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Understanding clipless pedals

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#81 ·
eatdrinkride said:
Ya Nat.... Totally agree. Having lugs does make a big difference when trying to scramble.

Still, I think most beginners asking these questions are just looking for something that is walkable as opposed to unwalkable. Not necessarily something that can scramble up the loose and muck.

When I first started riding clipless (circa 2005) I bought a pair of Specialized BG Comp shoes because I thought they were the shiznit. They were the shiznit when pedaling but trying to walk on them was absolutely ridiculous. Especially in the loose dirt and crushed granite and rocks of Phoenix. Those shoes were just downright dangerous in those conditions.

Op, lots of options out there from Shimano and 510 and the likes. Outsole lugs are nice but may not be necessary for what you're looking for if you just want walkability. Just stay away from the true race shoes with an uber stiff sole and you'll be safe. You can probably recognize them by their price, lol.
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For sure. On flat ground the flat shoes walk pretty much like normal sneakers. If there’s a tech section to walk down though just watch your step. The heel can slip out from under you if the ground is loose.
 
#82 ·
Tomass79 said:

How about these? And then maybe some 510s . Walking and hiking is a concern. I often hike a bike with my wife when she comes along. Sometimes she just needs a break and we casually push our bikes up the hill together.
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Those are great pedals. Basically the same as the 8120's I mentioned earlier. Some walkable shoes and you'll be good to go.
 
#83 ·
Since you are a beginner, get beginner (cheap) shoes with some flex in them when walking around. Spend no more than $100 and you will be buying shoes you can walk in comfortably. Don't worry about how they are fastened, these are your training shoes for training your brain, and you will be getting something improved after you get the basics down. Use shimano spd pedals mentioned, but be aware those platforms are mainly for show. They do NOTHING functional to be honest. Your shoes should not even touch them when mounted, for ease of exit when you twist. Makes sense? DO NOT use the SH51 death trap cleats to learn on. Get the SH-56 multi-release cleats, hips and elbow pads. Even with the SH56, you will likely get trapped in your pedals at some point, but only when you come to a stop, so you will likely only feel embarrassment. Your hips will thank me. It takes a few months to pick up the "slide out" motion that will become your new normal exit plan, and it will become reflexive. Eventually, it will be easy to claim, "I can get to the ground from my spd's than you can from your flats". I rarely ever exit a pedal intentionally except to stop. With the sh56, pedal strikes will kick me out all the time, but that occasional entry on the fly is far better than being trapped in them because you haven't developed the proper reflex to exit with sh51.
 
#85 ·
About the SH-56 cleats. Your spd pedals will probably come with SH-51 cleats (or no cleats). So, if you're already a solid rider, you could try the SH-51s first & buy SH-56 if you feel you need them. I started on 51s as a total beginner MTB rider and did OK.

One more thing about clipping in: If you ride in 4 seasons, you'll either need different (and pricey) winter shoes or go back to flats in the winter. My summer XC shoes are heavily ventilated. I use Lake MXZ304 shoes for below freezing temps and I have some lake shoulder season shoes too. Not that you need all that but a thin vented shoe is not good in the winter.
 
Discussion starter · #86 ·
eatdrinkride said:
Those are great pedals. Basically the same as the 8120's I mentioned earlier. Some walkable shoes and you'll be good to go.
[/QUOTE
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masterp2 said:
Since you are a beginner, get beginner (cheap) shoes with some flex in them when walking around. Spend no more than $100 and you will be buying shoes you can walk in comfortably. Don't worry about how they are fastened, these are your training shoes for training your brain, and you will be getting something improved after you get the basics down. Use shimano spd pedals mentioned, but be aware those platforms are mainly for show. They do NOTHING functional to be honest. Your shoes should not even touch them when mounted, for ease of exit when you twist. Makes sense? DO NOT use the SH51 death trap cleats to learn on. Get the SH-56 multi-release cleats, hips and elbow pads. Even with the SH56, you will likely get trapped in your pedals at some point, but only when you come to a stop, so you will likely only feel embarrassment. Your hips will thank me. It takes a few months to pick up the "slide out" motion that will become your new normal exit plan, and it will become reflexive. Eventually, it will be easy to claim, "I can get to the ground from my spd's than you can from your flats". I rarely ever exit a pedal intentionally except to stop. With the sh56, pedal strikes will kick me out all the time, but that occasional entry on the fly is far better than being trapped in them because you haven't developed the proper reflex to exit with sh51.
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Thanks
masterp2 said:
Since you are a beginner, get beginner (cheap) shoes with some flex in them when walking around. Spend no more than $100 and you will be buying shoes you can walk in comfortably. Don't worry about how they are fastened, these are your training shoes for training your brain, and you will be getting something improved after you get the basics down. Use shimano spd pedals mentioned, but be aware those platforms are mainly for show. They do NOTHING functional to be honest. Your shoes should not even touch them when mounted, for ease of exit when you twist. Makes sense? DO NOT use the SH51 death trap cleats to learn on. Get the SH-56 multi-release cleats, hips and elbow pads. Even with the SH56, you will likely get trapped in your pedals at some point, but only when you come to a stop, so you will likely only feel embarrassment. Your hips will thank me. It takes a few months to pick up the "slide out" motion that will become your new normal exit plan, and it will become reflexive. Eventually, it will be easy to claim, "I can get to the ground from my spd's than you can from your flats". I rarely ever exit a pedal intentionally except to stop. With the sh56, pedal strikes will kick me out all the time, but that occasional entry on the fly is far better than being trapped in them because you haven't developed the proper reflex to exit with sh51.
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I see what you are saying with the cleats. Good to know there is another set I can practice on. I will most likely be getting some 510s on sale somewhere. Probably from Amazon as I have $100 in points to use up. The pedals won't be here until the end of the month so I have some time to look around yet.
 
#87 ·
I didn't see it mentioned but be cautious of buying bike parts online, especially Shimano stuff on Ebay, unless it's from a known seller as there are a lot of counterfeit parts being sold.

I started out on some Wellgo SPD pedals (like WPD801). They didn't have sealed bearings so I had to replace them every 5 years or so because stream crossings and mud would destroy the bearings pretty quickly. I disagree that the platform of the clipless pedal isn't important. After switching to Shimano XT pedals, I've found the bigger frame is beneficial for when I'm in repetitive, technical switch backs and need to step out going through the turn, I have something more to substantial to push against without having to clip back in.

I initially started out with some Nike "ACG" shoes with laces. They were a PITA because I was always either tightening or loosening the laces (or getting them wrapped up around the pedals :eek:) trying to get them comfortable and the soles weren't stiff enough to really get the benefit of power transfer and stability. Because the cleat was recessed, they were good for hike-a-bike and walking, I actually wore them all day at work a couple times because I'd forgot to bring a pair of shoes to change into (i used them for commuting to work too). But they were hard to clip in/out because the cleat was recessed and, if it was muddy, I'd have to clean that area out with a stick before I could clip in again.

Go to a bike shop or REI, etc., and buy your shoes. At REI, I was able to try on many different pairs and ended up choosing some super ugly Shimano shoes (can't find a model number on mine but they look like the women's SH-WM53 version) because they fit great and had simple velcro straps. I bought those in 2015 and am still using them today. They've held up great getting covered in snow, mud, drenched in water crossings. I just hose them off after the ride if they're dirty. They were cheap too, around $80 if I recall correctly. Only negatives are they're not very comfortable to walk in and pretty sketchy when trying to climb up rock because of the hard plastic/psuedo rubber soles and the cleat isn't recessed much, but the comfort while on the bike, super stiff soles, and ease to clip in/out far outweigh the negatives. The tops are ventilated so 20 degrees F is about my limit in them for cold weather riding. I appreciate people posting what they're using in cold weather temps, I'll have to check those out.
 
#88 · (Edited)
Tomass79 said:
I have been seeing that. The half and half pedal. I have some Saint flats so maybe I should just commit and get the true clipless. Any recommendations on a set for beginners? I would like to keep the entire investment less than $200.
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Like others have said... stay away from half and half pedals. If you want both worlds, the Crank Bros you mentioned are decent. I prefer Funn Ripers. Ride with or without pins, good tension adjustability, don't get clogged up in the muck. Easy to rebuild too, although it will be a long time before bearings or axles need to be rebuilt. Complete rebuild kits are $25. They work great with or without SPD shoes on.
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Regarding SPD cleats (may have been mentioned), they're not all the same. I use Shimano's SH-56's. They allow you to release no matter what your position is on the bike when things go bad. And no, they do not release unintentionally if tension is adjusted correctly.
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Discussion starter · #89 ·
fredcook said:
Like others have said... stay away from half and half pedals. If you want both worlds, the Crank Bros you mentioned are decent. I prefer Funn Ripers. Ride with or without pins, good tension adjustability, don't get clogged up in the muck. Easy to rebuild too, although it will be a long time before bearings or axles need to be rebuilt. Complete rebuild kits are $25. They work great with or without SPD shoes on.
View attachment 2013753
View attachment 2013754


Regarding SPD cleats (may have been mentioned), they're not all the same. I use Shimano's SH-56's. They allow you to release no matter what your position is on the bike when things go bad. And no, they do not release unrepentantly if tension is adjusted corrently.
View attachment 2013752
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Thanks for the input. I am just waiting for some shoes to go on sale. I am thinking of getting the SH 56 cleats as well to learn on.
 
Discussion starter · #90 ·
So I finally got everything and just put the pedals on my hybrid bike on the trainer. So far just pedaling in place seems OK. I can come out pretty easy, still have some trouble getting in but I only tried for a little bit here. I guess my last question would be with the springs on the pedals. Does loosening them just aid in learning and when I become more proficient I tighten then for less chance of coming out during riding? Also the shoes have a good range where I can tighten the cleats. I am also assuming this is just preference of where I feel comfortable pedaling. Just something I will feel overtime where I like them. Thanks for getting me started into all of this everyone. It is currently snowy and 15° in Pennsylvania so hopefully it warms up some and I can try them out on my MTB.
 
#91 ·
I would say, start with them loosest as you are. Once you feel that you're never "stuck" in them and starting to come out of them when you don't want/mean to then start to tighten them one click at a time.

Mine are now as tight as they will go and I come out of them easily without thinking about it.
Regarding placement of the cleats, you can google it but the "classic" is around ball of foot centered over pedal but some advocate rear of that.
You could note where your foot winds up on flat pedals and start by duplicating that.

Don't over think this, just try to be on grass if you fall over!
The best way to do that is to practice getting in and out and flat grass.
 
#92 ·
Clipless pedals tend more towards the ball of the foot than flats for most of us.

You'll answer your own questions as you play around with things. It's all personal pref now. Just go with what is comfortable to you. Less tension seems the way to start for most of us, but who knows...maybe the more positive, deliberate exit under higher tension works better for your mind...try both and see. Most experienced clipless riders do tend towards higher tension.

I use Times so I am accustomed to a lot of float and a lot of twist before I exit.
 
#93 ·
Tomass79 said:
I guess my last question would be with the springs on the pedals. Does loosening them just aid in learning and when I become more proficient I tighten then for less chance of coming out during riding? Also the shoes have a good range where I can tighten the cleats. I am also assuming this is just preference of where I feel comfortable pedaling.
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Yes, you can loosen them up while learning. Don't back the screws out to where they fall out (if that's even possible).

Start with the cleats maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of the way from the heel end of the slots. Move back and forth to preference.
 
#94 · (Edited)
Like others have said cleat placement fore and aft on your shoes is a personal preference. Clipped in I usually ride more on the balls of my feet (like most folks) compared to my natural foot position on flats.

Pro tip:. Your cleats can also be twisted a bit on your shoes, don't feel like they have to be perfectly straight or in-line if you will. I quickly found that in order to have a natural position that my cleats need to be rotated clockwise or counterclockwise a bit to match my foot and knee natural position. I didn't realize that fact until I rode for a while and then rotated them to allow for a more natural foot placement. Of course everyone is different just know that you can do that as needed.

As you probably already noticed they can slide left to right quite a bit as well. It's all about just being in a natural comfortable position when clipped in compared feeling like your heels are being forced too inboard or outboard of the bike.
 
#95 · (Edited)
As you can see with my setup it looks like I push my cleats fully to the outside and they are slightly twisted towards the big toe. I use the two most rear screws but that still falls underneath the balls of my feet pretty well. There is plenty of room to pull them back (rearward) further but when clipped in I don't like tooooo far back.
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#96 ·
Tomass79 said:
So I finally got everything and just put the pedals on my hybrid bike on the trainer. So far just pedaling in place seems OK. I can come out pretty easy, still have some trouble getting in but I only tried for a little bit here. I guess my last question would be with the springs on the pedals. Does loosening them just aid in learning and when I become more proficient I tighten then for less chance of coming out during riding? Also the shoes have a good range where I can tighten the cleats. I am also assuming this is just preference of where I feel comfortable pedaling. Just something I will feel overtime where I like them. Thanks for getting me started into all of this everyone. It is currently snowy and 15° in Pennsylvania so hopefully it warms up some and I can try them out on my MTB.
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Here's what I suggest for clipless "training": You need to put yourself in "oh sh*t" scenarios. Consciously clipping in-and-out is okay, but you need to train your brain to do it intuitively. Normally, I'd tell you to go in a grassy area and practice track stands (or slow speed figure-8's etc). Hold them as long as you can, and clip out before you tip over. This is a good way to trigger your "escape response" without putting yourself in a dangerous situation.

Considering the weather, I'd do the same thing in a doorway of your home. Use the door jamb to catch you before you hit the floor. I was given this advice over 20 years ago, and it worked great for me.
 
Discussion starter · #98 ·
I got out today on my hybrid bike on the bike path. I was able to get in out out pretty well. I even had a few "oh sh*t" moments when my spouse stopped abruptly in front of me due to cars. I was able to get out quickly. I think I will tighten them up a notch next time.
 
#99 ·
Tomass79 said:
I got out today on my hybrid bike on the bike path. I was able to get in out out pretty well. I even had a few "oh sh*t" moments when my spouse stopped abruptly in front of me due to cars. I was able to get out quickly. I think I will tighten them up a notch next time.
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I figured the learning curve would be short!
 
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