[Dirty Jay]

While talking to a LBS today (guy was trying to sell me a 06 Prophet5) and reading some bike reviews seems that SPV on the front isn't such a great thing. Was told that it can be a jarring ride- while reading a review on a Prophet with SPV Lefty- the reviewer said that the smaller bumps wouldn't activate the suspension and it caused the bike to react harsh on downhill sections :eekster: NOW the Lefty is hmmm...quirky (no sure what word to use here) I would think any SPV fork would be the same. This has me concerned because I'm looking at ordering an 07 Ibex Atlas Pro- and it's got a new for 07 SPV front fork (means no one will have any reviews or experiences with it).

What do you think about SPV on the front?

How long has Cannondale made the Lefty? Seems there are alot of mixed reviews, the positives about stiffness and no flex are great- quality parts and repair are not! I would still like to demo one though.

Overall I think the Prophet(5) would have met my needs but the components were no where near the specs of the Atlas (any of the build kits for that matter) and the Lefty seems like a gimmick. Both being SP frames- $1500 for the 06' Prophet5 or $1900 for the 07' Atlas Pro hmmm...of course both frames come with lifetime warranty :thumbsup: If the Cannondale had been a Prophet4 at that price- I might have considered it alot more.

 

[Jay04cobra]

SPV is something that needs to be tuned, if you jack 100psi so it rides rock hard then naturally small bumps won't open the fork. You can tune the SPV so it fits your weight and riding style.

As far as the lefty being a gimmick, or having trouble with service. I recommend hanging around on the boards for awhile. EVERY fork has trouble at one time or another. I've got 2 bikes with lefty's, and have owned 2 others in the past. I've only ever had a problem with 1 of them, sent it to C'dale on a Wednesday, and had it back the following Tuesday. That is pretty good IMO.

 

[mrpercussive]

say no to lefty:nono:

 

[CdaleTony]

say no to lefty:nono:

The reason being??

 

[mrpercussive]

reason being that Dirty Jay rides all mountain and i dont think the lefty would hole up to it... sorry for not explaining it, meant no offence to cannondale... i think it would make a nice xc fork though...

 

[CdaleTony]

Heh I think it's a prettty good "All mountain" Fork...I dont know what kind of DH 'big drop' Fork it would be...But it can take a whole lot of abuse...More than I think you'd realize..
But the thing is, he needs to get some rides in a few good bikes, and see what he likes....I mean his butt is on the bike, not ours
CDT:thumbsup:

 

[CdaleTony]

While talking to a LBS today (guy was trying to sell me a 06 Prophet5) and reading some bike reviews seems that SPV on the front isn't such a great thing. Was told that it can be a jarring ride- while reading a review on a Prophet with SPV Lefty- the reviewer said that the smaller bumps wouldn't activate the suspension and it caused the bike to react harsh on downhill sections :eekster: NOW the Lefty is hmmm...quirky (no sure what word to use here) I would think any SPV fork would be the same. This has me concerned because I'm looking at ordering an 07 Ibex Atlas Pro- and it's got a new for 07 SPV front fork (means no one will have any reviews or experiences with it).

What do you think about SPV on the front?

How long has Cannondale made the Lefty? Seems there are alot of mixed reviews, the positives about stiffness and no flex are great- quality parts and repair are not! I would still like to demo one though.

Overall I think the Prophet(5) would have met my needs but the components were no where near the specs of the Atlas (any of the build kits for that matter) and the Lefty seems like a gimmick. Both being SP frames- $1500 for the 06' Prophet5 or $1900 for the 07' Atlas Pro hmmm...of course both frames come with lifetime warranty :thumbsup: If the Cannondale had been a Prophet4 at that price- I might have considered it alot more.

I was thinking the 06's still came in the regular Prophet 1000 Prophet 2000 monikers, Prophet5, Prophet4 is 07's.....

In the 2007 line, you need a Prophet3 to get SPV, but my Entry level '05 P600 (140mm FFD Lefty) was upgraded to TPC and it does a reallll good job on the small stuff.
In fact I dialed it all the way up and forgot about it and last ride I decided to play with the setting, rolling it back all the other way, and man the difference was Stark on the little roots and rocks....

And let's not kid ourselves on the spec at a given price point. The Cdale isnt going to spec out as good at a given $ value, frankly because your paying an American to make your frame..I see all the 'arguments' that taiwan frame "isnt crap, and are really quite well made". Thats not the point, and I dont think anyone implies that offshore Mfr's are still 3rd world mfr's...To me a USA made quality frame is a feel good thing, and if it means I paid a couple hundo more, so be it !

CDT

 

[mrpercussive]

well, i guess everyone has their own opionion about them... I honestly wouldnt put one on an AM rig, but i might be able to get away with it though being only 115lbs... lol. I really like the whole idea on saving weight and stuff but i'd rather stick to 2 legs. Only having one leg changes a couple of things in bike handling. They might not be really noticeble in a parking lot but you might feel them on the rougher stuff. And to me, AM means do it all so i'd like to DH, XC, DJ, FR... Not too sure how the lefty would be... even when riding without hands on a lefty it wobbles a little bit...

As for the Atlas, the Manitou Minute is a proven platform. It handle a lot... But yeah tony, it's his butt on the bike... It's all personal preference in the end anyways...

 

[Dirty Jay]

I don't know many riders that sport a Lefty around here, most are either Trek or Giant fanboys.
I understand about the tuning but on a Lefty some of the reviews are totally blasting the user friendly-ness/DIY maintence issues. The Prophet may not have been 5 I just went off what the components specs were- if Cannondale has changed numbers on the different build kits I wouldn't really know. The Prophet is aimed at AM style riding, I too would think the Lefty would be unbalanced. With less parts you get less weight or a greater margin to "over-build" on some of the internals. The guy at the LBS was telling me about how the bearings and races allow for a much stronger design that causes the reduced flexiness on that fork.
He also went of to tell me he rode a SC Nomad later, hmmm...:nono: I thought it was funny.
That started us on a whole other topic of rear-suspension in which he told me VPP didn't live up to all the hype. He said with the SPV shock tech nowadays that SP was still a great choice, of course 4-bar/faux was kinda an industry standard but you add more weight and maintence issues trying to fix the "problems of an SP design". Basically VPP is for people that have enough money burning a hole in their pocket to waste it on buying another new bike just to say they have the newest cool bike on the block. The Giant saleman earlier that day really tried to sell me hard on the fully active Maestro VPP suspension, it did sound sweet- the Reign is a nice bike, but the price is just alittle too steep for me right now.
As of right now their are 4 bikes of my Demo list (order doesn't show preference, remember I haven't rode on any of these ) ; SC Heckler, Cannondale Prophet, Giant Reigh, and well the Ibex Atlas but very doubtful I'll get to demo one. Also considering the Trek Fuel, not sure though that TT is REALLY close to my boy Frank and the Bean brothers!

 

[mrpercussive]

The Heckler and the Reign are very nice bikes... And i'm pretty sure the Atlas will be to when it comes out... As for testing it, find someone who owns one and borrow it... thats how i tested the Asta and i loved it...

 

[MendonCycleSmith]

I'll weigh in here, and hopefully add some clarity.

As for serviceability of Leftys, ask the shop you are buying it from if they fix them in house. As in, tear the whole thing down, service the bearings, diagnose issues type service, not, wipe down the outside, and spray some TriFlow down it, service. If they say yes, you're all set, and buy one just because you have found a rare gem, and they need your support! Otherwise, they will hem, haw, say it's not super critical to seervice them, they can send them back for it, etc, etc etc. At this point, it's your decision. The Lefty is a kick A$$ fork, well worth the price of admission, but it does need service by someone who knows what they are doing, and a shop that cannot do it will send it to Cannondale who does. You can also send it to folks like me, who service them for alot of people, all over the place. My primary bonus point would be i'm cheaper than Cannondale, and faster, assuming you don't need oddball parts, I have all the commonly replaced stuff in stock.

As for SPV, it's a taste thing. I am in the category of non SPV support. I love the butteryness of a TPC Lefty, and the SPV takes that away. Even at the lightest settings, it still feels stiffer over bumps. Understand, it still eats the trail like crazy, just not with the same type of hunger= Any SPV Lefty can be down-graded to TPC, and I agree with Tony here, a lower end Cannondale would not be coming with SPV. So, methinks your sales person may be a bit confused! If it is a higher end one, and you want TPC, ask the shop if they'll switch it for you, with another fork, instant upgrade for the bike you leave behind, so why wouldn't they embrace the concept? Only you will know why what you diod is a good thing, assuming you want a super plush, slightly less uber efficient fork.

As for VPP, 4 bar, faux bar, etc, vs. SP, I agree, they just try to fix things that SPV on a SP does more eloquently. A SP bike allows for more use of body english, IMO, and I search out SP designs, rather than use a bunch of heavy bearings and pivots to make the ride more dead. Personal preference here, not bagging on anyones choice of ride. The important thing is having dirt in your teeth, and a smile on your face=

As for Lefty ride, and durability, first off, they have been around for almost 10 years, and have been evolving that whole time. Depending on what you are talking about they are in at least their 5th or 6th generation, and have many little details worked out, to the end users advantage. You will hear about bearing migration, now easily reset by you, in less time than it takes to air up your shocks, or tires. The Achilles heel in the system is the boot, inspect it regularly, and replace it if it ever has a tear ( around $10), but they are quite durable. They are super stiff, more so than many dual sliders out there, much plusher, and more serviceable, less expensively, than most other forks. Durablility is insane. I personally augered my carbon Max 140 into a wheel sized, front end sucking ditch, at around 20 mph. I left the bike, and came to rest at least 15 or 20 feet away. I ovalized the headtube of my Prophet, but the fork is fine, and functional to this day, with no replacement parts required. I rebuilt another fork, the only one that has ever had bent sliders in my experience, and the guy who did it spent a week in the hospital from the crash. The overlapping of inner and outer sliders, makes it super stiff, and strong. I think I've typed enough, if you still want to look elsewhere, for a product that makes you look more like the Jones's, go for it, but if you don't at least ride a Lefty for an hour or so in the woods before doing so, it would be a mistake! Cheers!

 

[rzozaya1969]

I don't know many riders that sport a Lefty around here, most are either Trek or Giant fanboys.
I understand about the tuning but on a Lefty some of the reviews are totally blasting the user friendly-ness/DIY maintence issues. The Prophet may not have been 5 I just went off what the components specs were- if Cannondale has changed numbers on the different build kits I wouldn't really know. The Prophet is aimed at AM style riding, I too would think the Lefty would be unbalanced. With less parts you get less weight or a greater margin to "over-build" on some of the internals. The guy at the LBS was telling me about how the bearings and races allow for a much stronger design that causes the reduced flexiness on that fork.
He also went of to tell me he rode a SC Nomad later, hmmm...:nono: I thought it was funny.
That started us on a whole other topic of rear-suspension in which he told me VPP didn't live up to all the hype. He said with the SPV shock tech nowadays that SP was still a great choice, of course 4-bar/faux was kinda an industry standard but you add more weight and maintence issues trying to fix the "problems of an SP design". Basically VPP is for people that have enough money burning a hole in their pocket to waste it on buying another new bike just to say they have the newest cool bike on the block. The Giant saleman earlier that day really tried to sell me hard on the fully active Maestro VPP suspension, it did sound sweet- the Reign is a nice bike, but the price is just alittle too steep for me right now.
As of right now their are 4 bikes of my Demo list (order doesn't show preference, remember I haven't rode on any of these ) ; SC Heckler, Cannondale Prophet, Giant Reigh, and well the Ibex Atlas but very doubtful I'll get to demo one. Also considering the Trek Fuel, not sure though that TT is REALLY close to my boy Frank and the Bean brothers!

Okay, I think I posted on the Lefty on another post, I agree with Mendon on the Lefty. I think that the Lefty will be stiffer than the Minute (I've read a lot of things on the Minute, but stiffness wasn't listed), while a Lefty is a very strong design.

Also, don't get stuck in the rear suspension design (SP vs VPP vs Maestro vs DW Link vs HL, etc. etc.). Each design has it's pro's and con's, no one is definitely better than another, and also, each bike implementation is different. Take a good bike with a SP (say, a Heckler vs a poor SP bike, like, say, a Huffy) and they will both ride very different, even though both might be SP.

I don't think that VPP is just to spend money. Some people like some rides, some anothers. I liked a Cannondale Jekyll that I had, but I rode a Prophet and didn't liked it. But that doesn't mean that a Prophet is a bad bike, just that it didn't adjust for my riding style. It can be the same for the Nomad and your friend. There are a lot of factors that come when test riding bikes. Was the suspension dialed in correctly? How about fit, was the stem/handlebar the right size? etc. etc. And yes, this stuff might have also played in my impression on the Prophet. I would like to test it again, but make sure everything was set up for my body and weight.

On the Trek Fuel bike, I wouldn't look into it if you're looking to go AM, since it's a XC rig, I doubt it will handle what you want the bike for. Trek has another bike for AM, but I forgot it's name.

 

[Dirty Jay]

Thanks Mendon...

You shed some light on the whole Lefty deal for me. The Prophet I was looking at didn't have the SPV on it, it had the basic lefty on it. I asked about the SPV Lefty because I had read an article about it, and generally just wanted to know because the Atlas is offering an SPV fork also. I'll go back to the shop and see if they service them in-house or not- it's a pretty big retailor so my guess is no. I was thinking the same thing about the Fuel- I'll be doing XC style stuff but I'm a heavier kinda guy and didn't think the Trek would stand up to the abuse. For a plush downhill ride and design that can handle my fat @ss I think SP will be just fine.

 

[MendonCycleSmith]

I was thinking the same thing about the Fuel- I'll be doing XC style stuff but I'm a heavier kinda guy and didn't think the Trek would stand up to the abuse. For a plush downhill ride and design that can handle my fat @ss I think SP will be just fine.

Glad to help! A Prophet would be a nice bike for what you're saying, bigger rider, XC, with a little down hill (not DH dude downhill) flavor, you'll love it! The FFD in the base line Lefty is fine, and easy to upgrade to TPC for a more buttery ride, when you have the spare $115 to fork over= Have fun shopping!

 

[txn]

So the salesman at the LBS rides a Nomad, and then tells you "Basically VPP is for people that have enough money burning a hole in their pocket to waste it on buying another new bike just to say they have the newest cool bike on the block."?

I'm confused. Or maybe he is.

 

[Dirty Jay]

Crazy isn't it...

Yeah I couldn't believe it when he said that either! I told him, "Man that's an expensive bike!" and he proceeded to tell me how he had bought into the VPP hype and purchased the Nomad but after riding a few months wasn't blown away by it's performance. He has worked in a bike shop for a few years it seems and rode every design he has sold. He said a good four-bar was fine and still liked alot of the SP bikes out on the market right now.
Of course you have to understand the man WAS trying to sell me a bike that he had in stock at the store, and he didn't carry SC. I had mentioned to him also about looking for something like the Heckler, that's why he pointed the Prophet out to me. So maybe he was just tryiing to down play the SC designs to try and get the sell still seems funny he choice to buy a brand that the store didn't carry:skep:

Like I said- if ya got the extra cash and just have to ride something new then go for it.