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2012 Epic Expert as a trail bike?

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CrushT

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I’m thinking of retiring my 2007 Stumpjumper Pro and jumping into the 29er and carbon craze. I have my eye on the 2012 Epic Expert since I ride mostly fire roads and 4x4 trails and I don’t think I want, or need, the mega travel of the new Stumpys. To me the Epic has the potential to be a good trail bike if the brains are complacent. So my questions to those lucky few who already have one of these puppies; is it a good trail bike? how are the F1 brakes? and finally isn't the 24 low gear rather tall for long or steep climbs.
:thumbsup:
 
#2 ·
Fits the bill for U

I only have a 2010 29er Epic, it has 10mm less travel and its not carbon, but I have some carbon Havens wheels on it. I ride that that bad boy as a trail bike and it excels in all ways for me.
 
#3 · (Edited)
I have one (2012,29'' ) and I'm considering to sell my Stumpy FSR 26'' to make funds for a Roubaix. This to let you know how trail capable the Epic truly is. And versatile too,just tune the Brains in and you're good to go on even rougher stuff. Rims are good so far but I won't be pushing their limits. Of course I would never take jumps or drops,but I'm not that kind of rider,not even with my very capable Stumpy.

Not a fan of R1 brakes,sorry. Never had any issues with the infamous Avids and I'm sick of finding R1's all the time ( 2 Lapierres and now on my Epic). R1's on my 3 months old Epic giving me issues already.....:rolleyes:
 
#6 ·
The Epic expert is a great bike and a very good "trail" bike. The brain can be opened to be fairly plush although in my opinion not as plush as a nonbrain fork can be for the rough stuff. For what you typically ride it will probably be just fine. I still can feel the moments before it opens up even fully open and I think a non brain fork is better for small bumps but the brain is great for speed. There are varied opinions on this fork and technology. I like it a lot, just don't love it.

Do you plan on racing this bike? If not and you're dedicated to the specialized brand, the Camber Expert maybe a better "trail / xc" bike if you don't plan to race it. There are also some other good brands of full suspension 29 xc/trail bikes to look at as well if you aren't 100% sold on specialized. Maybe the R.I.P. 9 or Jet RDO with 120 fork from niner or the Tallboy from SantaCruz with 120 fork in front would be a better option and the price can be had for around the same as the epic expert.

I like the formula brakes although the ones on the epic aren't fully the R1, special version for specialized with Rx calipers. the 24 front and 36 in back is no problem and I almost never go this low but I rarely have any steep climbs that are more than a few minutes long. If you're climbing for a half hour, you may want the standard triple...but if you're climbing for a half hour, I'd assume you'd want a lot of suspension for the ride down and the Epic isn't the bike for that.
 
#7 ·
+3 on the Epic. A capable all-arounder. That said if you get into drop/gnar territory this would not be the bike for you. I ride a 2010 which 90mm in the rear and a 2012 expert they for my terrain (east coast rock gardens) they are sufficient.

Now are you married the idea of full squish or would you consider a hard tail? If you all you are doing is fireroads and the occassional 4x4 trail you may not need the rear suspension.
 
#8 ·
I have the 2012 sworks epic... I came from a 2011 stumpy fsr carbon. The first few times I rode the epic, i set it on pretty firm in the front and rear suspensions. I took it on a some technical trails that I do all the time and was perfectly fine on the stumpy... well the first time I hit this one bridge that has a few big rocks and the bike wouldn't go over it and I fell. It was a complete shock to me.. I rode over this section many times and never had an issue...

I talked to the shop and they told me because of the geometry and the brain, I can't really do the type of 'trail' riding I used to do unless I open up the brain more. So I've been riding with a more comfortable brain setting in more technical trails.
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
Thanks for the input,


When I started down this road I was 100% sold on Specialized, but they just don’t have the right bike for me. It’s a bummer to hear about the Formula brakes, maybe I can swap my Magura Manta’s (something old) from my Stumpy. I like going down… and it’s here were the Epic may fall a little short.

I’ve looked at the Camber, looks good but I find it heavy, it will be a close call but the SC Tallboy with the 120 fork up front looks mighty capable and versatile.

Hum
 
#10 ·
My .02

I currenlty own a 26in Epic and Enduro SL. My technical capabilities are good. I've test rode a 2012 Epic 29er Comp on a semi technical trail, here are my thoughts.

The 29in wheels seem to add an inch to the travel of the bike. So if you are on a 120mm Stumpy then a 100mm Epic will be just as capable. The through axle rear and 15mm front along with stiffer frame will exceed the typical stiffness of your older Stumpy. The HA difference is absorbed by the bigger wheels.

Moving on to the trail capabilities of the Epic 29er. I ride my Epic and rode the test 29er Epic just like I ride my Enduro, full on balls out not slowing down for anything. I jump logs, bomb through rocks/roots, fly off drops, whatever the trail has I do it without regards to my bike. The 29er Epic handled everything I threw at it with ease and was a major step up over my 26in Epic. The stiffness was even more apparent then my Enduro (07 S-Works so no through axle rear, but 20mm front and 36mm fork). The 29er Epic just rolled over everything and tracked amazingly well. I jumped over log piles and the bike landed so solid it blew me away. I was noticeably faster on that bike than either of my high end built 26ers.

Overall IMO, and hoping I don't hurt anyone's feelings, if you feel the Epic 29er is not "trail" capable then either your skills are not up to par or you definition of "trail" is not what I consider to be a trail. My "trails" are definitely more XC single track oriented, but every log pile or possible jump/drop and steep root section that I encounter I hit full on and usually speed up for. I have no problem getting a few feet of air on my Epic. I'm ~170lbs and have NEVER had a single part fail either.

Is the Epic built to be a "trail" bike, maybe not, that is what the Camber and Stumpy are considered for, but the capability is 100% there if your riding capability is.

Can you demo an Epic on your local trails? Also, just upgrading the wheels to something wider/stiffer can make a huge difference too. I was so impressed with the bike I'm selling both my bikes and moving on to a 2012 Stumpy EVO 29er :thumbsup:
 
#11 ·
I ride a 2010 expert in 26...
I do remember when I first started riding the bike thinking "man this thing is versatile". The last 3 runs of the brain have been super compliant to however the rider wishes to set up their bike. A lot of guys set it and forget it, or you can simply dial your brain fade and rebound for a stiffer or more plush ride.

Now, I have changed some things and mine is definitely set up as an xc race rocket. I can still ride it like a "trail" bike, but I can think of a few other rides I would rather have for a little more fun.
I imagine with the 29 inch wheels, and a different route of upgrades the bike could be geared more toward what I would consider "trail riding".

But, as many have stated, it is an incredibly versatile bike. You could take it whatever route you want with your upgrade path.
 
#12 ·
hairyviking said:
I ride a 2010 expert in 26...
I do remember when I first started riding the bike thinking "man this thing is versatile". The last 3 runs of the brain have been super compliant to however the rider wishes to set up their bike. A lot of guys set it and forget it, or you can simply dial your brain fade and rebound for a stiffer or more plush ride.

Now, I have changed some things and mine is definitely set up as an xc race rocket. I can still ride it like a "trail" bike, but I can think of a few other rides I would rather have for a little more fun.
I imagine with the 29 inch wheels, and a different route of upgrades the bike could be geared more toward what I would consider "trail riding".

But, as many have stated, it is an incredibly versatile bike. You could take it whatever route you want with your upgrade path.
Click to expand...
I should note that I have not ridden the R1 brakes... But they are a very xc oriented brake. Long descents on them may get hairy as they heat up. I have never had issues with 3+ sets of elixir R/CR/SL. I have encountered issues with the xx and xc world cup though..losing power on long bumpy descents.
 
#13 ·
Just got my Epic built up last night (25 lbs. without pedals). The default bar/stem setup screams XC racing (at least for my 44 yo not-too-flexible body). Once I swapped on a shorter stem and riser bars to get the fit close to my existing XC bike, it feels like a bike that I would feel comfortable taking on some less technical/chunky trail rides (I have a Sultan for bigger stuff). And in the parking lot test, the tuneability of the Brain seems to allow for a pretty plush ride if I want.

As far as the brakes go, I'm swapping the Magura MT6 brakes with 180F/160R rotors from my current bike because they are at least as light as the Formulas and they modulate and stop well.

The one thing I don't understand is why they didn't spec a 15mm thru-axle fork. Right now, the question is do I sell the SID/Brain fork and get the SID World Cup with the Xloc lockout and a 15mm TA? Or do I swap a set of 15mm TA lowers onto the Brain fork?
 
#15 ·
Had a 2006 Stumpjumper S Works alum, then a Pivot Mach 5 and just recently sprung for the S Works Epic 29er. Honestly, the Stumpy had similar travel to an Epic 29er, but was more plush for trail riding. The Epic has a stiffer, more efficient suspension for racing.

We really push it on our extremely rocky, rooty, rugged trails, and the difference is noticeable. The brain is not an advantage in very technical and fast downhill riding. Even Specialized advises turning it off in these conditions. Even so the suspension is stiffer. You would have to try it to see what I am talking about. This only becomes obvious at high speeds through very rough terrain, esp. downhill.

Having said that I will probably never go back to the heavier Stumpy, even carbon. The climbing and level singletrack is just so much more enjoyable with the lighter bike, more efficient suspension, and 29er wheels. For me it makes the ride more fun in general. If you go this route, you should consider putting bigger rubber than the stock tires. After 3 cracks in the carbon fiber rear rim, I tossed the Renegade for a 2.0 Captain and it was a very good decision.

The suggestion to do a test ride is a very good one, but you must push the bike hard to get a real comparison. When I test rode one it was on the smooth hardpack trails of Calif., very different from our volcanic, forested trails at home. The stiffer suspension just wasn't as obvious as it is on our trails. That can fool you.
 
#16 ·
jmcdev1 said:
Had a 2006 Stumpjumper S Works alum, then a Pivot Mach 5 and just recently sprung for the S Works Epic 29er. Honestly, the Stumpy had similar travel to an Epic 29er, but was more plush for trail riding. The Epic has a stiffer, more efficient suspension for racing.

We really push it on our extremely rocky, rooty, rugged trails, and the difference is noticeable. The brain is not an advantage in very technical and fast downhill riding. Even Specialized advises turning it off in these conditions. Even so the suspension is stiffer. You would have to try it to see what I am talking about. This only becomes obvious at high speeds through very rough terrain, esp. downhill.

Having said that I will probably never go back to the heavier Stumpy, even carbon. The climbing and level singletrack is just so much more enjoyable with the lighter bike, more efficient suspension, and 29er wheels. For me it makes the ride more fun in general. If you go this route, you should consider putting bigger rubber than the stock tires. After 3 cracks in the carbon fiber rear rim, I tossed the Renegade for a 2.0 Captain and it was a very good decision.

The suggestion to do a test ride is a very good one, but you must push the bike hard to get a real comparison. When I test rode one it was on the smooth hardpack trails of Calif., very different from our volcanic, forested trails at home. The stiffer suspension just wasn't as obvious as it is on our trails. That can fool you.
Click to expand...
^^ agree 100% :thumbsup:
 
#17 ·
Some incorrect info in this post. Your brain should be set to full open not off/closed on tech/drops downhill sections. This would make your suspension plush not hard. Making the suspension hard would defeat the purpose of having it. By your post it seems you didn't have you suspension setup correctly. Therefore you did not get the benefit of the Brain. The brain stiffens the suspension for climbing. Softens for downhills.

http://service.specialized.com/coll.../ownersguide/new/assets/pdf/FSR---2012-Stumpjumper-FSR--26---29--FSR-Manual.pdf

jmcdev1 said:
Had a 2006 Stumpjumper S Works alum, then a Pivot Mach 5 and just recently sprung for the S Works Epic 29er. Honestly, the Stumpy had similar travel to an Epic 29er, but was more plush for trail riding. The Epic has a stiffer, more efficient suspension for racing.

We really push it on our extremely rocky, rooty, rugged trails, and the difference is noticeable. The brain is not an advantage in very technical and fast downhill riding. Even Specialized advises turning it off in these conditions. Even so the suspension is stiffer. You would have to try it to see what I am talking about. This only becomes obvious at high speeds through very rough terrain, esp. downhill.

Having said that I will probably never go back to the heavier Stumpy, even carbon. The climbing and level singletrack is just so much more enjoyable with the lighter bike, more efficient suspension, and 29er wheels. For me it makes the ride more fun in general. If you go this route, you should consider putting bigger rubber than the stock tires. After 3 cracks in the carbon fiber rear rim, I tossed the Renegade for a 2.0 Captain and it was a very good decision.

The suggestion to do a test ride is a very good one, but you must push the bike hard to get a real comparison. When I test rode one it was on the smooth hardpack trails of Calif., very different from our volcanic, forested trails at home. The stiffer suspension just wasn't as obvious as it is on our trails. That can fool you.
Click to expand...
 
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#18 ·
Agree with jmcdev1 as well. Great bike and very versatile but not as smooth (by design) a suspension for really rough stuff but fantastic for what I assume a lot of people ride (typical fire road, smoother trails). The brain shock and fork even when fully open are just not as plush as a non brain shock and this is by design as the shock has been tuned this way.

Best bet is to try and test ride on the trails and type of terrain that you typically ride and see if it's the bike for you. If I'm not racing, I prefer a non-brain full suspension with more travel but prefer the Epic for racing. If you only want one full suspension bike and you don't race, I do believe there are better options out there.
 
#19 ·
BigWheels29 said:
because the quick release with OS end caps in lighter & stiffer

keep the forks, they have the brain in them, so there's no need for a remote lock out
Click to expand...
On the face of it, that sounds like a marketing claim to keep the costs down by spec'ing a QR fork. I'd be interested in seeing the numbers to back that up. They're basically claiming that the hub's endcap bears most of the torsional load and that the outside of the QR doesn't matter judging by the QR on my Epic. I have a hard time believing that's the case.

As far as the Brain goes, the jury's still out, but I'll probably stick with it until I decide to get the SID World Cup with a remote lockout.
 
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