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Discussion starter · #21 ·
There is about a $2k difference between the 100 AL Pro and the 100 (carbon) elite. Both have the exact same build except for the frame materials. Any idea what the weight/rigidity difference is between those bikes?
 
There is about a $2k difference between the 100 AL Pro and the 100 (carbon) elite. Both have the exact same build except for the frame materials. Any idea what the weight/rigidity difference is between those bikes?
According to the Trek website:

$1500 difference
Full carbon frame made in USA vs Taiwanese AL frame
Fox F29 FIT RLC fork with custom tune vs open bath RL fork
RP23 on the AL Pro may or may not come with Kashima coat. The website has conflicting specs
Carbon Seatpost vs AL seatpost
Carbon Handlebar vs AL handlebar
XT cassette vs SLX cassette
And uh, a different seat collar (bolt vs QR)

The Carbon frame weighs well under 5 lbs with shock, last I saw. Who knows what the AL frame weighs. Other AL frames are in the 6-7 lbs range from other manufacturers. Carbon frame was sort of flexy in the back, but I bet the 142x12 helps that. My '10 SF100 is kind of flexy in the BB laterally. Gonna have to test ride or find a review on the AL version to know for sure.
 
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The Anthem and Spearfish are both in the 5.5+ - ish range for aluminum. Pretty light but still not carbon. If weight matters, it did for me, gotta go with carbon. Of course wheels, as mentioned earlier, are the most important for rotational weight difference.
 
Blunderbuss, looking at the Trek SF 100 PRO, can you give me your perspective on the upgrades between the the Pro and the Elite and their relative value? I'm also looking at a set wheels to upgrade my ride, any suggestions there? I have a set of I-9's on my hardtail race bike, GF Rig w/ 1 x 9 conversion, but would like a more cost effective solution as I-9 has priced themselves out of the market for a lot of us middle of the roaders, racin on a Budget! Already stoked for next season! Possumrider
Pro vs Elite. Assuming we're talking Aluminum since that's what this thread is about: The big things that sold me on the Pro over the Elite were pretty much everything. The front and rear thru axles, the XT 2x10 drivetrain and brakes, RL wheels, and looks of course. Having a couple Rumblefishes has made me a believer in the benefits of the thru axle. As for gearing I expect the 38/22 with 11-36 will be just right for XC racing. As for the XT brakes, Shimano's hydraulics are the least disappointing I've come across. The RL wheels aren't the lightest, but for a clydesdale racer they make a good race only set, plus Bonty tubeless is dead simple. When I first saw the bike, I was on the fence about returning to the race scene after a five year absence (and considerable fitness loss). When I saw the black and blue and read the specs, I decided I would race in 2012, and it would be on that bike. It will be the first bike since my very first that I will ride completely stock.

As for wheels, I don't really have any advice beyond forget about I9 and find yourself a good wheel builder.
 
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Here's a list of specs I based my 6-7 lbs estimate from. The bikes in the 4"/100m travel group are the ones I'd say are the SF100's closest competition. Note the few that have 142x12 rear axles, which the OP is interested in.

Trek Superfly 100 AL ?? 110mm travel 142x12 rear (carbon is 4.85 lbs med; +1 lb? or maybe take some weight off the last HiFi claimed weight due to shift from 6061 to this Alpha Platinum stuff?)

4"/95-100mm travel
Santa Cruz Tallboy AL 6.64 lbs QR rear
Specialized Epic 29 M5 6.8 lbs (med) 142x12 rear (carbon version is 5.8 lbs med)
Giant Anthem X 29 1 5.5 lbs (large) QR rear (painted 3 version 5.93 lbs large)
Rocky Mountain Element 970 ?? 95mm 142x12 rear
Intense Spider 29 6.9 lbs (medium) QR convertible to 142x12 rear

3"/80mm travel
Niner Jet9 5.8 lbs QR rear
Salsa Spearfish 5.3 lbs (small) 5.9 lbs (XL) QR rear
(2012 Salsa Spearfish 1 has 142x12, but no weight specs on it yet)

5"/120-125mm travel
Turner Sultan 6.9 lbs (small) 7.6 lbs (XL) 125mm QR rear
Salsa Horsethief sub-7 lbs 120mm 142x12 rear
Yeti SB-95 7.5 lbs 120mm 142x12

I bet the Giant Anthem X 29 gets some more looks after this list. I actually just rode my SF100 with someone on an Anthem X 29 1 today on SART (Santa Ana River Trail), and he was about as fast as me, which was a surprise to me, but I reasoned that it was me basically being kitted out the same way I was kitted for Mammoth (my beefy 850g tires F/R vs his Racing Ralphs and my full face, body armor, elbow and knee pads vs his XC helmet and gloves, my 1850g beefy wheelset vs his Stans Crests, etc.) as something that slowed me down on this XCish trail (that and it was my 2nd time riding it and he had more experience). :p
 
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wow I cant imagine picking a bike because of stand over. I am riding better all around on a bike with zero stand over for me but I find I lean the bike a little and I really don't care. I debated if it was an issue when buying the bike but had almost forgotten it was a issue upon purchase.
 
wow I cant imagine picking a bike because of stand over. I am riding better all around on a bike with zero stand over for me but I find I lean the bike a little and I really don't care. I debated if it was an issue when buying the bike but had almost forgotten it was a issue upon purchase.
I used to think that way, but the increased standover clearance on my SF100 has really saved my nuts on several occasions, from attempting to ride stuff I really had no expertise in. Can't learn if you don't try. If you don't try because it looks like you're nuts are gonna be crushed if you fall, that's partly your bike's fault.

The last instance I remember was me trying to cross a log bridge by riding it. I lost balance mid way and had to put a foot down. Log wasn't wide enough to regain balance and I jumped off with the bike still between my legs. My nuts didn't touch and the first thing I thought, I'm glad I have good standover. If that wasn't the case, you'd probably be on your tippy toes putting your foot down, then tipping over and landing on your side down below or banging your nuts really hard if you did what I did. That's an extreme case. A more common case would simply slipping off your pedal and losing control of your bike. Some of those involved momentarily "riding the top tube" on a steep fast and bumpy descent, before getting a foot on the ground and a foot back on the pedals once slowed down enough or in a less bumpy part.

Last time I busted my nuts was on my 29er HT. Was plowing through a rocky section that was mostly straight, but at a slight decline which allowed you to go really fast. I got bumped off course, to the exposure side of the trail and ended up 6 feet below on the side and got jammed into some trees and shrubs. My balls hit the top tube before I caught a tree to help stop myself from falling further since there wasn't any solid foothold.
 
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I think the hifi / sf100al is going to be about 6.5# I am estimating based on the weight difference of my supercal and new hifi pro. G
 
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I used to shy away from Trek and Specialized and a number of brands. Partly because I thought they were expensive and posers rode them, because the best racers have been winning on them and getting a lot of media coverage. A lot of Trek and Specialized riders on the trail are actually having fun and have a lot to say about how much they like the bikes. Of course, there's some ******bags that are super rich and buy them because it looks good on top of their Audi RS1 or whatever, and only ride them once a month or week on group rides, and Specialized sort of caters to these types, but I think they're the minority. When I finally opened up and stopped with the prejudice and test rode the bikes, I wanted one. They were really good and the prices on them seemed reasonable, upon a little research with a closer look when comparing to the competition. The retail price didn't agree with my bank account, so I found a deal on an used one and now it's my favorite bike by far. I'm going to hold onto it until it's on its last legs and hope an old model clearance sale pops up when that time comes, though I doubt that'll happen, from what I hear from bike shop employees and how the popular models are often sold out.

Treks, in my experience, have no outstanding personality. They're sort of neutral, with a focus on balance, versatility and lightness. I've tried a few bikes with "personality", like extremely stiff and lightweight XC racers, slack aggressive stable descender, nimble play bike that likes to pop off all the rocks and rollers for a little air, and found them to compromise too much in other areas to define their performance in a certain aspect. I ended up with a "bike quiver", collecting a number bikes, each focused for certain things, but I couldn't find a trail that really allowed me to really have all out fun any of those bikes that I could ride as often as I like. 6 bikes in the garage is a bit more for 1 person, so I started to look for that one "do-it-all" bike, which doesn't really exist, to phase out the quiver of bikes and simply keep 1 or 2. I found that the balanced feel of some Treks (Fuel EX, Remedy and SF100 if you count that) is quite possibly the closest thing to fitting that description. They leave something to be desired, where you want to try other people's bikes because they do one thing better, and make you envious, but I find that you can easily go back to the Trek once you find out the many things it does worse (but still acceptable).

There's a lot of bikes out there that are high quality and it's hard to go wrong picking any of them and having a good time riding them, but I think it's simply more of a case of finding what you specifically want in a bike if you are looking for that "perfect" bike. After only a year of riding many different bikes, I've begun to clearly notice the "ride feel" certain manufacturers put into each of their bikes. It just happens that Trek makes the bikes that I feel fit the bill of "do-it-all" best, with their lightweight balance. I'm also a fan of Yeti, for how they pedal so well and accelerate for how much travel the bikes have. Wish I could sort of combine the stiffness and acceleration of a Yeti with the lightweight balance of a Trek, but I think that's impossible, since Yeti "puts weight into the frame" to get that feeling and Trek is more likely to remove that weight and yet try to retain as much capability in the frame as possible. Lighter bikes are more fun, in general, but that speedy acceleration and plush suspension is fun too...

Tough decisions to make, since you may feel that you might regret a purchase and they're not really cheap. I'd say, if you're really into mtn biking, I don't think you'll land your perfect bike that you have no regrets about until at least owning 2 bikes. It might take 12 bikes for some. It all depends on your perceptiveness, senses, and intelligence in figuring out what you're looking for in a bike. Trek has the advantage of having one of the largest teams of engineers and test and design equipment to help make bikes better in general, but then again, they have one of the largest lines of bikes, so choosing between them seems to be more based on what, where, and how you like to ride. The wisest thing to do is to simply pick a bike based on what local trails you ride and not a bike you want to ride on in your dreams, on a track you've seen in pics or videos, thinking you'd grow into it and it'll lead you to be like the riders you've seen shredding those trails if you keep at it and endure through the suffering, assuming the suffering will make you better. Basically, don't forget about the fun and don't be a poser. People enjoy seeing others having fun and approve of choices that are wise and reasonable, but people just look at posers with funny expressions.
 
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Discussion starter · #35 ·
I used to shy away from Trek and Specialized and a number of brands. Partly because I thought they were expensive and posers rode them, because the best racers have been winning on them and getting a lot of media coverage. A lot of Trek and Specialized riders on the trail are actually having fun and have a lot to say about how much they like the bikes. Of course, there's some ******bags that are super rich and buy them because it looks good on top of their Audi RS1 or whatever, and only ride them once a month or week on group rides, and Specialized sort of caters to these types, but I think they're the minority. When I finally opened up and stopped with the prejudice and test rode the bikes, I wanted one. They were really good and the prices on them seemed reasonable, upon a little research with a closer look when comparing to the competition. The retail price didn't agree with my bank account, so I found a deal on an used one and now it's my favorite bike by far. I'm going to hold onto it until it's on its last legs and hope an old model clearance sale pops up when that time comes, though I doubt that'll happen, from what I hear from bike shop employees and how the popular models are often sold out.

Treks, in my experience, have no outstanding personality. They're sort of neutral, with a focus on balance, versatility and lightness. I've tried a few bikes with "personality", like extremely stiff and lightweight XC racers, slack aggressive stable descender, nimble play bike that likes to pop off all the rocks and rollers for a little air, and found them to compromise too much in other areas to define their performance in a certain aspect. I ended up with a "bike quiver", collecting a number bikes, each focused for certain things, but I couldn't find a trail that really allowed me to really have all out fun any of those bikes that I could ride as often as I like. 6 bikes in the garage is a bit more for 1 person, so I started to look for that one "do-it-all" bike, which doesn't really exist, to phase out the quiver of bikes and simply keep 1 or 2. I found that the balanced feel of some Treks (Fuel EX, Remedy and SF100 if you count that) is quite possibly the closest thing to fitting that description. They leave something to be desired, where you want to try other people's bikes because they do one thing better, and make you envious, but I find that you can easily go back to the Trek once you find out the many things it does worse (but still acceptable).

There's a lot of bikes out there that are high quality and it's hard to go wrong picking any of them and having a good time riding them, but I think it's simply more of a case of finding what you specifically want in a bike if you are looking for that "perfect" bike. After only a year of riding many different bikes, I've begun to clearly notice the "ride feel" certain manufacturers put into each of their bikes. It just happens that Trek makes the bikes that I feel fit the bill of "do-it-all" best, with their lightweight balance. I'm also a fan of Yeti, for how they pedal so well and accelerate for how much travel the bikes have. Wish I could sort of combine the stiffness and acceleration of a Yeti with the lightweight balance of a Trek, but I think that's impossible, since Yeti "puts weight into the frame" to get that feeling and Trek is more likely to remove that weight and yet try to retain as much capability in the frame as possible. Lighter bikes are more fun, in general, but that speedy acceleration and plush suspension is fun too...

Tough decisions to make, since you may feel that you might regret a purchase and they're not really cheap. I'd say, if you're really into mtn biking, I don't think you'll land your perfect bike that you have no regrets about until at least owning 2 bikes. It might take 12 bikes for some. It all depends on your perceptiveness, senses, and intelligence in figuring out what you're looking for in a bike. Trek has the advantage of having one of the largest teams of engineers and test and design equipment to help make bikes better in general, but then again, they have one of the largest lines of bikes, so choosing between them seems to be more based on what, where, and how you like to ride. The wisest thing to do is to simply pick a bike based on what local trails you ride and not a bike you want to ride on in your dreams, on a track you've seen in pics or videos, thinking you'd grow into it and it'll lead you to be like the riders you've seen shredding those trails if you keep at it and endure through the suffering, assuming the suffering will make you better. Basically, don't forget about the fun and don't be a poser. People enjoy seeing others having fun and approve of choices that are wise and reasonable, but people just look at posers with funny expressions.
Funny you would say this since I actually have 6 bikes right now and am trying to replace 3 of them with just the 1.
 
I just picked up a 2012 Trek Superfly 100 Elite. My previous bike was a 26'er hardtail. I am happy with the performance of the Superfly for XC trails. I don't notice any pedal bob on the trails I ride.
 
GT Zasker 100

Yo, Got another bike for ya to look at; GT Zasker 9r 100. Rode a demo this Sunday at our Trailspinner's Jamboree, what a bike! It was like "DOPE". Love Gary Fisher bikes have always owned one, current ride is a 2011 Rig HT w/ 1 x 9 conversion. This Gt bike rocks, did a nice 26 mile loop with this baby and it really shines, forget the trail tread this thing is the closest thing to point and shoot I've ever been on. It makes it's own line and delivers an incredible mix of speed, endurance and big hit capabilities in a very light and agile package. Formula brakes were spot on w/ great modulation, DT swiss hubs peromed well and the Fox RP 23 w/ the Kashima coating was superb! Gotta a find a "trek" demo tour and get on the the SF AL to see if this bike can compete??? Whooa dude! did ya hear that?? there's a game changer out there! Possum out.:thumbsup:
 
There is about a $2k difference between the 100 AL Pro and the 100 (carbon) elite. Both have the exact same build except for the frame materials. Any idea what the weight/rigidity difference is between those bikes?
I have a 2011 trek GF hifi Pro, aluminum frame, that weighs 27.6 lbs out of the box w/o pedals. Hope that helps. I love this bike.
 
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