Stupid question, but did you open the bleed nipple with a wrench?

 

Ha. Yeah... 1/8 turn, 1/4 turn, 1/2 turn... more...

I guess the fact that I somehow sucked the fluid out of the caliper gives me hope that things are free of real blockages down there.

It's like there's some kind of "vacuum" going on.

I also should mention that I'm bleeding, or trying to, with the reach adjust screw all the way in (meaning, the lever is adjusted all the way out away from the bar.)

 

screw the reach adjuster all the way out, then fill the funnel and try pulling fluid down to caliper not pushing it up

 

To be clear, you mean to adjust the lever all the way out from the bars, right? This is what I've been doing, but it actually requires threading the adjuster screw into the lever (confusing...)

 

Did you fix it?
Im having the same problem with the rear brake.

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I spent another evening trying all sorts of things, but eventually gave up and sent it back to Shimano.

 

This is why I bleed shimano brakes the same way I do automotive. So much easier, works perfectly every time. Other bleed procedures I always fight with. My way isn't as fast, but 0 battles, 0 hassles, 0 mess.

Btw the problem here isnt limited to xtr, slx, m615 etc run into it with the hole syringe thing. Easy work around though.

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Please can you describe how you do it?
Thank you ib advance.

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Get a piece of hose that is plenty long and fits over the bleeder like the syringe hose does. Nice and tight. And a small container (old plastic measuring cup, small empty plastic bottle, etc). And 7mm wrench for the bleeder.

Also get a rubber band/oring or similar. NOT A VELCRO STRAP OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, MUST BE ELASTIC AND ABLE TO HOLD THE LEVER TIGHT TO THE BARS BUT ABLE TO STRETCH ENOUGH TO GO AROUND THE BARS AND LEVER WHEN THE LEVER IS FULLY RELEASED

Secure the hose to the cup in a way that doesn't restrict flow through the hose. Make sure cup is steady and sitting lower to the ground than the caliper (or sitting on the ground, but I hang mine off my caliper with a piece of wire). This is simply to avoid a mess later.

Put the shimano funnel in the lever, remove the little stick with the plug completely. Put some fluid in it. 1/3-1/2 full to start. Pump the lever a couple times to make sure you didn't tighten the funnel too much and block the passage into the lever reservoir. Yes it can happen, done it. You want an open flow between funnel and lever, the fluid in the funnel will also keep air from getting back in. SO MAKE SURE IT DOESNT GO EMPTY!

Next, loosen the bleeder (so it turn easily but isn't draining fluid yet). Put the other end of the hose attached to the cup onto it. Open it up a lot (1/2 turn at least).

Should see a mix of air and fluid start to enter the hose. If not start squeezing the lever (but not all the way to the bars). This is to make sure the passage isn't blocked between the lever and caliper (can happen when shortening hoses if your not careful putting the barb in or dont get it in all the way before installing into lever or caliper).

Let it just sit with the system open for a bit (several minutes). This will allow any aerrated fluid to dissipate the tiny bubbles and create a single, larger ones. And some fluid will make its way from level too caliper. Just make sure there is plenty of fluid in the funnel if you decide to walk away. Basic gravity is your best friend. The newer version brakes may be slightly different as I have had to use a Velcro strap to compress and hold the lever just a little bit from full release position (don't just squeeze to the bars) to open the valve in the lever slightly to get free flow.

Once you come back to it, close the bleeder. Squeeze the lever and you should see your caliper pistons move (probably just a tiny bit if you have the bleeder block installed instead of the pads).

Now squeeze and hold the lever, if your arms aren't long enough to do that and reach the bleeder on the caliper with a wrench to open it, this is where the rubber band comes in handy. Use the rubber band (or oring or whatever as explained above) to squeeze the lever towards the bars.

Open the bleeder, fluid and air should go through the hose, only a little (probably mostly air to start). Once you see that mix go into the hose, tighten the bleeder. Then release the lever so it returns to full release.

Now do it again. Squeeze the lever, put the band back on if needed. Open bleeder till air/fluid go into the hose (may start getting a little fluid making it to the cup by now, or sooner, depends on length of hose or how much air was in the system to start). Tighten bleeder, release lever. Check fluid in funnel.

Repeat again and again till you see no air bubbles coming out of the bleeder valve for 2 cycles. MAKE SURE TO TAP THE CALIPER AT LEAST A COUPLE TIME WITH SOMETHING LIKE A SCREW DRIVER PLASTIC HANDLE. Just to make sure no air gets trapped in caliper. Never ever let the fluid in the funnel get low, no less than 1/4 full.

Once that's completed. Tighten bleeder fully. Pump the lever several times. If you did it right after a couple pumps the lever will get firm. Only way it doesn't is if you let air get trapped in caliper or didn't tighten bleeder properly. Literally NEVER had a problem myself. Except if a line wasn't properly assembled and tightened into lever or caliper so it leaks instead of sealing properly.

Talk the lever, squeeze a couple more times, let it sit for a little while (any possible air bubbles can work up into the funnel and out pf the system).

Tap lever, squeeze a couple more times, if no air bubbles go into funnel, put the plug stick back in so you can remove the funnel without a mess. Put the bolt back in the reservoir to seal it up.

Go ride.







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Get a piece of hose that is plenty long and fits over the bleeder like the syringe hose does. Nice and tight. And a small container (old plastic measuring cup, small empty plastic bottle, etc). And 7mm wrench for the bleeder.

Also get a rubber band/oring or similar. NOT A VELCRO STRAP OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, MUST BE ELASTIC AND ABLE TO HOLD THE LEVER TIGHT TO THE BARS BUT ABLE TO STRETCH ENOUGH TO GO AROUND THE BARS AND LEVER WHEN THE LEVER IS FULLY RELEASED

Secure the hose to the cup in a way that doesn't restrict flow through the hose. Make sure cup is steady and sitting lower to the ground than the caliper (or sitting on the ground, but I hang mine off my caliper with a piece of wire). This is simply to avoid a mess later.

Put the shimano funnel in the lever, remove the little stick with the plug completely. Put some fluid in it. 1/3-1/2 full to start. Pump the lever a couple times to make sure you didn't tighten the funnel too much and block the passage into the lever reservoir. Yes it can happen, done it. You want an open flow between funnel and lever, the fluid in the funnel will also keep air from getting back in. SO MAKE SURE IT DOESNT GO EMPTY!

Next, loosen the bleeder (so it turn easily but isn't draining fluid yet). Put the other end of the hose attached to the cup onto it. Open it up a lot (1/2 turn at least).

Should see a mix of air and fluid start to enter the hose. If not start squeezing the lever (but not all the way to the bars). This is to make sure the passage isn't blocked between the lever and caliper (can happen when shortening hoses if your not careful putting the barb in or dont get it in all the way before installing into lever or caliper).

Let it just sit with the system open for a bit (several minutes). This will allow any aerrated fluid to dissipate the tiny bubbles and create a single, larger ones. And some fluid will make its way from level too caliper. Just make sure there is plenty of fluid in the funnel if you decide to walk away. Basic gravity is your best friend. The newer version brakes may be slightly different as I have had to use a Velcro strap to compress and hold the lever just a little bit from full release position (don't just squeeze to the bars) to open the valve in the lever slightly to get free flow.

Once you come back to it, close the bleeder. Squeeze the lever and you should see your caliper pistons move (probably just a tiny bit if you have the bleeder block installed instead of the pads).

Now squeeze and hold the lever, if your arms aren't long enough to do that and reach the bleeder on the caliper with a wrench to open it, this is where the rubber band comes in handy. Use the rubber band (or oring or whatever as explained above) to squeeze the lever towards the bars.

Open the bleeder, fluid and air should go through the hose, only a little (probably mostly air to start). Once you see that mix go into the hose, tighten the bleeder. Then release the lever so it returns to full release.

Now do it again. Squeeze the lever, put the band back on if needed. Open bleeder till air/fluid go into the hose (may start getting a little fluid making it to the cup by now, or sooner, depends on length of hose or how much air was in the system to start). Tighten bleeder, release lever. Check fluid in funnel.

Repeat again and again till you see no air bubbles coming out of the bleeder valve for 2 cycles. MAKE SURE TO TAP THE CALIPER AT LEAST A COUPLE TIME WITH SOMETHING LIKE A SCREW DRIVER PLASTIC HANDLE. Just to make sure no air gets trapped in caliper. Never ever let the fluid in the funnel get low, no less than 1/4 full.

Once that's completed. Tighten bleeder fully. Pump the lever several times. If you did it right after a couple pumps the lever will get firm. Only way it doesn't is if you let air get trapped in caliper or didn't tighten bleeder properly. Literally NEVER had a problem myself. Except if a line wasn't properly assembled and tightened into lever or caliper so it leaks instead of sealing properly.

Talk the lever, squeeze a couple more times, let it sit for a little while (any possible air bubbles can work up into the funnel and out pf the system).

Tap lever, squeeze a couple more times, if no air bubbles go into funnel, put the plug stick back in so you can remove the funnel without a mess. Put the bolt back in the reservoir to seal it up.

Go ride.

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Thank you for the help.
I will try it.

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Oh and one point I forgot, if you have flow restriction, you messed up in the process of shortening the hose. Either not assembled correctly or contamination in the system as you were cautious to make sure things were clean and no debris in the hose or lever/caliper where hose fitting attached.

Basically. If brakes worked out of the box, then nothing wrong with brakes, end user error (did that one late night when I was rushing, little strand of cut hose was hanging on and blocked port/caused a leak and things wouldn't flow right).

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Two things I've run into being unable to flow fluid during bleeding:

1.) Contamination in the line. Black sludgy particles. This was with mineral oil.

2.) Lever piston being stuck inward or not fully returning so that the transfer port between the master cylinder and reservoir is closed. This was mainly with Elixir brakes.