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How many Volume spacers?

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#21 ·
hey ! i'm trying to set my Fox36 '18 170mm RC2. (performance elite), compression almost fully open. (maybe 1-2 clicks of HSC and LSC)
i weight about 76kg fully kitted.

recently i rode bike park, with some decent drops (~3m, ), with 60psi, no tokens, and there was still 1-2cm of not used travel (for 'emergency' situations).
does it make sense to use tokens?
i tried with one token now (however not in a bike park), i lowered pressure to 53psi. there is more SAG of course, but probably i won't be able to bottom out never ... ?

so these tokens are not to lower your pressure and make upper part of travel softer/plusher ?

maybe i don't use all travel also coz stiction etc.. HTa=64*, and there is some drag/resistance... my friend's 36 GRIP2 kashima is much more sensitive (with >70psi) in a parking lot.
 
#22 ·
razorjack said:
hey ! i'm trying to set my Fox36 '18 170mm RC2. (performance elite), compression almost fully open. (maybe 1-2 clicks of HSC and LSC)
i weight about 76kg fully kitted.

recently i rode bike park, with some decent drops (~3m, ), with 60psi, no tokens, and there was still 1-2cm of not used travel (for 'emergency' situations).
does it make sense to use tokens?
i tried with one token now (however not in a bike park), i lowered pressure to 53psi. there is more SAG of course, but probably i won't be able to bottom out never ... ?

so these tokens are not to lower your pressure and make upper part of travel softer/plusher ?

maybe i don't use all travel also coz stiction etc.. HTa=64*, and there is some drag/resistance... my friend's 36 GRIP2 kashima is much more sensitive (with >70psi) in a parking lot.
Click to expand...
Grip2 forks has evol na2. I bet you have previous spring type with smaller negative chamber. Thats why lower pressure is used.
 
#24 ·
The volume spacers only affect the last 15% or so of travel, if you aren't getting there then you may just have too much air pressure. I would suggest that you drop the air pressure down to 57, ride that for a while.

The volume reducers/spacers/compensators are there to increase the ramp at the end of your travel to prevent _harsh_bottoming out on the poor o-rings inside the forks and shocks. If you aren't getting full travel then drop the air pressure a bit and ride it. Conversely, add a token/block/clip _and_ drop the air pressure 6 psi to 54-ish and try that!

Sent from my SM-G390W using Tapatalk
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
I'm less than an expert but have messed around with my Grip2 fork a lot. First of all, you want the new air spring. Its a big deal imo. That or a Vorsprung Luftkappe...tho those are pretty progressive (the equivalent of adding a volume spacer just by adding the new spring). it'll be much nicer off the top and just function better overall than the old school one you have. It will impact the amount of travel and how its used as well and be softer off the top in a good way.

Spacers wise, my Grip2 fork is REALLY hard for me to bottom out so I yanked the default single spacer. I had to add in a bit more air as the spacer does change the progressive curve a little and you don't want to just blow through your travel by anymeans. You want that travel to slow your body down on impact and rebound appropriately...which is the goal, not to simply use all the travel. Some people get wrapped around "using all the travel", which is fine if you ride at an Enduro level on this enduro fork. However, if you are a mellow rider...you shouldn't be using all the travel. For a mellow rider to use it all, you'd have to drop your PSI to far...so you'd end up blowing through the first 1/3rd of travel, which is the plush part...then it'd ramp up at the end harshly because it would be blowing through the travel rather than slowing down the impact. This is how low PSI can actually lead to a rougher ride even though you think your using it all, and again the 1st 1/3rd is the comfy part. PUSH did a nice article on this exact topic. Also your PSI needs to support the spring enough to also support the amount of rebound you are running, it's all related from what I can tell.

That being said, removing a spacer is working for me. The fork dips into the travel deeper on a 3ft drop than it did. It doesn't hit the Kashima logo but 1/2in below it. Not sure that's good or not, tho I can fine tune a *little* with HSC without overduing the hydraulics. Or I'll simply add another 5 PSI. You don't want the fork to dive too deep unless the impact is big because it steepens up your HTA and makes things a bit less forgiving when things get at their worst. It should support you. Another option I might try next is to simply cut a volume spacer in half. That's probably the right setup for me and easy to do.
 
#26 ·
razorjack said:
so these tokens are not to lower your pressure and make upper part of travel softer/plusher ?
Click to expand...
No because you can lower your pressure without adding spacers. Find the pressure that feels best. Then if you're bottoming out hard add a spacer, if you don't get close to bottoming out remove a spacer. If you change spacer count you can then revisit what pressure works best.
 
#30 ·
razorjack said:
so it looks like putting more tokens and decreasing pressure (to achieve the same end - bottom out with the same force) will DECREASE support in a middle of a stroke ?
Click to expand...
Yes. Later I will upload how much 1 token effect midstroke, but its like 5% more in mid and few times more endstroke. So if you put 1 token, reduce pressure by 5%, you got similar initial, same mid and much more endstroke.
 
#32 ·
Wow that's great info. Thanks!

Currently with my 36 Grip 2, 170mm, 80psi and no tokens, I love everything except I'm bottoming a touch too easily. If I add any air at all to try to reduce the bottoming, the mid stroke gets too harsh. Same problem if I add HSC.

At the park tomorrow I'm going to try one token, and reducing pressure 5% to 76 psi
 
#35 ·
Been running my 36 160 with one or no tokens and felt it could be better. I’m heavier, aggressive rider so I was chasing mid stroke support. I finally decided to try 2 tokens. Well it made a difference. Initial feel was better grip, needed less HSC, while still supporting me. Even had to open up the rear shock as it felt harsh in comparison..
 
#36 ·
canuck_tacoma said:
Been running my 36 160 with one or no tokens and felt it could be better. I'm heavier, aggressive rider so I was chasing mid stroke support. I finally decided to try 2 tokens. Well it made a difference. Initial feel was better grip, needed less HSC, while still supporting me. Even had to open up the rear shock as it felt harsh in comparison..
Click to expand...
Did you reduce pressure?
 
#38 ·
Well, I went to 78 psi with one token at the park yesterday, based on that chart. Fork felt awesome all around although I still had a couple of bottom outs.

They weren't super harsh though, and seeing as how this is high speed with 30+ foot tables, I'm okay with using up the travel once in a while.

I think next time I'm at the park I'll put another token in and go down to 76 just to see how it feels. But that said I'm pretty stoked on how it feels right now, and I don't want to mess up the feel beginning and mid stroke when i'm on a slightly less aggressive trail ride.

That chart is really illuminating - thanks again!
 
#39 ·
svinyard said:
I'm less than an expert but have messed around with my Grip2 fork a lot. First of all, you want the new air spring. Its a big deal imo. That or a Vorsprung Luftkappe...tho those are pretty progressive (the equivalent of adding a volume spacer just by adding the new spring). it'll be much nicer off the top and just function better overall than the old school one you have. It will impact the amount of travel and how its used as well and be softer off the top in a good way.

Spacers wise, my Grip2 fork is REALLY hard for me to bottom out so I yanked the default single spacer. I had to add in a bit more air as the spacer does change the progressive curve a little and you don't want to just blow through your travel by anymeans. You want that travel to slow your body down on impact and rebound appropriately...which is the goal, not to simply use all the travel. Some people get wrapped around "using all the travel", which is fine if you ride at an Enduro level on this enduro fork. However, if you are a mellow rider...you shouldn't be using all the travel. For a mellow rider to use it all, you'd have to drop your PSI to far...so you'd end up blowing through the first 1/3rd of travel, which is the plush part...then it'd ramp up at the end harshly because it would be blowing through the travel rather than slowing down the impact. This is how low PSI can actually lead to a rougher ride even though you think your using it all, and again the 1st 1/3rd is the comfy part. PUSH did a nice article on this exact topic. Also your PSI needs to support the spring enough to also support the amount of rebound you are running, it's all related from what I can tell.

That being said, removing a spacer is working for me. The fork dips into the travel deeper on a 3ft drop than it did. It doesn't hit the Kashima logo but 1/2in below it. Not sure that's good or not, tho I can fine tune a little with HSC without overduing the hydraulics. Or I'll simply add another 5 PSI. You don't want the fork to dive too deep unless the impact is big because it steepens up your HTA and makes things a bit less forgiving when things get at their worst. It should support you. Another option I might try next is to simply cut a volume spacer in half. That's probably the right setup for me and easy to do.
Click to expand...
Out of interest what weight are you? And what psi you running with one spacer I'm struggling with thins fork and considering pulling token out, it's to harsh at moment over small rough stuff and I'm not getting any where near my full travel and I'm not far off 30% sag. Any help appreciated.
 
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