[richulr]

Please forgive my ignorance. I'm new to threaded bottom brackets, and bike building in general. I've done one build and it was press fit, so I'm a little confused. With the threaded bottom brackets.

I bought a used frame (Knolly Fugitive 138) that the seller included a new bottom bracket and a used FSA crankset. That was cool of him. I noticed the chain ring needed to be replaced, though. I wanted to put Advent X on the bike, but the wheels are Microspline, so no go. I ended up buying a Deore 12 speed drivetrain group set to use instead of Advent X. It came with a crankset, so I figured I'd just use it since it's new. The Deore set was from a shop that said it for a Ibis Ripley AF. The guy said it was the same chain line as the Knolly, so I should be good.

I popped off the FSA cranks and noticed the Deore cranks just don't slide in and fit. The spindle is way thinner than the FSA cranks. Looks like the Deore bottom bracket is much smaller also. The Fugitive says it uses a 73mm bottom bracket shell. The Ripley Deore says it is a Shimano SM BB52. If I take out the FSA bottom bracket, will the BB52 be able to be used on this frame? I thought I read somewhere that BB52 can be used with 73mm shells. Will this work?

And will I need two different size bottom bracket tools for removal and installation? One for the large FSA and one for the smaller BB52? Or will something like this work on both? :

Amazon.com : BikeHand 3 in 1 Bicycle Bottom Bracket Removal Crank Tool - Compatible with Shimano Hollowtech II Truvativ GXP External BB : Sports & Outdoors

Amazon.com : BikeHand 3 in 1 Bicycle Bottom Bracket Removal Crank Tool - Compatible with Shimano Hollowtech II Truvativ GXP External BB : Sports & Outdoors

www.amazon.com

If these cranks can't be used, I guess I could use the FSA cranks and but a new chainring. That would suck because I just bought the Deore group set. Also It looks like I need some special tool to remove the chainring from the FSA cranks. Not sure why it's not just simple.

Thanks for any advice or guidance.

 

[Reaperactual]

Do you know which FSA crankset and BB you have? Posting some pics may help too.

For now I guess the FSA has a 30mm spindle diameter going off what you're describing, where as Shimano uses a 24mm spindle diameter.

R.e: Fitting Shimano cranks and BB.

Your BB will fit BSA 68 or 73mm shell widths.
Three BB spacers should be included with the BB52 bottom bracket. (As per Shimano recomended fitting instructions), just one of the 2.5mm spacer needs to be fitted on the driveside in order to fit your Deore crankset.

 

[richulr]

It looks like it says FSA Afterburner.

I'll try to attach pics.

 

[richulr]

I see the three spaces on the Deore bottom bracket. You say just use one on the drive side?


What about tje tool I posted. Will it work for both? Will I need two different tools? Are those cup-looking tools better?

 

[eri]

There's 3 numbers:
- crank spindle size
you can run 24mm spindles in dub or 30mm bottom brackets by using an adapter. Wheels Engineering sells one.
- shell width
you need to place spacers on crank spindle to ensure the crank is positioned correctly and held securely in the bb.
- chainline
often chainline is adjusted by getting the correct chainrings

I think 30mm cranks are better because they're generally lighter and they're the right size for your frame's bb shell. I had a bike came with a used fsa 30mm carbon crank but it broke after a few years. I replaced with a 30mm sram xx1 and its done fine. I'd personally rather have a 30mm crank than use an adapter but I dont' feel the need to be matchy matchy. Sell the shimano crank and use the fsa + new chainring. Or sell the fsa get the crank/chainring you want. Its really a buy once situation.

I think best advice is: CALL KNOLLY. Ask them what they recommend. They're supposed to provide fantastic service.

 

[J.B. Weld]

I see the three spaces on the Deore bottom bracket. You say just use one on the drive side?


What about tje tool I posted. Will it work for both? Will I need two different tools? Are those cup-looking tools better?

Shimano bb's and cranksets are pretty straightforward to install. The bb comes with 3 (2.5mm) spacers. All 3 are used with a 68mm bb shell. Your's is 73 mm so just 1 spacer is used under the drive side cup. Your chain line should be good with that setup.

Don't know about the tool, you'll have to check the specs.

 

[TwoTone]

Pretty straight forward, 30mm spindle cranks need 30mm BB.
Shimano 24mm spindle cranks need 24mm BB,
You're trying to fit a 24mm Spindle crank into a 30mm hole.

Pick a crank or BB, then pick the other item based on that choice.

 

[Ratt]

And remember the Drive side BB is reverse thread.

 

[Reaperactual]

What about tje tool I posted. Will it work for both? Will I need two different tools? Are those cup-looking tools better?

You'll need the tool you linked for the Shimano bb install. I have the crescent shaped spanner tool and it has worked on Hollowtech, RaceFace and a few other similar brands.

Not dealt with an FSA before. Have you tried putting the BB52 cup up against the FSA and see if it looks similar in diameter and (12?) spline pattern? I do see a lot online that specifically have FSA on them which would suggest it's different so I don't know for sure.

Get the one you linked and see first I guess? Alternatively you could try a strap wrench (used to remove oil filters on vehicle engines) if you can get hold of one?

The cup type bb removal tools will allow you to use a torque wrench to tighten to spec, with the spanner type tool you'd just have a good guess at tightening to around 40Nm.

 

[richulr]

I'll try the tool. I hope it works for both.

I'm still a little confused, if I remove the FSA bottom bracket, will the Deore botton bracket just screw in? Will it fit?

Thank you for all the replies.

 

[Reaperactual]

Yes, the BB52 and Deore crankset will fit. The only difference between the FSA and the Shimano bb/crankset is the 30/24mm spindle diameter measurements.

Maybe the outer cup diameter/spline pattern is different which is why the removal tools may not be the same.

Your bike's threaded 73mm BSA shell is compatible with any BSA mtb standard bottom bracket and crankset.

BSA/English thread (as previously mentioned) requires one cup to be tightened/loosened in the opposite direction to normal.

Also as mentioned, different spacer configurations are so the Shimano's overall fitted bb length ends up the same whether it's for a 68 or 73mm shell width.

 

[richulr]

Thank you for clearing that up

 

[Reaperactual]

No worries. It's better off to ask and confirm rather than being confused. It's your first experience with threaded bb's so it's understandable Pal. 😉

P.S. Your Shimano bottom bracket cups are left and right specific, they also have arrows to show the correct direction for tightening.

 

[mike_kelly]

First the width of the shell is the 68/73/83 measurement. For BSA threaded outboard bearings they are all the same. The cups thread in and some times there is a plastic tube that is supposed to keep dirt and water out and the length of that tube changes between 68/73/83 BB. As noted before the drive side cup is reverse thread so it does not tend to unscrew while pedaling.
You have to be careful with FSA because their 24mm spindle is not exactly the same as the Shimano standard. So some times you can force fit but they are not mix and match.
As noted above you can change the chainline by using spacers to move the crankset left and right as needed to a point.
Good Luck

 

[richulr]

I had to send back the tool I got from Amazon and get a different one. The second one worked on the both sizes. Got the one bottom bracket out , and the other installed. I hope the chain line is good. I guess I'll find out when I get the drivetrain installed. Thanks for all the help everyone.

 

[Reaperactual]

I hope the chain line is good. I guess I'll find out when I get the drivetrain installed.

F.y.i: If you fit the bottom bracket to spec with the 2.5mm driveside spacer then the chainline isn't a 'guess'. The chainline will literally be as stated on the Deore crankset spec details, from memory I believe it's 52mm.

The chainline will probably be fine, maybe not perfect but it's impossible to say as there's more to it.

Altering chainline is about setting/tweaking the front to match the rear and trying to achieve the 'optimum' chainring position/offset. All this stuff can be worked out prior to buying/fitting so you've got a good idea which crankset would be the best one for your needs.

 

[richulr]

I put one spacer on the driveside as suggested here. You're saying that's 52mm? I may have to adjust then. Knolly's website says optimal is 56.5mm.

 

[Reaperactual]

Yes, the Deore M5100-1 states a 52mm chainline and that what is it, providing the bb is fitted to instructions. It also states the crankset is suitable for both non Boost and Boost chainlines.

Maybe your new crankset isn't suitable as it has a spider mounted chainring without the option to be able to go further out, or maybe you'll just have accept a slightly compromised chainline. As mentioned using bb spacers will only get you so far before it effects safe installation and use.

All the info so far is mainly general info on threaded bb's (as per the title) and not Knolly specific. To me that 56.5 sounds wide or heading towards super Boost territory, I.d.k?

With the new info you've added I'd suggest maybe start a new thread on your specific build requirements so you get more accurate and relevant info for the best way to go regarding your chainline.