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I don't see a reason to go with anything less than full power any more.
100% Agree on this. But even with the DJI...the reasonable lighter weight is unachievable yet. I just rode the Cannondale Lab 471 @44.2lb with EP801. It's getting there but just too slow.
 
We've drawn similar conclusions in my group. From what I can tell, mid power is all fun an games until you have to go on a ride with a full power and see what you're missing.
Range is relative to motor power and battery capacity amongst the so many other variables. You are only missing an easier and/or faster shuttle up. That's about it.
 
All above is sound feedback - not all of it is of same weight so factor in what matters to you the most. The verdict is do not hesitate to buy...you will not regret it. The ebike takes the agony aspect (due to fitness, injury, time constraint, nearby trails, mood, etc) out of regular riding without robbing you from the exercise element. Rent or borrow a couple of different ones for a full 2-3 rides so you can get a sense of what all this feedback means. Here are some realizations of owning a lightweight mid power trail (130/150mm) for 3 years and about 1500mi of adventures. I've also demoed/borrowed so many others ebikes. Most of my regular riding is on 165/170 enduro.

Weight: No fun maneuvering above 44ish lb. Lifting and wrestling a pig does take its toll on you. Not an issue if you ride counting sheep, for recon cruise and control, or have a moto background. The weight also affects your breaking distance so consider more powerful break setups as some manufacturers skim on this. At battery 15% motor power output can vary and the range can drop without warning. Do not count on pedaling these bikes.

Noise: While some degree of humming is expected and tolerated, some motors rattle or clunk which takes away from the serenity of nature.

Service/reliability: I'd avoid DTC and buy from LBC that is willing to service it and has support from the manufacturer. Troubleshooting an ebike can be complicated and frustrating (the consumer is the beta tester for these things to some degree) and you can find yourself in long out-of-service stretches for repairs that are labor intensive and/or costly if out of warranty. Even under warranty, 2 to 3 weeks turn arounds are considered great!

Power/range: So many options affected by so many factors, make it fit your riding needs so that you don't wish for more power or experience range anxiety on a regular basis. Range extenders are there to help if you don't mind the extra 3.5lb of dead weight. They also change the handling of the bike...for the worst.

Maintenance: Forget washing the ebike to dodge corrosive damage. Dry wipe goes a long way. Double the check-ups vs what you do on a regular bike. The drivetrain will wear faster. Creaks come on more often.

Longevity/investment: Stick with a motor that is at most 1 years out of its release date...otherwise you risk to buy outdated tech. ebike models are on a 2-3 years cycles at most. Value drops tremendously. Store the battery while 20-80% to preserve longevity.

Travel: The longer the better. If a motor is taking care of the uphill, you want sufficient cush for the downhill.

Build specs: Carbon rims liven up these bikes from a farm pig to an agile boar. Opt for powerfull break setups. Enduro or DH casing or deal with flats. Drivetrain doesn't matter although I think Transmission might be better suited because it wants load in order to shift. Comfy saddle is a must.

Any time it's downhill I still prefer a normal bike. For any other adventure that requires pedaling...ebike it is. Zero regrets.
I believe it’s a great idea to have cushcore in the rear. I had a sidewall slash in a new Continental and had to ride 3.5 miles out of Reville Peak Ranch a lot of rock gardens. Pushing a 50+ lb E-bike wouldn’t have been fun.
 
I can ride 7 days per week if I want to since instead of needing rest days I can hop on the E and hit the trail.
Finally, someone admits they're an electric motorcycle. I guess there is a difference. One has the option of occasionally pedaling.

But then we hear some say their fitness stays the same because are mentally superior and can force themselves not to use magic button. Who to believe???
 
Finally, someone admits they're an electric motorcycle. I guess there is a difference. One has the option of occasionally pedaling.

But then we hear some say their fitness stays the same because are mentally superior and can force themselves not to use magic button. Who to believe???
Motor cyclists laugh at an eBike calling itself an electric motor cycle. Current MTBs are no where close to capable of actually riding on dirt bike tracks.

If you exclusively ride an eBike your fitness will be different than if you exclusively ride a bike. Your cardio will probably be fine. It's super easy for me to keep my heart rate near its max rate on a eBike however your muscular endurance/ ability to execute power moves will probably be reduced.

Your ability and desire to ride in and out of boost mode is completely up to you as an individual.

I have like 90% of my time in boost. Because I don't ride my eBike for fitness I ride my trainer (indoor eBrake), Hardtail, BMX racing, and lift weights. The eBike is used to descend more in a shorter amount of time. Or to be outside when the legs are fried.

But sure let's pretend it's black and white.
 
Except if you're young and have a family you can't afford one
Oh, I get it.
My lovely bride and I built our dream house in Utah 35 years ago. I had just gotten hired by an Air Line and I was also working a second job as a Navy reserve adversary instructor (so commuting to Miramar, Ca.). I'd come home from a Delta trip, swap luggage and jump on a flight to Miramar, or sometimes Fallon, Nv. At one point, I was telling my wife that I really was looking hard at a WW kayak paddle with carbon blades for $100! She said, "here's the budget. If you can find $100, buy that paddle!"
We sold the house, I bought the paddle, and we moved on.
Our motto at VF-126 was "life is hard. Then you die."
The advantage of an ebike for someone with a family still stands, I think. You may have to hold off to afford a nice mtb AND an ebike. Make it happen. Or don't. You might just have to wait until things line up.
 
Finally, someone admits they're an electric motorcycle. I guess there is a difference. One has the option of occasionally pedaling.

But then we hear some say their fitness stays the same because are mentally superior and can force themselves not to use magic button. Who to believe???
What an interesting interpretation.
 
I think I'm going to ride one of my e-mtbs today in honor of all of the hate. It looks like it has been 3 months since I've ridden any of them and that's too long. Perhaps it'll be accompanied with angering someone as well. Side benefit I suppose. I also gotta figure out how I skip the pedaling part though. I must be doing something wrong as pedaling is always required every time I used it ;) I'll probably also get a really good workout which will confuse so many people. On the bright side this thread as taught me that I can ignore any lack of skill I have without worry as I'll be on a 170/170 bike so I just need to point it downhill and hold on. Should be an interesting day now that I've learned all of these new things.
 
I think I'm going to ride one of my e-mtbs today in honor of all of the hate. It looks like it has been 3 months since I've ridden any of them and that's too long. Perhaps it'll be accompanied with angering someone as well. Side benefit I suppose. I also gotta figure out how I skip the pedaling part though. I must be doing something wrong as pedaling is always required every time I used it ;) I'll probably also get a really good workout which will confuse so many people. On the bright side this thread as taught me that I can ignore any lack of skill I have without worry as I'll be on a 170/170 bike so I just need to point it downhill and hold on. Should be an interesting day now that I've learned all of these new things.
Shush! You're saying the quiet part out loud!

😂
 
I find that for ebikes, the 145-150 rear travel is perfect. Some may prefer more (or less if smooth trails) but this travel range helps me go on any trail. Pivots may be a bit firmer than others like the Levo so they are not as plush in that travel range. I'm used to that though and I'm not living for super-technical downhills. I also ride a Top Fuel (120) and a Ripmo (145ish).
 
Range is relative to motor power and battery capacity amongst the so many other variables. You are only missing an easier and/or faster shuttle up. That's about it.
Correct. I have yet to encounter a mid power that can match the range of a full power, maybe a levo sl with the range extender in, but even then, they're not going as far as a regular levo, just beating some full powers with a 600wh battery.

The thing about mid powers is that companies are trying to build them light (that's the whole point, right?), but the motor itself isn't where the weight is, most of it is in the battery. So to shave weight, we go with a much smaller battery, and poof, there goes your range. Mids wouldn't be too much lighter than fullys if they had enough battery to keep up with the full powers in range alone.
 
But then we hear some say their fitness stays the same because are mentally superior and can force themselves not to use magic button. Who to believe???
And you're worried about other people's fitness because why?

I can ride my regular bike and not need a rest day also. I use a technique called Not Pedaling Very Hard. You can actually use it for any type of bicycle you own. Follow me for more bicycle tips!
 
There really fun. Granted mines a upgrade i terms of travel and components. Its been a learning experience getting used to the additional length and weight to some degree but the way they contribute to the handling is just something else. In addition to the eMTB i ride a 300w low power class I bike and its been a bit of a lifestyle changer in that most the time im riding it instead of driving or using transit. Also riding isnt my only form of regular exercise too so theres that..
 
back in 2020 hardcore amish only rider and care about wattage output and strava times. then one of my friend talked me into getting one to ride more / do more laps! i was skeptical since im afraid to loose all of my fitness that i built in the past 3 years of strictly analog riding so i did some experimenting. since my friend got deployed and he was out for 6 months i told him let me borrow your ebike while you where gone and if i break something ill replace it and he agreed.. here is how i experimented if riding an ebike truly kills your fitness even if you ride more.
before i commit my 20 days of riding on each mode i hopped on my trainer (zwift) and see how long can i hold 245- 250 watts and i did it for 14 mins and 42 sec and i was cooked ( avg of 252 watts and yeah i know rookie numbers ) here are my results on each mode ridden every 20 days

analog / amish bike - 252 avg 14 mins 42 sec
ebike eco - 227w / 11 mins 2 sec
ebike trail - 209 / 8 mins 48 sec
ebike boost only - 202w / 7 mins 14 sec

so you can def see its the modes that kills your fitness. boost will really kill that power lol!
my final conclusion is dont get spoiled on that boost mode and adjust the assist level or ride that ebike turned off for the 1st 15-20 mins of the ride or YOLO and get a trainer for fitness goals and ebike for fun, progression and more laps!
i have an ebike now and i really enjoy it with my friends!
 
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