality training and structure.

 

I stopped chasing times on single track after a head on crash. Not worth the risk.

On trails that are open with good sight lines I'll still rip but often come across someone going the other way or hikers that kills the time. Trails are more busy it seems.

Other trails in our area have been rerouted adding length with more turns, slowing down the segment.

 

here in the Vermont rain forest, we've got years-old KOM's on segments that were set the last time the segment was completely dry. Also, a lot of segments have KOM's that were set by current and former Olympic athletes, so on older routes those times stick around, especially if they're from a dry summer. On newer trails (machine built, with "flow" downhill sections) the times move around a lot, but are settling down as neo-pros pin down the fastest DH times, and E-bikers pin down the climbs.

Also as others have said, last year's trail might not be this year's trail.

I've noticed that a lot of "features" have been added to trails; log rolls, big rock drops, and other stuff that me and my fragile collarbone avoid. I do see occasional groups or individual riders doing little features and sections over and over again.

Personally I'm in no danger of setting any KOM's, but I'm happy enough if I end up in my preferred percentage range, so I still look.

 

I basically strava every ride, because why not, but I'm not trying to go fast on every ride. I've had to make my account more private recently due to not always riding on "legal" trails and there is a bunch of drama in the Asheville region currently on the subject. I have had a productive year so far KOM wise, but I can only compete on DH segments, I'm middle of the road on most things flat or uphill. It keeps it fun for me and helps me track my personal fitness progression.

I normally care about times specific to that year, but if someone gets on the overall leaderboard with times from 3+ years ago then you know they put down a heater.

 

IDK, some of these are gonna be hard to beat!

 

Many of the trails here, it's harder to be competitive because of increased foot traffic, changes to the trail by forest staff, or natural erosion. One segment I'm riding a lot now has features that didn't exist before that slow riders down pretty considerably, it's difficult to keep up with a time from years ago when features were absent or smaller.

One of the bridges they built on a trail here I swear was specifically designed so bikes couldn't easily get up on it, the added stairs just before it and the gap is far enough apart that it makes it really challenging to pedal up onto unless you have trials skills. This covers a portion of the trail you used to be able to just blast through. Even if you could get onto it, it would be much slower.

...there is a bunch of drama in the Asheville region currently on the subject.

Unfollowing those FB groups and unsubscribing from SORBAs bullshit has made my quality of life a lot better. There was a time staying on top of stuff mattered, now it doesn't and it's just drama that I don't need. Seeing everyone pissing on each other was enough for me to call it quits with those groups, I'd suggest you do the same. It's embarrassing the way some of those people treat others.

I should've learned this lesson after the Black meeting and subsequent drama, but I guess I'm a slow learner.

 

Unfollowing those FB groups and unsubscribing from SORBAs bullshit has made my quality of life a lot better. There was a time staying on top of stuff mattered, now it doesn't and it's just drama that I don't need. Seeing everyone pissing on each other was enough for me to call it quits with those groups, I'd suggest you do the same. It's embarrassing the way some of those people treat others.

Kind of off topic, maybe related to something posted by somebody on my ignore list? anyhow, I've done the same - unsubscribed from most "trail advocacy" groups and regional MTB groups on FB. I check in on their pages occasionally, and it just verifies that it was the right decision.

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I honestly just use Strava to keep track of my own relative effort, ride, and equipment data. I like to see where I am at in relation to my prior rides and whether I am trending in one direction or another. If I have a particularly hot run, I see where I am on the leader board, but with a boulder of salt. Too many wack uploads for me to take anything very seriously. And then there are those moments when I am in the top 10 on a segment only for that segment to disappear forever. So really, I like to see what my friends are doing on the segments.

 

As a Strava user, I only care about tracking my miles.

I also find Strava not even close to accurate enough to track times. Just comparing stats with my buddies that I ride with, will yield different results in distance and top speeds while on the same ride. For any KOM chasers, good luck competing against eBikers.

 

Many reasons, most already mentioned. Popularity of trail, trail congestion, erosion and GPS/segment errors. I've also gotten KOMs simply due to the nature of GPS in combination with trail layout and segment definition on Strava. For example, two trails parallel each other, but one has more elevation or features. Another is if the trail is very densely packed or switchbacky and you "short" cut sections, but it still counts overall. Sometimes the start/stops of segments create "opportunity" for better times, etc...

I guess it depends on whether the segment is frequently hit (hundreds or thousands deep board) or sub-hundreds or if most of the times are years old.

 

Yes, Strava times are still contested around these parts. My wife has a few QOMs. She's got one follower who has always "competed" with her. If my wife gets a QOM, then this follower goes out and sessions the section until she takes the QOM from my wife. We thought it was entertaining until it wasn't. The Strava-stalker has some mental issues and started posting religious rants with her QOMs. I got nothing against religion but Strava isn't the place for radical (or any) evangelists. Then finally, the Strava-stalker was caught riding an e-bike on those QOM segments (on trails where e-bikes are prohibited). Very weird.

I like Strava for the social aspect of staying in touch with friends and comparing my current rides to my past rides. I am definitely not fond of Strava-stalkers--the QOM Stalker could have just gone and ridden with my wife instead of faking it....but then she wouldn't have her QOM's and St. Thomas Aquinas would never show up in anyone's Strava feed.

Side note: Heat maps. If you use Strava be mindful of the heatmaps. BLM, Park Rangers, and local mtb associations often have access to Strava's heat maps---they know when you're riding an illegal trail (i.e. closed trail, private property, etc.) if you record your ride while trespassing. Years ago, the heat maps were used against our local mtb club when trying to increase legal trail access.

 

Yes, Strava times are still contested around these parts. My wife has a few QOMs. She's got one follower who has always "competed" with her. If my wife gets a QOM, then this follower goes out and sessions the section until she takes the QOM from my wife. We thought it was entertaining until it wasn't. The Strava-stalker has some mental issues and started posting religious rants with her QOMs. I got nothing against religion but Strava isn't the place for radical (or any) evangelists. Then finally, the Strava-stalker was caught riding an e-bike on those QOM segments (on trails where e-bikes are prohibited). Very weird.

I like Strava for the social aspect of staying in touch with friends and comparing my current rides to my past rides. I am definitely not fond of Strava-stalkers--the QOM Stalker could have just gone and ridden with my wife instead of faking it....but then she wouldn't have her QOM's and St. Thomas Aquinas would never show up in anyone's Strava feed.

Side note: Heat maps. If you use Strava be mindful of the heatmaps. BLM, Park Rangers, and local mtb associations often have access to Strava's heat maps---they know when you're riding an illegal trail (i.e. closed trail, private property, etc.) if you record your ride while trespassing. Years ago, the heat maps were used against our local mtb club when trying to increase legal trail access.

Can they actually see which user based on the heatmap... I didn't think so, unless there were segments created and obviously your rides show up on the boards. I suspect it only gives them an indication someone is riding that area. Heatmaps, blessing or curse, have been invaluable to me for "finding" trails... even places I've ridden before. Sometimes TF doesn't show the trails, but STRAVA don't lie

 

I think it comes down to improvements in GPS technology. GPS is more accurate now with dual band and faster sampling on phones. In the past, you could get "lucky satellites" KOMs. I know I have an undeserved KOM on a shorter segment that has been featured for a about decade in our regional Enduro series. No way I did it faster than some of the names I see listed in the Top Ten.

 

nah, I know a lot of the fast dudes, and they're really that fast, not just GPS errors. My times weren't flukes either. Rode those segments all the time, and didn't have any fast times that were anything but a max effort. I do see super short segments that are far from accurate, but these aren't them.

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