Kashima is just a gimmick. Don't know if there are other differences in the lines.

 

Perhaps a bit misinformed.

Kashima is not a Fox product. Kashima has been around for a while and has been used in the aerospace industry as a proprietary hard anodizing processing that incorporates a lubricating molybdenum disulfide deposited via electrical induction to improve lubrication and less abrasion and wear. If it was a gimmick, I seriously doubt it would be used in an industry where gimmicks are culled pretty quickly.

 

I am going to go out on limb and say, after Fox having Kashima coat stanchion exclusively, they came out with black stanchion on their "lower" priced shock/fork in attempt to make Rock shox's fork/shock seem lower tier product than their Kashima version. I doubt there is any tangible difference between the two (kashima vs. black) on the trail as far as less friction...on the test bench maybe and subjective preference for stanchion finish for potential buyers. Yes it's Fox marketing pitch and trying to get back at RS for all those lost revenue since Pike came out.

 

i am going to go out on limb and say, after fox having kashima coat stanchion exclusively, they came out with black stanchion on their "lower" priced shock/fork in attempt to make rock shox's fork/shock seem lower tier product than their kashima version. I doubt there is any tangible difference between the two (kashima vs. Black) on the trail as far as less friction...on the test bench maybe and subjective preference for stanchion finish for potential buyers. Yes it's fox marketing pitch and trying to get back at rs for all those lost revenue since pike came out.

lol

 

The Factory version has Fit4 damper and Kashima, The Performance version has Grip4 damper and black stanchions.

I haven't ridden Kashima but I have used both damper cartridges and when riding cannot tell the difference, both forks performed really well.

 

In my experience, Kashima makes the biggest difference after the bike has been sitting for awhile and you first push on the suspension. There's less sticking. However, after you work the suspension of the non-Kashima fork/shock a few strokes, I don't think there's any consequential difference. It does serve as a very visible differentiator between Factory and lower level forks. Now, Kashima on a dropper stanchion could make sense. It does seem to be more fragile though.

 

By the way, the bike companies love it. Gold is cool, but not neutral. And silver has come to be associated with "cheap".

 

I have a Kashima Fox 34 Factory - I love it, it's super bling. If I'm honest, I can't say it has any less 'stiction' than my silver stanchion X-fusion fork and RS black stanchion forks on my other bikes.

Pinkbike did a review of the Grip4 Damper with black stanchion Fox fork, and a fork with Kashima and the Fit4 - and could tell no difference between them. I'd save the cash.

 

Everyone is probably right on the coating, I don't know if it just perception but the 2 forks I have had without Kashima (before this new black coating) did seem to have less stanchion wear to them when I used them hard than had them rebuilt.

However I think big difference with 2017 forks is not just the coating it is the totality of the factory vs performance lines, from what I have read the factory lines are definitely lighter and have other upgrades like different dampers and what kind of upgrades is all going to depend on what fork line you are looking at.

I think bottom line is don't worry about stanchion coating if worried about weight go with the factory if not and need save a few dollars performance will still be a good fork.

 

Everyone is probably right on the coating, I don't know if it just perception but the 2 forks I have had without Kashima (before this new black coating) did seem to have less stanchion wear to them when I used them hard than had them rebuilt.

However I think big difference with 2017 forks is not just the coating it is the totality of the factory vs performance lines, from what I have read the factory lines are definitely lighter and have other upgrades like different dampers and what kind of upgrades is all going to depend on what fork line you are looking at.

I think bottom line is don't worry about stanchion coating if worried about weight go with the factory if not and need save a few dollars performance will still be a good fork.

The Performance Elite which is OEM only has the same internals as factory. Now that I believe is very much on purpose because if those where offered aftermarket I have no doubt the sales in Factory units would plummet.

 

I thought the performance line is suppose to be lighter?

 

Here is a good read:

Fox 34 Float GRIP - Review by mikelevy - Pinkbike

 

thank you I was looking for that write up to post.

It's a good read on the forks.

 

I think Kashima helps reduce wear, but I can only compare it to the regular silver stanchion wear since I've never had a black stanchion fork before. I would go for whatever stanchion color matches your eyes so you look coordinated out on the trails.

 

I have the OEM Performance Elite fork and don't notice any appreciable perfomance difference between it and a Kashima coating.

 

Personally, I doubt too many here will be able to perceive any performance difference.

Maybe I should say "anyone" instead of too many.

 

If it provides consequential benefits in its aerospace use but none on mtbs, then its application to mtbs could legitimately be considered a gimmick. Kinda like ceramic bearings, etc..maybe?

 

No doubt...why are these thread topics stuffed full of anecdote backed with zero data? Why would Fox conveniently supply no supporting performance advantage data, significant to the price difference at least? Does Fox want to sell more, higher priced goods? Does Fox, like everyone, want to differentiate their goods as unique, better? Do pretty things sell?

 

^^^^ I think of it as an improved mechanical function by reducing friction that reduces wear and not so much as something we perceive as a noticeable performance improvement. There are a multitude of mechanical enhancements on bikes, particularly high-end bikes that improve the life and function of the bike, but not necessarily seen as improving our performance.

 

Nothing beat a fresh oil bath.


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Yes, kashima is a gimmick and an attempt to make people forget about the piss-poor sealing and lubrication of the earlier fox forks. I've been on Ti-ni, other type of nitride coatings, kashima, the old chromed marxocchis and everything in between. Lubrication makes a difference and forks don't need crazy finishes, they need decent lubrication. What is not a gimmick usually is the better damper in the factory forks. At least in every other year past, the performance damper blew throug travel on the "D" setting and was more like a jackhammer in the rough with the middle setting or more. According to that article, this is fixed, but fox claimed many years in a row that it was fixed, when it was not. Rather than ridiculous 3-setting forks that offer big compromises for each setting, I just want a low speed compression adjustment that allows me to dial in a good amount of LSC without acting like a jackhammer, which IS possible, but for many years they have refused to provide this. IF the performance damper isn't like this, then it would be fine, a song as you make sure to check the bath oil like any other fox.

 

Yes, kashima is a gimmick and an attempt to make people forget about the piss-poor sealing and lubrication of the earlier fox forks.

I also heard that The Lizard People™ own Fox!

 

^^^^ How many other components provide satisfactory data?

 

Cleared2land, you know you cannot lose an argument with that question applied to this industry. Very clever!

I'd like to see a test where the fork stanchions were covered by some rubber covers and experienced riders were polled on which one was the kashima and which one was the Performance Elite. It would probably turn out like those blind wine tasting tests - no statistical difference.

 

^^^^ I think that you're correct. I seriously doubt that experienced riders could tell the difference. However, as I stated in post #20, i think of it more of an improved mechanical function over a perceivable performance improvement.

 

I have a Rockshox (160), Performance fox fork (130), and Kashima Fox (150). The newest one is the Performance Fox and I like it the most. I wouldn't pay extra for Kashima coating.

 

Well I have a Rhythm Grip 34 and it's super smooth - way better than the 2017 SID. Much less stiction. This is Fox's lowest grade coating.

 

I was advised by a well known suspension tuning shop 3 days ago that while I can get either a custom tuned 36 Kashima or black ano fork from them (I wanted the Performance Elite), they have seen wear problems with the black ano that they do not see with the Kashima. I have never heard this comment before but thought I would add it to this discussion.

 

That has been my experience too. Two year old Kashima forks still look great, wear-as 2-year old black ano forks appear to have some pretty serious wear.

 

I've had several Fox forks since the Kashima coating was available, some with, some without. If the forks are in good working order and broken in (not brand new), I can feel a difference in smoothness between the slick black and Kashima coated. The Kashima is a little bit smoother. It's not life changing, though. It's really all about whether or not the fork is functioning properly as far as smoothness goes, IME.

For my most recent comparison, I have a 2018 Fox 34 Rhythm GRIP and a 2018 Fox 34 Factory FIT4, both with identical hours of usage and both with 2 volume spacers. The Factory fork is considerably smoother but I think it's lighter weight and it's damper play the major role in that.

 

Gold looks terrible


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Gold looks terrible

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Repulsive.

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^^^ Another subjective opinion

 

The Kashima makes a difference but it is subtle. You could easily make up that difference in performance with a better setup or even a third party insert (Luftkappe, DSD Runt, Chickadeehill AWK). The better set up is free and the inserts are all less than 200$ so...