Yes. At full bottom out fs bikes are a lot lower than hard tails. You need to adapt your technique to suit. Some bikes are better than others. Of course skinny pedals, and shorter cranks help.

 

I was able to work the issues out with the Fuel. There were just a few spots that were problematic and I paused my pedals in those spots. This new bike... it's constant, and I can't tell where the terrain will result in a strike...

I like to just hammer the pedals and go fast. It's the sort of trail that invites that. It's not like it has a bunch of steps and rock gardens where you need technique, although there are a few spots like that.

I'm sort of let down by full suspension so far because of the strikes.

 

Make sure your sag is set correctly. 25% or 11.25mm from the edge of the seal to the travel indicator o-ring for the rear and 15% 20% up front. That worked for me on my Spark, never ever clipped a pedal. If you want even more clearance, a set of 170mm cranks will also help

 

This. I had been hitting the peddle relentlessly. I added air to my rear shock at about 30% compression while sitting on it and rode yesterday. Never bottomed out.

Good luck

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Maybe lock your rear shock if it had such an option ? Will probably help on the climbs too.

I'm always wary of pedal strikes so I built the habit of watching my pedal position from a very young age when leaning in curves or going over bumps and drops. I had the feeling that I could get really injured of my pedal was to catch the ground in a curve or if it hit something while pedaling. Turns out it's not as bad as I thought, as I've learned over the years from a few strikes, but I'm also a cautious rider and rarely beat on the bike, so the strikes are all low speed on rocks or stumps.

I'm more concerned of bashing my chainring than my pedals going over obstacles, that's mostly why I went with the smallest chainring (30t), but also changed to 170mm crank (vs 175mm) and 11mm thin pedals. I ride a medium 26" full suspension XC bike.

I think your problem is solely about orienting your crank to anticipate the change in terrain. Should be solved by spending more time on your new bike and tuning the rear suspension to compress less when going uphill, which is when you're usually pedaling nonstop.

 

30t chainring on 170mm crank with 11mm pedals.

 

30t chainring on 170mm crank with 11mm pedals.

View attachment 1913516

Info on those 11mm thick pedals?

Some bikes are just low. What was the BB height of your old and new bike? Full suspension as mentioned, will go much lower than a hardtail. Because. Suspension.

View attachment 1913518

People seem a bit aghast by this photo...I'm assuming this is with the shock out/fully compressed? I.e. proving the point that suspension drops bb height.

 

Some bikes are just low. What was the BB height of your old and new bike? Full suspension as mentioned, will go much lower than a hardtail. Because. Suspension.

 

I thought I've done a good job setting up sag, which is why I'm so disappointed in full suspension, but maybe I'll just keep increasing the air pressure to see if it will remedy the problem. It sort of makes me think I'll end up with a nearly rigid rear triangle, but as long as I've got some room back there it will be more supple and functional than a hardtail I suppose.

Adjusting technique for the terrain... After thousands of miles of simply pedaling to get top speed and never needing to adjust my pedal stroke for the terrain, it begs the question are the benefits of full suspension so much that they offset the requirement to completely change how you mash pedals constantly for speed?

Some bikes are just low.

Holy crap, there's nearly zero clearance on the pedal in that photo, and that's without the rider compressing the suspension or the ground having features that are more three-dimensional than a flat surface.

I haven't actually measured bottom bracket heights between both bikes, mostly because I figure a full suspension design should take into account the movement of the bottom bracket and allow enough clearance to avoid the majority of pedal strikes.

If that's the case, I'm guessing I just have too little pressure in my shock and fork, because I couldn't imagine the logic in a design that automatically increases your pedal strikes exponentially compared to a hardtail. It just seems like full suspension would be too much of a hassle and a safety concern if that were the reality.

 

I too have the same bike as you. Mine came set up with 27.5 plus wheels. It was just too " low" for me to ride. I switched to 29er wheels and things got better. For a while I only rode in the middle suspension setting being concerned about pedal strikes. But after a while I opened up the suspension and I just seemed to adjust. Very few strikes now. Evidently the adjustment was almost subconscious. It just took one good 10 mile ride.

 

just relearn how to sequence yer feet to terrain . it's you and a short learning curve that's it

 

Sounds like more of a bike setup issue. Shouldn’t be that frequent. I have ridden fs since 2008, have hardtail i ride on same trails occasionally. No significant difference. I ride modern geo FS with 175mm cranks. It does happen, but it’s become predictable and obvious with obstacles. When on occasion I haven’t checked shock pressure in a while and it gets too low, it becomes a problem. You probably need to up pressure and maybe get some help doing so. You may also really benefit from 170 or even shorter cranks.

 

In general, BBs are lower these days. It’s considered a performance design. If you’re closer to the ground, you can ride downhill twisty terrain faster. Of course, you can also hit your pedals more. I watched a PB video the other day of a guy flying down a trail. The trail was almost completely smooth. As I watched, I thought to myself that the rider really benefitted from a lower BB.

I ride terrain with a lot of rocks and roots, and the lower BB on my new FS bike is a significant annoyance. I’m always thinking about it and adjusting my cadence. My older FS bikes had higher BBs. There are lots of low BB hate threads on this site.

 

This is something I am adjusting to as well. I'm a Clyde, still trying to get sag where I want it to be, and my cranks are 175 (I've since ordered 170s). Happened to me right out the gate on my first ride on the new bike, only happened once more after that. Hopefully the new cranks and sag will (mostly) eliminate the chance of it continuing.

 

Absolutely make sure your sag is correct. If you're really blowing through your suspension a lot despite correct sag consider some spacers in your shock. A lot of bikes now have a flip chip though not sure that a Scott Spark would. Most Scott bikes (less the Genius) tend to be racy so I wouldn't think the BB height would be all that low.

From there you really just have crank arm length and timing/cadence.

 

The current Sparks are trail bikes with the modern long/ low geometry. The Spark RC is now the racy XC version.

 

You should get an older 26er full suspension bike; they tend to have high bottom brackets, especially if the fork has been upgraded. The price on them is crazy high lately, but I think you should just bite the bullet and go for it.

More seriously, I think this bike has a Fox 34 at 120mm? If you increase the fork travel a bit, it will raise that BB.

Finally, maybe you're happier with a hardtail? Your trail isn't very rocky/rooty?



The mantra with modern geometry is "longer, lower, slacker"... this is what "lower" gets you.

 

Raise the front end a bit with a taller fork and/or a crown race spacer. You'll get a few mm more clearance and a more modern/slacker geometry. Cheapest approach is a thicker crown race - about $25-35 and 10 minutes work.

These guys will make you one any thickness you want:

Extended Crown Race for Fat Bike Suspension Fork Clearance - Custom Mountain Bike Parts | Custom Mountain Bike Parts for MTB Riders, by MTB Riders (mtbtools.com)

 

Does your Scott have the Twinloc system? If so, how are you using it?

 

Yes, it does, but I've only ridden it twice since I purchased it some months ago, so it's entirely possible this is just a setup issue. Covid really beat me down in October and the trail has been too intense while I've convalesced. I haven't been on the trail until this past weekend, when I noticed how many strikes I was getting.

 

Everything about this screams "technique".
Low bottom brackets hit chain rings. Pedal strikes are because you haven't timed where your feet are and you're riding with your cranks at 12/6 not 3/9.

 

Everything about this screams "technique".
Low bottom brackets hit chain rings. Pedal strikes are because you haven't timed where your feet are and you're riding with your cranks at 12/6 not 3/9.

That has not been my experience. A lower BB also affects pedal strikes. We have to turn our cranks in circles, and pedals (statistically) stand a greater chance of striking. To combat this, a rider must always pay attention. My second bike is a XC rig with 120mm of rear travel. I've got nearly 14 inches of BB height, and it's refreshing to ride because I don't have to think about strikes much at all. The bike is not a fast carver, but that doesn't concern me. Mountain bike manufacturers once designed bikes that bragged about higher BBs. But that was then.

 

I'll put more effort into setup over my next rides, but I'm like Harold... too much air and it would seem to defeat the purpose of having the suspension in the first place.

I don't ride with complete disregard to the trail conditions. Even on the hardtail, there are spots where you have to think about what you're doing with your cadence and your pedal position, but for 99% of all eight miles of that trail, it's pedal to the metal, push as hard as you can as long as you can, and you don't have to think about where your pedals are because it's such a buffed out trail. It just seems strange that in those conditions, I've gotten so many pedal strikes on the new bike. Like many people have suggested, it just has to be set up and hopefully it will improve over time.

I've really debated if full suspension is worth it. My hard tail is awesome and even though some people suggest it's a bit dated, I think it's perfect for that trail. Still, I'm getting older and even with a supple steel frame and a 2.35 inch tire on the back, it gets a bit old. I'd like full suspension not only for the squish but for the extra control that it offers and new geometry is supposed to be an improvement, but, it seems the new geometry will only improve things if you're mostly going downhill and not peddling much? I suppose I should have gone for a more XC oriented full suspension design, but the lines on what is XC and what isn't are getting so blurred nowadays it's hard to find something with typical XC geometry in the first place.

 

I think you missed my point.

You need to increase your awareness.

You have a new bike. It's different from the old bike. This requires you to adapt to the differences. This is always going to be true.

What this means for you specifically is that you need to pay more attention to when/where you're having pedal clearance issues and take steps to fix that. Choose a different line. Time your pedaling differently. Get some air instead of dirt roadie-ing through it. Maybe this will, god forbid, require you to take it easy on a lap to scope out the problem, session the problem sections trying different things. I know this is a cardinal sin of dirt roadie-ing, but this is something you're going to need to figure out.

Shorter cranks are about the only setup issue that I'll say WILL reduce the problem out of the gate. If your suspension setup is bad, maybe that will help, but once you get the suspension setup dialed for you on that bike, there are no more improvements to be had and you'll just create new problems.

 

Overinflate the suspension then lock it out, inflate the tires to 60psi, wear thin socks, put your head down and blindly pedal as hard as you can, finesse be damned.

 

I've had more than one crash at speed smacking pedals deep in the stroke even when BB's were high. My worst crash was with a 14.25" bb which is an absolute monster truck compared to today's bikes. Just as you pay attention to bar clearance you pay attention to pedal clearance. As your skills develop you'll find a dominant stance. Your back foot will always be more prone to impacts. Focusing on your back foot will help reduce DH impacts.

Today's low bikes require more finesse in some situations. Too many people are sanitizing trails, or braiding them out because of this.

 

Be mindful of pedal strikes. They can toss you off the bike. Technique, no longer pedaling in corners, carrying enough speed to coast through rough sections, or racheting may help.

I've also gotten way more strikes on my new bikes compared to my old one.

 

If your trail is so smooth that you can just pedal hard 99% of the time why did you get a FS bike anyway? Also what exactly do you keep hitting your pedals on?

I looked at a bunch of older geometries and BBs haven't gotten much if any lower but suspension travel has gotten substantially longer.

 

Target sag is a starting point. You start there, then adjust your suspension as needed to find what works for you.

Pedal strikes are mostly technique. Sure, riding a FS bike with low BB and long crank arms will make it more difficult to time, but it is still timing. I have enough gouges on my XC HT on my crank arms and it isn't exactly "long, low, and slack", strikes still happen.

I'm riding a 170mm travel bike with 175mm cranks. My knees like the longer length. I just had to adapt.

 

Set up issue, maybe.
Low BB and long cranks, probably
Ride style issue, definitely

If you hit a high spot in full compression with your pedal down, yeah, you will bottom out

Make sure your suspension is correctly set up for bigger hits: sag, HSC, rebound

Adjust your riding style when you are riding a full suspension bike

This is no different than driving a vehicle off road, you learn the vehicles entry/exit angles so you don't bottom out.

As to the lower BB issue on some bikes: Get a different bike, run shorter cranks.

I run cranks as short as 152mm.

 

I’ve got a 2021 chisel comp 29er that is a pedal striking SOB. I made some pressure adjustments on the fork to account for the extra weight from my backpack gear but the weather has bad lately and trails are closed so further testing will have to wait. My old 26” diamondback never had this problem even with 175 cranks. I suspect the longer wheelbase is the culprit, it’s way longer which effectively lowers the bb more on uneven terrain.