If it wasn’t making the noise before the drivetrain swap, it isn’t the spokes. Did you grease or antiseize the cassette splines? I would pull the cassette and make sure it is properly lubed and torqued. Also check drivetrain alignment, the derailler hangar, and the large cog limit.

 

If it wasn't making the noise before the drivetrain swap, it isn't the spokes. Did you grease or antiseize the cassette splines? I would pull the cassette and make sure it is properly lubed and torqued. Also check drivetrain alignment, the derailler hangar, and the large cog limit.

I only got the upgrade kit. So controller and rear d (plus an extra battery). No new cassette. Sorry for the misleading initial post.

 

I've had this issue with bladed spokes. Over time the minute rubbing rubs off the finish at the cross until it's metal on metal and then they start creaking. My easy fix was to cut up a tube into little squares and slip them between the crosses. Noise gone.

 

If it's a tinkling sound, your spokess may well be under tensioned...

 

A kind of grinding noise? When in the largest rear cog?

New chainring, old cassette and a new chain? Change the cassette, otherwise, the chain. Its likely one, or both, of those. Derailleur adjustment could be the cause too. Think they call it the B bolt, or A bolt ... adjusts the height of the top jockey wheel relative to the cassette (the largest cog is the one you adjust against).

 

Since he didn't replace the chain or cassette, I am leaning towards alignment or b tension. Assuming AXS is setup the same way as eagle, b tension should be set using the guide tool AT SAG!! Eagle is very sensitive to b tension adjustment and the druid has a fair amount of chain growth (about 10mm at sag) which will change the adjustment significantly from setting it with the suspension uncompressed.

 

Yes, it is obviously what I have described.

 

Thanks. I appreciate that each matter may be quite different, but in your case in particular, did you see this as more of an annoyance, or was it elevated to a wear issue that ought to be addressed?

 

To me it was an annoyance. I don't know if the spokes would wear at a dangerous rate.

 

Ah, that sound. You can put some spray lube on the spokes at the point they cross, that should stop the noise.

Not sure on the long term solution, I never minded it too much ... normally other sounds were more dominant - from worn chain or whatever else I never washed/maintained.

 

Sonofa b! Out riding today, it was LOUD climbing. But it’s NOT how I described it above. Forget about wind chimes. It’s a loud spoke scraping noise that occurs with every pedal stroke. Way-0 way-0 way-0. Indeed, as suggested by some above, it sounds to me like I am flexing the wheel under torque, and the spokes are rubbing against each other where they cross cross. I have never had this happen before with any wheelset. And I have owned probably 2 dozen. Then again, I have never had bladed spokes either.

I have an old school, epic ridge ride planned tomorrow. 7800 feet at the summit. I do not want to get stranded out in the middle of nowhere. This is smack dab in the middle of bear country (including grizz).

Any further thoughts? As suggested above, I thought about lubing the spokes where they cross cross. I had no lube with me on the ride today though, and had to high tail it to my GF’s post ride. At least I could have seen if this was the cause of all the racket.

$hit. Any further thoughts would be appreciated.

 

Just make sure the spokes are properly tensioned. Then get an old tube and cut it into little squares. Slip it between the crosses. Mine have been there for over a year.

 

Thanks. Did yours sound like I described? Way-o way-o way-o.

I searched YT to see if I could find something, or even a similar noise to post, and shockingly to me at least, there was SFA on there.

Never had this happen before with any bike or wheelset. Bizarre.

And thank you for the suggestions. I will try the tube thing tomorrow morning before I leave for the ride.

 

A drop of lube at the spoke crosses and where the nipple meets the rim and a quick test ride will either confirm or eliminate your suspicions. I really doubt it's the spokes but it would only take 5 minutes to find out one way or the other.

 

Oh-oh. What would you speculate as being the likely cause, if you don't mind me asking?

 

If you've built a wheel you have destressed the wheel after tensioning the spokes to dish and true it. Sounds like what's happening here. You put the wheel under lateral stress when riding and the spokes move.
I'd do a destress with the air out of the tire. Then check the tension. I'd guess the non-drive side spoke tension is low. Like 85kgf. I'd like it at 95 or more. If you raise it you'll likely will have to up the drive side to keep the correct dish. Don't go past the rim manufacturers limit by much.

This guy tells you how to do stuff without a tension gauge. How To Build Bicycle Wheels the Easy Way - YouTube

 

I don't think this will help, but, I have an XTR cassette which needs to be installed with a plastic washer ... forget the washer and it gets pretty loud under high loads. I think you have a different cassette ... point is, metal on metal under load can make noises.

So, it could be the spoke nipples creating noise under load, could also be that you need some grease in one place of another. When this kind of thing gets on my nerves I just spray lube until it stops.

 

I had a set of WAOi9 wheels with Cxray spokes a couple of years ago. After a year or a year and a half the spokes started causing noise. The spokes were tensioned properly, but it seemed the the spokes had wore from the rubbing. And were causing the noise.

Tried the drop of lube per spoke pair. The noise would go away for a short period of time.

If this is the case, you could just have your wheel rebuilt with non bladed spokes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I had a set of WAOi9 wheels with Cxray spokes a couple of years ago. After a year or a year and a half the spokes started causing noise. The spokes were tensioned properly, but it seemed the the spokes had wore from the rubbing. And were causing the noise.

Tried the drop of lube per spoke pair. The noise would go away for a short period of time.

If this is the case, you could just have your wheel rebuilt with non bladed spokes.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks man. I was thinking about rebuilding them anyway.

But not with with bladed spokes…???

As a silver lining, I was forced to use my recently neglected hardtail for a serious blast today (yes, a black trail, and no, my Honzo was not restricted by the manufacturer to blue square trails, and no, the chain stays did not break ?). I was reminded how much I love that bike, in all its glorious simplicity. Well, except for the Aggressor tire on the rear. It was really outgunned in the downhill terrain today. We Are Ones on that steed as well, but with silent non-bladed spokes ?

 

I’m going to drop my Druid off at my LBS, rear wheel included, tomorrow. I don’t really care at the moment how long it takes them to figure things out. I can’t wait to get back out there tomorrow with my Honzo.

I am so happy those bladed spokes (or something) caused a ruckus. Total blessing in disguise to remind me what I was missing with the Honzo. Hopefully I won’t wake up tomorrow bed ridden with pain from today 😝

PS - before I take it in, I will try lubing the criss cross points and nipples, or placing little pieces from a tube between the spokes, just to see if that’s what is going on. Thanks to everyone for all the help with this. I will report back with the diagnosis (and prognosis).

 

I have CX-rays on all my wheelsets tensioned to the hub/rim maximum and no noises. My guess is your problem lies elsewhere or your spokes are not tensioned properly.

Noise is NOT a feature bladed spokes come with.

 

Thanks! We shall see. Stay tuned…

PS - I am going to give the boys at We Are One a call today too. As an aside, I have not so much as touched any We Are One wheelset I own for any tweaking. They have all been problem free straight out of the box. The Insiders on my Druid have 4 years of mileage on them. Rock solid.

 

Just make sure you aren't chasing ghosts.

 

I had my wheel looked at by the top wheel builder at my LBS. Over 3,000 wheel sets built.

Front wheel was fine. Rear wheel was equally de-tensioned 360 degrees. Problem easily solved. Wheels are dead silent now.

Sorry to have led everyone down a garden path on this. I appreciated your help along the way. Thanks.

 

I had my wheel looked at by the top wheel builder at my LBS. Over 3,000 wheel sets built.

Front wheel was fine. Rear wheel was equally de-tensioned 360 degrees. Problem easily solved. Wheels are dead silent now.

Sorry to have led everyone down a garden path on this. I appreciated your help along the way. Thanks.

Good to know.

I have a riding buddy with the exact problem you & @TylerVernon described. My buddy rode his bike like that many times wondering what the noise was. We'd only hear it when he was climbing something steep, bearing down on the cranks. I'd ride behind him so I could look at his rear wheel (which was obviously where the sound was coming from) but neither of us could figure out what was going on for a long while. Finally it dawned on me that the sound I was hearing sounded like spokes -- we all know that sound, a sound that only spokes make. So I said, "Hey Al, I've got a bottle of lube. Let's put at drop on each spoke crossing."

We did. Fixed the problem instantly.

This was a couple months ago. OTOH personally I wouldn't hesitate to detension a wheel so long as I didn't go past the point where wheel integrity might be compromised. In our case, the lube we applied was thick (motor oil)... the spoke cross rub sound has not returned.

Meanwhile his RaceFace carbon cranks have delaminated.
=sParty

 

I have basically the same issue. It started when I replaced the rim (to 26" Mavic 117). Then I rebuilt it with all new spokes (for other reasons, and w/the old nipples) and it's still pinging! So must be either rim or nipples causing it somehow. They were loose after first ride so I re-trued, tightened, and it's better, but still makes noise. I'm fairly certain, the drive side at least, is actually too tight so it's not spoke tension. (Actually on first set of spokes I experimented and purposely overtightened - was still noisy). So the common thought that it's low tension isn't the only cause - but don't know what the hell this one is.

 

Dammit. It’s back.

I called We Are One. They basically said (as I understood it) that I likely stretched and wore out the spokes from overuse. I have never done this to a wheelset before, let alone to one costing $2k.

Anyone hear of this before?

All is not dark though. I am having so much fun on my hardtail lately (which I have ridden continuously while my wheelset on my full suspension has been in successive surgeries). That bike is magical. I ride it on blacks and double blacks and absolutely love it. It is fully dialled and 100% issue free.

Today I will cut up an old tube and put some rubber patches between each of the contact points where the spokes cross cross. I will report back, in case anyone is interested.

In the meantime, any further comments from anyone who may have worn out spokes, or who thinks this might be a mis-diagnosis, would be greatly appreciated.

 

Dammit. It's back.

I called We Are One. They basically said (as I understood it) that I likely stretched and wore out the spokes from overuse. I have never done this to a wheelset before, let alone to one costing $2k.

Anyone hear of this before?

All is not dark though. I am having so much fun on my hardtail lately (which I have ridden continuously while my wheelset on my full suspension has been in successive surgeries). That bike is magical. I ride it on blacks and double blacks and absolutely love it. It is fully dialled and 100% issue free.

Today I will cut up an old tube and put some rubber patches between each of the contact points where the spokes cross cross. I will report back, in case anyone is interested.

In the meantime, any further comments from anyone who may have worn out spokes, or who thinks this might be a mis-diagnosis, would be greatly appreciated.

With the noise back are the tensions on the spokes lower again?

 

Unless over-tensioned spokes don’t “wear out”. If properly tightened just past their yield point but with the tension still below permanent elongation the spokes should last hunderds of millions of cycles. For a spoke a cycle is the point where the wheel is loaded enough for one spoke to lose tension, for example hucking the bike to flat and then becoming tensioned again as the wheel rotates and finds its natural round shape again.

who am I to contradict a wheel builder, but I don’t think spokes “wearing out” in normal use is a thing.

 

Unless over-tensioned spokes don't "wear out". If properly tightened just past their yield point but with the tension still below permanent elongation the spokes should last hunderds of millions of cycles. For a spoke a cycle is the point where the wheel is loaded enough for one spoke to lose tension, for example hucking the bike to flat and then becoming tensioned again as the wheel rotates and finds its natural round shape again.

who am I to contradict a wheel builder, but I don't think spokes "wearing out" in normal use is a thing.

Thanks. I suspect the advice I got from WAO might have been given casually by someone new. It was not Dustin.

In your view, could it be the nipples? Something else? It only happens under significant load. Climbing is obviously the worst.

I just want to get this fixed. It's driving me Insane.

 

You need to check the spoke tension after tensioning, relieving and then after a few rides if/when the noise occurs again.

Could the spokes sit at angles and rub against each other? Perhaps the wheel was not “relieved” properly after retensioning? Or maybe the spokes were installed incorrectly and this is why the rub and “ping”?

 

You need to check the spoke tension after tensioning, relieving and then after a few rides if/when the noise occurs again.

Could the spokes sit at angles and rub against each other? Perhaps the wheel was not "relieved" properly after retensioning? Or maybe the spokes were installed incorrectly and this is why the rub and "ping"?

@mtnbkrmike

I chased that very same noise on my rear ENVE wheel when i switched the hub out. It sounded like someone was plucking the spokes under full power in the crawler gears. I would suspect that your drop in chainring size just upped the torqued being loaded onto the spokes through the hub. Also changing out tires can sometimes de-tension spokes as well. My 70/30HVs came with DT bladed spokes from the factory, are notoriously stiff ( too stiff) and require a **** ton of tension. Dropped some tri-flow chain lube on the cross sections of the spokes and the noise went away for a bit then came back. It seemed the bladed spokes were rotating slightly when being tensioned during the build causing the edges of the blades to rub one another. An issue not found with round spokes. Admittedly, i just ran the spokes to slightly over absolute max tension mounted the tire, and went on with my life, noise free.

If this issue keeps coming back, I'd look into a set of round spokes and go from there.

My crap 2c
ATX

 

Spokes can wear out. They are alot better than they used to be but they will fatigue with use. I don't keep wheels for that long anymore but have had both Mavic and FSA's meet their fatigue life. Mavics would start creaking then they would start breaking. FSA's were j-bend spokes and usually season 3 you would end every ride with a broken spoke. If you think of the stress you put them under, both torque and impact, they have to have to have a limit.

I have done the chain lube trick on spokes before with success but I think a wheel build might be the better way to go. If you spokes have stretched than it might be time to send them back to Dustin for replacement.
You don't live in the prairies, think about how you smash your bike every ride.

 

Spokes can wear out. They are alot better than they used to be but they will fatigue with use. I don't keep wheels for that long anymore but have had both Mavic and FSA's meet their fatigue life. Mavics would start creaking then they would start breaking. FSA's were j-bend spokes and usually season 3 you would end every ride with a broken spoke. If you think of the stress you put them under, both torque and impact, they have to have to have a limit.

I have done the chain lube trick on spokes before with success but I think a wheel build might be the better way to go. If you spokes have stretched than it might be time to send them back to Dustin for replacement.
You don't live in the prairies, think about how you smash your bike every ride.

Agreed on all that. I think I will get my LBS to ship them out tomorrow or Tuesday to WAO.

At the same time, I may order a mullet wheel set and finally install the Ziggy Link that has been sitting on my dining room table (with a pile of tires, brake pads, chains and other parts) for a while now. Maybe this is a sign to finally pull the pin on the mullet set up.

And yes. My bikes take an absolute $hit kicking. It never ceases to amaze me the kind of abuse they take. Those wheels have 4 big seasons on them. And not just around here either (that said, the dry rocky terrain in Canmore, Banff and Kananaskis is not exactly buff, West Bragg and Canmore Nordic Centre aside). They have been everywhere from Squamish to Whistler to Cumberland to Revy to Golden to Fernie, and many places in between. They have a crap load of miles on them.

I actually think they are spent. I have never had this happen before but I think that the spokes and maybe other components have reached the end of their useful life.

I may ask Dustin if he would be good enough to rebuild them, and build me a mullet set that I will use. I will give these ones, once rebuilt, to my daughter. She is 120 pounds and a much kinder, gentler soul than me (both on and off the bike). They will have lots of life left for her, once they have been rebuilt, and are otherwise beautiful wheels (240s).

If anyone has any other ideas or disagrees with this approach, I would really appreciate hearing from you.

Thank you for all your help.

 

I suppose 4 years of hard riding COULD fatigue the spokes, but it would need a really unlucky combo of tension, riding hours and potentially very rough use to happen.

 

That's it for bladed spokes for me. I also think that that's a contributing factor. I paid a $180 CDN premium to end up with the premature onset of noise that is going to drive me insane. Non-bling round spokes from now on.

EDIT: none of this is intended to be a slight against We Are One. I have a set on my hardtail too, but with 350s and round spokes. I ride that bike everywhere I ride my Druid, and just as hard. I makes me shudder to think of the beating that rear wheel takes. I won't ever buy anything other than We Are Ones. The product is incredible, and the service is even better. 10/10. Just in case the wrong messaging is coming across in my non-eloquently worded posts.

 

Haha I have 27 internal We Are Ones on 29 wheels with CR Ray spokes. They are on Onyx hubs so I am sensitive to how they feel with pedaling power transfer for good and bad. About a year ago I felt them sort of "wind up" in spoke tension with hard pedaling accelerations on factory build wheels from 2019 closeout after 1 yr riding. Sure the wheels stayed true, but had some slight de- tensioning from We Are One. I had spoke tension touched up with local wheel guy and will continue to give them trail rotation today still not much fuss.

My Light Bicycle built Cx Ray Carbon 27.5 wheels build by Nobl are 4 years old and are very stiff, never still need touch up more or less.

I'm wondering if We Are One built their trail rims with lower side of acceptable tensions going for compliance.

I also don't use wheels as heavy as single user as I rotate wheels for different tire combos to accommodate riding types, as I hate changing tires regularly in season faffing with lightweight inserts and tubeless mess.

 

Haha I have 27 internal We Are Ones on 29 wheels with CR Ray spokes. They are on Onyx hubs so I am sensitive to how they feel with pedaling power transfer for good and bad. About a year ago I felt them sort of "wind up" in spoke tension with hard pedaling accelerations on factory build wheels from 2019 closeout after 1 yr riding. Sure the wheels stayed true, but had some slight de- tensioning from We Are One. I had spoke tension touched up with local wheel guy and will continue to give them trail rotation today still not much fuss.

My Light Bicycle built Cx Ray Carbon 27.5 wheels build by Nobl are 4 years old and are very stiff, never still need touch up more or less.

I'm wondering if We Are One built their trail rims with lower side of acceptable tensions going for compliance.

I also don't use wheels as heavy as single user as I rotate wheels for different tire combos to accommodate riding types, as I hate changing tires regularly in season faffing with lightweight inserts and tubeless mess.

Hey man!!! Thanks for the response.

But more importantly, HUGE shout out to you!!! I am still so happily using the 425 lb spring I got from you. Thanks so much for that. I don't believe I properly thanked you, at least not publicly, so I am now. Apologies for not having done so sooner.

THANK YOU SIR!

Mike

 

Ran across this thread searching for some consensus on noise and bladed spokes.

My experience: I built up my own wheelset with bladed, straightpull spokes and interlaced them normally. After a couple of years of riding on the wheelset with no issues, I'm now getting the dreaded spoke noise which sounds like the spokes rubbing across each other. I can mimic the noise by squeezing two crossing spokes to cause them to rub. I applied some grease at the spoke crossings and it seems to have helped.

I had a set of wheels professionally built by Wheelbuilder using bladed, straightpull spokes. They came with the spokes non-interlaced. When I called them on it, they said they never interlace bladed spokes (not sure if this is for both straightpull and j-bend, or straightpull only). The person I spoke to couldn't explain why, just said it was their policy. I also bought a prebuilt Mavic wheelset that used bladed, straightpull spokes and they were not interlaced either.

I'm going to check spoke tension first, but my plan is to rebuild the wheels I built to remove the interlacing. The pros must know something...

 

Ran across this thread searching for some consensus on noise and bladed spokes.

My experience: I built up my own wheelset with bladed, straightpull spokes and interlaced them normally. After a couple of years of riding on the wheelset with no issues, I'm now getting the dreaded spoke noise which sounds like the spokes rubbing across each other. I can mimic the noise by squeezing two crossing spokes to cause them to rub. I applied some grease at the spoke crossings and it seems to have helped.

I had a set of wheels professionally built by Wheelbuilder using bladed, straightpull spokes. They came with the spokes non-interlaced. When I called them on it, they said they never interlace bladed spokes (not sure if this is for both straightpull and j-bend, or straightpull only). The person I spoke to couldn't explain why, just said it was their policy. I also bought a prebuilt Mavic wheelset that used bladed, straightpull spokes and they were not interlaced either.

I'm going to check spoke tension first, but my plan is to rebuild the wheels I built to remove the interlacing. The pros must know something...

Thanks for sharing. My spoke noise is still there after a through inspection and retensioning by an experienced wheel builder at my LBS. I am either going to ride them til mid October and then send them to We Are One for a rebuild, or do it earlier and ride my Honzo while I am waiting. Still deciding whether I should get a mullet wheel set from We Are One at the same time. If I do, I won't be getting bladed spokes. That's it for me. Wish I wouldn't have got them on this wheelset.