I'll see where this goes. I posted yesterday and the post gets deleted...WTH?
Pros/ cons living in Flagstaff?, from a riders perspective.
Hurricane Jeff
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Well, that's a problem across the west... But Arizona is last in the list for water. This is a real concern.
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At least we still have a 100-year supply, according to the city water resource manager. Phoenix developers got some bad news a couple weeks ago. St. George, UT needs to settle down.
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I lived in AZ (Phoenix) for 14 years. If you are content in Big Bear Lake, I would recommend not changing it for Flag. I wouldn’t do it even in my wildest dream. You currently have a lot of options in Big Bear - skiing (winter), MTBing (summer), the beach about 1.5 hours, interesting desert towns nearby, lots of options for hospitals down the road, proximity to LAX to travel anywhere in the world non-stop which is something people usually want to do more when they retire. Flagstaff is more isolated and Phoenix is your only choice for basically anything. Flagstaff doesn’t even have a Trader Joe’s, LOL. I personally would do the occasional 6-7 hour drive to visit the kid in Flagstaff. Maybe rent or do a home exchange over the summer to spend more quality time.
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What was it that you disliked. That might help.
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Most of the "gnar" trails were destroyed by the Museum Fire in 2019. There Reserves were spared but they don't ride like they used to and haven't seen any maintenance for years. Lookout Road has been closed since that fire so access has been shite. The post fire runoff has gutted the wash below the Happy Ending but you can still ride it, just slowly and you have to stop 8 feet after you hit the flat. A new flow trail is being built here this year and the FS is planning to build a new directional descent in the Ginger canyon but that zone was ground zero for the Museum Fire and the soil sucks. The reserves are on deck as well but who knows how that will turn out, the potentials there if the right person/s build it but if it's the FS and vols I wouldn't expect much in terms of what it could be. We've got our eyes on leaving as soon as we can.
There's potential on Observatory Mesa for some cool down-country stuff but that was shut down and it doesn't look like the ski area is going to do anything in the foreseeable future either. It's a real shame, the potential is here but there's so much of the anti mob crowd and NIMBY-ism that it's hard to get anything going. On the flip side it's not tlike the town is in need of attracting more visitors, it's crowded as F and the traffic through down town is terrible. Arizona can't keep the infrastructure development up with the population growth.
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I lived in Big Bear from 91-95 and I'm sure things have changed plenty since. I haven't lived in Flag, but I am a regular visitor in the winter and make a few trips over the summer. Of the two I think Big Bear offers better mt biking and skiing/snowboarding, if for no other reason than lift served trails and the access that Summit and Bear have to lake water for snowmaking. Flag is great but being located at a major freeway junction makes it feel less remote than Big Bear, which can be good or bad. Both towns are a bad fire away from getting wiped off the map, and its a matter if when and not if. Flag has better access to year round biking given the extensive trails in Prescott and Phoenix and easy-ish access to southern Utah. When I was looking into buying a summer place recently I was a bit surprised to find that Big Bear (well, Sugarloaf and Baldwin areas if not Fawnskin and Moonridge) is still considerably more affordable.
Pros and cons to each but unless you are really looking to move I can't see giving up Big Bear for Flagstaff, but I am admittedly looking at this through the rose colored lenses of time at what was one of the most amazing periods of my life.
Pros and cons to each but unless you are really looking to move I can't see giving up Big Bear for Flagstaff, but I am admittedly looking at this through the rose colored lenses of time at what was one of the most amazing periods of my life.
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Keep hearing about this El Done guy… wonder what tires he likes for south mountain chunk🤣🤣🤣
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I KNOW NOTHING! About this Schultz guy.
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I was there on a Tuesday if that helps answer your question...
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The reason for moving wouldn't necessarily be to improve all aspects of my life. It would to be closer to my son which is currently a hard 6 hours away. The reason I like Flag is that it (I think) a similar climate to BB, has (probably) better trails and more of them then BB. And we are not 100% certain that he will stay in AZ and are keeping that in mind.
What some people don't understand is, Big Bear's infrastructure sucks, with 3, two lane highways leading in and out of the valley, which have closures, sometimes all 3 of them at once, they also get clogged and have spent 6 hours coming up or going down where it typically takes 40 minutes. Sometimes you are just stuck up here in the winter. The crowds in the town during ski season and summer holidays are ridiculous.
Although we have 3 bike parks, 2 lift serviced, I ride them maybe once a year, so not having a lift serviced bike park in not a deal breaker for me.
My questions are basically the quality and miles of trails. I like doing big loops, 30-50 miles with 3k'-6k' of climbing. I sometimes like "gnar" but don't thrive on it anymore.
I also do lots of gravel rides, golfing, fishing, hiking, overlanding/ off roading. Big Bear does offer all these opportunities and would like to live in an area where I could continue with these.
As far as Sugarloaf or Baldwin areas are concerned, yeah, these are typically the most affordable in valley, but you get what you pay for. While doing a little investigating of real estate in Flag, the prices seemed pretty equal to BB, at least what I'm looking for.
Forest fires and water are concerns for both places and pretty much anything out west. I think if I had my way, the east coast would be my first choice.
Thanks for all your replies and keep them coming if you something to add, either pro or con.
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Disclaimer: It's been over 20 years since I lived in AZ (Tucson) so my memory of it might not be totally accurate but one thing I seem to recall is that Flagstaff was quite windy. Can anyone verify?
I also feel like AZ residents in general were cranky.
I also feel like AZ residents in general were cranky.
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No. You will get wind, sure, but no more windy than any other place in AZ...
Here's one factor to consider though, monsoon season. During monsoon season, you may need to be off the mountain by 12 or so. There is often a cycle in late summer where the thunderstorms start building by 10, unleash around noon, and then clear up again (with hero dirt!) in the late afternoon/early evening. This can be absolute heaven in terms of cool temps and it tends to make places like Prescott, Flag, Payson, the Rim, even cooler in the summer after the rain starts and for a few hours after than the altitude would indicate given what it is in Phoenix. In Phoenix, the precip often doesn't reach the ground, just resulting in dust storms. All that said, you don't want to be on a mountain during a thunderstorm in the monsoon season. I've been caught in the wrong place a few times and it only took a few times to realize how bad that was. I distinctly remember coming down Bill Williams mtn when the flash and sound were basically at the exact same time, feeling the compression wave of the air hit me. Apart from getting hit by lightning, hypothermia is a real concern when you're all summered-out with your kit and then there's hail. This is a truly magical weather phenomenon though IMO and it makes for a "second spring" in the SW. You just need to manage it with your riding and look at the forecast and realize when they are building and plan accordingly.
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It may not do everything you want. There are good trails. There are good trails nearby. Highway 40 will close at times...but not for long and if it's due to snow that'll be gone the next day or so.
There are other places, like Bend, Spokane, Leavenworth, Santa Fe, Los Alamos, that have milder winters, drier climates and amazing outdoor/mountain opportunities. Flagstaff does too, because it is predominately a mountain town. Does it to the same extent? No, some of these are better, some are similar. But if you are an outdoor person, Flagstaff is one of those outdoor places. There's not as much riding around Flagstaff as Prescott, but I always thought it was higher quality riding in Flagstaff, better forest coverage, cooler, trails not as loose (even though it gets dry and loose in Flagstaff).
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Very true. Being caught during a monsoon storm is scary and downright dangerous and Flagstaff have those on a daily basis starting in late June/early July all the way until mid September. It reduces drastically your riding time or enjoyment of any outdoor activity during the summer peak period.
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The riding here is getting really good and will continue to improve for your personal interests.
jayem, bring some rain gear and you’ll be ok. Riding after the rain in the afternoon can be glorious and every year is different. Sometimes it’s light other years it’s insane. Monsoon season is the favorite time of the year for a lot of us.
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Hurricane Jeff won't mind. 😅
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Jayem used to live there
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Taco Tuesday's a problem. Got it
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I call BS on riding in thunderstorms being safe. Riding in rain, sure, it's great, especially in the summer. Sometimes the monsoon cycle gets all out of wack and it storms overnight and then it's overcast stratus in the day and it rains and sprinkles. But thunderstorms, hell no, you are playing with fire. From 80+mph downdrafts to hail to lightning, it's nothing to take lightly. I've been on the mountains more than once when the storms start and I've been indoors many more times realizing being outside in those conditions would be dangerous. Huge difference between rainstorm and thunderstorm. The convective activity in AZ can absolutely explode to crazy levels, even a few tornadoes. Luckily, forecasting is quite good for it, especially in determining about what time of day it'll all kick off. Riding after the storms, sometimes as it's still sprinkling, can be heaven for sure.
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