Awesome post... Good timing since I just ordered my BB7's!

 

yer gonna dig em if ya didnt already know that. glad to help.

 

BB7s are great but I've found better power with hydros. Thanks for the setup post.

 

hydros more powerful? oh yeah! but ya gotta dig the simplicity and dependibility of these puppys. better use of power compared to some hydros though. i own 2 pair, 1 on a '05 flux and another on a '02 rfx. they fit my style and terrain quite well but theyre not for everyone. ill take em over my hayes mags any day, even a 3000' day on the front range. now wheres my drill? i gotta drop 100g off these things and fast! hehe.

 

I have been using the Avids since day 1. Your instructions are WAY more complicated than it needs to be. Some good info if you can pick through it.

1b) you must have avid speed dial levers...

I have never used Avid cable discs with Speed Dial levers (for more than a ride or two). Only Dia Compe 287v and road STI levers. Works great, if not better than with my buddies' w/Speed Dials. I do not even use barrel adjusters.

Your pad setup does not let me run the levers as "loose" as I like and does not work at all with worn pads. I just set the inner pad so the rotor will be roughly centered in the caliper, then tighten the out pad to align the caliper.

12) ...if this is a new cable/housing install, give it 4 hard pulls to seat and stretch everything into opperational position...

At least with the v1 calipers Avid specifically warned against doing this. It can permanently damage the internal ramps of the brake. I have never found it necessary with the v2 calipers either so why risk it?

13) back both pad adjusters out fully.

Why? I just back off the outer pad 3-4 clicks and the inner 1-2 and adjust from there.

18) i like to trim my cable to about 2" so i can service and re-tune the system several times before replacement is needed. make damn sure it doesnt touch or get in the rotor and dont forget yer cable end.

Hard to prevent brush, grass or sticks from moving an over-long cable into the rotor. Been there, frayed that. Luckily no brake damage from the cable and end cap jamming it the brake or body damage from the resulting crash. Never needed my cable to be longer for interterm adjustments. 2cm is as long as the end needs to be.

Feel and wear info is right on - and mostly straight from the instruction sheet.

Modulation can be increased (with a slight loss of power) by moving the inner pad out 1-2 clicks. This reduces the grabbiness some complain of and the Speed Dial does little to change it.

Many miss the caliper tension adjustment. I like my brakes to be as light as possible to the point of removing the springs in the brake lever (does nothing but increase hand effort) and use the caliper spring only. Just enough tension for the arm to return. Ultralight lever effort.

 

hiya shiggy. although im sure yer proceedure and parts pick works very well for ya, i was asked to post the proper way to set these up and this, my friend, is it. no disrespect intended whatsoever. i dont recall avids warning about hard lever pull but that doesnt mean they dont have this warning and i just missed seein it. all i can do is re-emphisise another point i made. 200+ (?) bb7 set ups with this method and not a single return for any reason. zero. nada. no matter how a custy wanted his to feel. its all in the final adjustments man. i proudly stand behind it as i learned this from a guy much more experinced and talented than myself, though i did refine a point or 2 cuz im a wordy guy whos anal retentive about doin it right the 1st time.

 

Thanks cc for taking the time to write this guide. I'm thinking it is going to help dummies like me.

 

I would call it a way to properly setup the Avids rather than the proper way. My method (as I have posted here many times over the past several years) works just as well and is simpler.

Because the brakes are so adjustable it can be as easy to set them up to work very poorly as work very well. There is no one method to perfection.

Here is the cable stressing notice:

Avid released a service bulletin, definitely NOT a recall, in regard to their mechanical disc brakes. Some riders or mechanics are trying to over-stretch the cables during setup thus causing undue stress to the entire brake system. "To properly setup the brake, it is not necessary or appropriate to attempt to stretch the inner wires." Bottom line - Make sure that you do not overly squeeze the brake levers after the pads have contacted the rotor. If, during brake setup or heavy-duty use, you hear or feel a pop while applying pressure to the brake levers, or notice a sudden increase in the slack or play of the brake cable then the brake may have been damaged. At that point, you should immediately contact your Avid dealer for inspection and possible repair or replacement. 11/00 ​

http://www.bikyle.com/recalls.htm and scroll down.

Plus the Avid service bulletin about cable length:
http://www.qbp.com/pdf/SafetyNoticeCable.pdf#search="avid disc brake service bulletin"

 

You lost me when you said you had to use an Avid lever. I don't see what's so enlightening about your instructions in any case and the semi-Bill Boles style is as annoying as Bill Boles (the old coot guy in DirtRag). Nothing wrong with the Avid instructions, even for "dummies".

 

gee fool. thanx for yer heartfelt synopsis of how much ya didnt like my post. lookin back, i could only hope it could have been as helpful as yer own. as far as yer old coot reference, ive been told that before and not bein a reader of dirt rag, ill have to trust that opinion. kinda ironic how yer id contains the same anoyin style. you have fun with yer "big truck = small.....(mind?) mentality. i choose not to participate.

 

holy crap guys! is this standard fare for this forum? guess im used to a diff style on others where info intended as helpful, containing solid skills born from experience in the industry is not torn apart and ridiculed by others. im glad you, shiggy, have years of brake set up posts to yer credit on mtbr and i hope yer business treats you well. however, if i was a retail customer who took my multi thousand dollar bike to a service shop and recieved the type of thumbnail work and negitively aggressive customer service i see in some of the posts contained in this thread, id be on my way. much like ill be now. allow me to return yer throne to you shiggy. you win man.

i would like to add for the others here who found some degree of help in my post that i had no intention of upsetting the delicate balance of "brake time" or steppin on any toes. thanx for allowin me the oppertunity to contribute.

Plus the Avid service bulletin about cable length:
http://www.qbp.com/pdf/SafetyNoticeCable.pdf#search="avid disc brake service bulletin"

sounds to me like someone had a bad ride and sued someone else. as a matter of fact, thats exactly what happened here. i am well aware of this safety bulletin. a lack of proper mechanical skills and/or a lack of proper maintanence by the few does not mean we all need to compensate.

no need to respond kids. im done here.

 

gee fool. thanx for yer heartfelt synopsis of how much ya didnt like my post. lookin back, i could only hope it could have been as helpful as yer own. as far as yer old coot reference, ive been told that before and not bein a reader of dirt rag, ill have to trust that opinion. kinda ironic how yer id contains the same anoyin style. you have fun with yer "big truck = small.....(mind?) mentality. i choose not to participate.

For better or worse people are judged by the way they use the language.

 

...sounds to me like someone had a bad ride and sued someone else. as a matter of fact, thats exactly what happened here. i am well aware of this safety bulletin. a lack of proper mechanical skills and/or a lack of proper maintanence by the few does not mean we all need to compensate.

I have to ask: What do you do to guaranty the two-inches of cable will never end up in the rotor and/or caliper?

 

CC, sorry you're used to universal acclaim. OTOH your self-anointed "proper" instructions and coot writing style just made me say it. Did I say I can't stand Bill Boles?

 

hey cactus, interesting writeup, a bit lengthy for my taste (ya im lazy =) but will keep it in mind if i ever need to do troubleshooting or want to tweek my procedure. 200 success stories says all that needs to be said about your system's effectiveness.

take the compliments and thanks with appreciation, and the criticism in stride. sometimes you need thick skin on the internet because people tend to not only say what's on their mind, but over-do a bit it in the process, myself included.

anyway, don't get too discouraged, just continue doing your thing and sharing your ideas, there will always be interested readers even though they may not be active posters :thumbsup:

 

Spring Tension.. I imagine that in terms of the BB7 it's the power that reopens the brake? or is it the difficulty to pull the brake? Lets give a few points about the spring tension part here please..

 

From the Avid instruction sheet for the spring adjustment on the caliper: Turning the screw clockwise increases spring tension, which equals harder lever pull.

 

so the higher the tension the hard to pull.. lower the tension easier? well thats simple enough.. My brakes should be in the mail tomorrow.. too bad my frame is dead.. Cracked the top tube seat tube intersection. ... It's getting a warranty claim so I should be back riding in a week or so.. hopefully..

 

Thanks...

I realize we all have our own tastes and opinions, but I really dont see any incredibly irresponisble direction from CC here. Thanks for a good write up for a product that often ends up in the hands of the entry level user.

As far as hydros being stronger...

These things are scary strong after break in. SCARY strong.

FLAME ON....

:thumbsup:

 

.. too bad my frame is dead.. Cracked the top tube seat tube intersection. ... It's getting a warranty claim so I should be back riding in a week or so.. hopefully..

Gary Fisher?

 

Nah it's a KHS. I've got my fingers crossed hard..

 

...
As far as hydros being stronger...

These things are scary strong after break in. SCARY strong.

FLAME ON....

:thumbsup:

exactly. some might even say they are overkill on a ~40lb bicycle

 

From your experience what are the best levers to use with a BB7 setup as far as feel, lightness, adjustability etc. (Avid 7s or Ultimates, Paul Love, XTR, etc.). Can any V-brake lever be compatible?

 

I set my brakes up using this guide last night...UNREAL....Everyone always complimented me on my BB7's...now they're FAR FAR better!

Thanks man!

RJ

many have asked how to properly set up a avid bb7 brake lately in the turner forum, here and in pm's so i thought id help out. as far as ive seen, this is THEE guide to gettin proper feel and modulation out of a very fine brake system and ive used it with superior success on aprox 200 bikes. this only works for the avid bb7 so if ya try and morph this onto another system, such as a hydro brake, i cant be held responsible for the outcome or yer stupidity. ive properly prepared for the creation of this guide with a case of four peaks brewing company's 6% kiltlifter scottish amber ale and a few hits off the crack pipe. so without further auh-dooo.....

1) start with clean or new pads. clean the rotors with alchohal and never touch with skin.
1a) rotors must be true to within .005" on a dial caliper or damn close to it.
1b) you must have avid speed dial levers for this to work. shimanos with inner adjusters are close but will never do the job as well. ever. get it? never! and yeah, i forgot 1a and 1b in the beginnin and wasnt about to re # the whole damn thing for the likes of you. so friggin get over it.
2) use locktite on all older caliper and rotor mount bolts, perferably blue 242.
3) loosen caliper adapter bolts slightly and rotate up in the direction of rotors rotation and tighten. 80 ip for you torque fans.
4) loosen caliper mount bolts slightly so caliper can move side to side.
5) back out red pad adjusters fully.
6) turn inner pad adjuster in fully then back out 10 indexed clicks.
7) turn outer pad adjuster in till it bottoms out on rotor. do not force this step. rotor should not move in caliper at this time but caliper may move slightly on its adapter.
8) tighten caliper mount bolts. 80 ip if ya like.
9) with a cable in yer lever and housing run to the caliper (all new or in good shape and at proper length ill assume) turn barrel adjuster in full.
10) if yer caliper has some miles on it, it might be nice to dab the cable pinch bolt with some wet chain lube, grease or anti sieze.
11) use a 4th hand tool to take up any slack in the cable and tighten the pinch bolt. 80 ip, see a pattern here? as in step 7, do not force this. if ya see movement in the acctuator arm, go back to step 5.
12) grab a handfull of lever and check for cable slack. there should be none. if this is a new cable/housing install, give it 4 hard pulls to seat and stretch everything into opperational position then go back to step 11.
13) back both pad adjusters out fully.
14) turn inner pad adjuster in about 4 indexed clicks, pull lever 3 times, spin wheel and check for rub. repeat this step till any rub is heard. once rub is home, back it out 1 click at a time till it goes away then 2 or 3 more for clearence. i go 3 most times.
15) repeat step 14 for the outer pad adjuster. with a ear close to the rotor, not that close dummy!, you should hear zero rub of rotor to pads.
16) lever throw should suit yer style. too tight? back out the outer pad adjuster 1 click at a time till feel is reached, not the inner pad.
17) now that both brakes are set and workin, see how 1 lever feels nice n stiff and the other feels like ass? no probs! thats just a good short front cable vs that long rear cable and all its housing compression. rectify this and modulation feel 1/2 turn at a time of the speed dial knob on yer levers. start with the front knob turned in to soften up the leverage ratio of said cable to match the rears feel. a 1/2 turn goes a long way so take yer time.
17a) see that little allen head on the back of the actuater arm? thats a preload adjuster for the spring tension on the caliper. turn it in to suit additional lever feel. i like mine tight baby! thanx to cuthroat for the memory check!
18) i like to trim my cable to about 2" so i can service and re-tune the system several times before replacement is needed. make damn sure it doesnt touch or get in the rotor and dont forget yer cable end.
19) take up slack in pad wear by repeating these steps.
20) now go ride and dig yer new brake feel!

wonderin if yer avid pads are old and dead? measure with a micrometer. pad material and backing plate should read no less than 3.00mm. i replace em at 25% or 3.25mm just to be safe. a new avid pad is about 4.00mm.

there been some good info on pad type lately. ill try and find it so we can include it here as a reference sometime soon.
you can start here.
and then go here.

 

Rotor offset within pads, not centered

Avid instructs that the rotor should be closer to the static pad. Consequently, the rotor will deflect more when the brakes are applied than if it were centered between the pads. Any engineers who can explained why greater rotor deflection enhances brake performance? My instincts are to center the rotor, but Avid says that would be an incorrect set-up.