Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
Cancel
Create thread New Forums

Coil shocks: Current stack ranking?

1 reading
Jump to Latest
21 - 40 of 254 Posts
#21 ·
ocnLogan said:
EXT Storia
Avalanche'd Bomber CR
Cane Creek DB
Ohlins TTx22M.2
2022 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
2023 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
Bomber CR
Fox DHX2

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
EXT storia is heavily damping and extremely narrow adjuster range.
Avalanche Bomber CR has the most potential.
Cane Creek DB - IMO previous model had better damping curves than Kitsuma but still an option.
Ohlins TTX22 - Solid shocks but generally have a heavy/dead damping feel from stock. Can be revalved to fix.
2022 RS Super Deluxe - Weird damping curves stock, poor parts supply. With Vorsprung Tractive pistons and a revalve has equal potential to modified/tuned Bomber CR and Ohlins.
2023 RS Super Deluxe - Unknown at this stage.
Bomber CR - Reliable but odd stock tune. Can be modifed and tuned to greatness. Avalanche do it, I do it.
Fox DHX2 - Expensive, unreliable and bizarre tunes. Can be custom tuned to fix the bizarre tunes but they have issues with shock bodies cracking on trunnion versions.
 
#22 ·
I had a SDU coil on my titan for most of the time i had it, it was excellent but I had a MM tune and could have used a LL for a bit more grip, but mid stroke was soooo good and i never needed to touch the climb switch. Ive heard the new ones are very good, the HBO is supposed to be excellent. I think it depends what kind of performance you're after though, the DVO and CC options tend to have a more damped feeling ime, the fox i always struggle to get the ideal amount of damping/rebound, and the RS tends to be more set and forget for me, which is my favorite.

Also i think others have said this but Fox durability is quite suspect lately. EXT is supposed to be the best but id rather just pick up a take-off SDU for cheapish and have it tuned down the road if needed.
 
#23 ·
EXT might work for you...it didn't for me. I tried 3 tunes and they were all like jackhammers and I'm consistently in the top 10% of any race here, XC, DH, winning some, etc. I don't care if a shock "feels dead" at slow speed or has slow rebound, I just want it to smoothly blow off/transition for sharp edged bumps the faster I go. My avalanche did. My Ohlins does. My EXT tunes did not.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Cerberus75
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#24 ·
ocnLogan said:
Interesting. The first sentence there seems to contradict the next. As aren't the EXT, and the new Rockshox the only coil shocks with HBO atm?

I seem to remember some of your posts about the EXT. Didn't you have to send it back for re-tuning a bunch of times, and it never got sorted, or something like that?
Click to expand...
No contradiction. I just haven't found a suitable coil shock with HBO to name it as the one for the Titan.

Yeah I went thru multiple revalves with the EXT and got it better but it was a expensive and slow getting it tuned and it was never exactly what I wanted.
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
Sounds like EXT’s design and function seem good, but maybe their custom tunes aren’t always on point, and the storias (maaaybe not eStoria) tuning range is too small to correct it if it’s off. Is that about the size of it?


The Ohlins seems kind of like the EXT in some ways, minus the HBO. Sounds heavily damped, and tune-able, but maybe not perfect out of the box. Doesn’t sound like a lot of reasons to buy an Ohlins over the EXT, especially if I can get the EXT for under MSRP with a warranty and a spring.

The Bomber looks consistently pretty decent, with the option of “greatness”.

Then looking into things, it looks like the Bomber CR is $309, plus a spring then whatever revalving costs ($410 plus shipping for shockcraft, $289 plus whatever of the other options and shipping are for avalanche).

Which means any of the “better” options, are actually fairly close in price.

Thanks for the help so far everyone.
 
#26 ·
ocnLogan said:
Sounds like EXT’s design and function seem good, but maybe their custom tunes aren’t always on point, and the storias (maaaybe not eStoria) tuning range is too small to correct it if it’s off. Is that about the size of it?


The Ohlins seems kind of like the EXT in some ways, minus the HBO. Sounds heavily damped, and tune-able, but maybe not perfect out of the box. Doesn’t sound like a lot of reasons to buy an Ohlins over the EXT, especially if I can get the EXT for under MSRP with a warranty and a spring.

The Bomber looks consistently pretty decent, with the option of “greatness”.

Then looking into things, it looks like the Bomber CR is $309, plus a spring then whatever revalving costs ($410 plus shipping for shockcraft, $289 plus whatever of the other options and shipping are for avalanche).

Which means any of the “better” options, are actually fairly close in price.

Thanks for the help so far everyone.
Click to expand...
I kind of knew I'd need a re-tune with the Ohlins, given the lower-leverage ratio of my GG. One problem for I think just about any aftermarket shock is that many manufacturers are using metric shocks to lengthen the stroke...so lowering the leverage ratios...but the "medium" aftermarket tunes are not coming down to match the lower leverages, so most everything ends up overdamped for a lot of applications. But after the re-tune...crap, that Ohlins was just "glued" to the ground. Like more than any other shock I've owned, crazy traction. That's how I wanted a coil shock to work. One other real good way to describe the EXT coil is that it always felt like an air shock. So overdamped it never had that supple "cling to" the terrain feel, where it's just sucking into the roots and bumps. It was deflecting off all of those small terrain features. The exact place where I usually feel the most difference between a coil and air...except the EXT felt a lot more like an air shock.
 
  • Like
  • Helpful
Reactions: Curveball and ocnLogan
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#27 ·
ocnLogan said:
I've been coil curious for a while, as my current bike (Banshee Titan) is fairly compatibile with a coil, while my old one was not. The problem, is I don't know much at all about coils.

I've got a 205x65mm Fox X2 right now, and while I didn't know it at the time, the fact that I could hear the shock compressing from the day I took it out of the box, is a bad thing. And while I've not had any reliability issues with it so far, I know its a common problem with them. I'll probably try to pick something up sometime around/just after new years, so I'm starting my research/etc for what I want now.

I'm a bit curious about the overall stack ranking of the common options in peoples view. I've read a bunch of older threads here, as well as a fair number of <specific shock> vs <specific shock> sorts of threads, but I'm more curious about the general consensus these days. Especially curious how the new 2023 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil with HBO shakes things up. I also shared the lift this summer with one of the co-owners of EXT USA, and it sounds like I could potentially get one of their demo shocks rebuilt/with warranty at a discount.

And while I'm curious about all models, it looks like the Titan has a known incompatibility list.

Shock Incompatibility: Push 11-6, DVO Jade X / Topaz 2, Suntour TriAir2 and FAST Fenix are not compatible with this frame model. The Manitou Mara Pro requires the short reservoir option, and side knob climb switch.

Here are the main ones I've been thinking about:

EXT Storia
Avalanche'd Bomber CR
Cane Creek DB
Ohlins TTx22M.2
2022 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
2023 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
Bomber CR
Fox DHX2

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I am owning a EXT Storia custom on my NICOLAI (Geometron) G1. before I used a DHX2 2017.The EXT is really nice (especially the HBC and the opportunity as positve consequence to ride a lighter spring) but the difference is not night/day compared to the DHX2, which was pretty good dialed in after a long time. The progression of the frame is 30% so offering themselves for coil shocks. The Fox X2 2021 was nice in my other bike, I would consider it again if the leverage curve of the frame requesting an air shock.
 
#28 ·
half_man_half_scab said:
Regarding hydraulic bottom out, I’m of the opinion that this is a wonderful technology, but implementation matters. The Smashpot I had in my fork kicked in too soon, at 70% travel. I felt it more often than I’d like. EXT kicks in at 85% travel, and this is the perfect position for this feature.
Click to expand...
I think it is more complex than that. You can have an HBO that starts at 70% if the transition is smooth that won't be a problem, and you can have HBO at 15% that will hit like a brick wall. I had some forks on my dirtbike that had that exact problem, something like 25% but the transition and ramp were so strong you would have to ride way undersprung to use the travel or would just hit the HBO and leave 4-5cm of travel unused even on big cases. After a few seasons KTM reduced the HBO cones from 7cm to 3 or 4cm but a good fix was to drill the long cones to make the ramp-up in damping softer and more progressive. I would argue that I prefer a longer smoother ramp that a shorter more abrupt ramp further in the stroke.

Considering EXT Storia, 2 friends of mine had some, both good riders doing regularly in the first 15% overall at local DH/Enduro races, one of them has a history of bling suspension. Both sold these pretty quickly considering at best it wasn't working any better than other shocks and essentially both considered it was over priced over hyped products (the bling friend also had the fork with same conclusion).
 
#29 ·
I had a Float X2 on my Enduro, which was squishy from the get go. Had it overhauled by a very competent shop and it has been good since then. It's not life changing good but it was also easy to get to a good spot.

Went 11/6 though (which I have had before on a different bike) and its just better, because coil and also because of where it is price point. It's a more sophisticated damper, so it should be better.

For price point...I have an SDU air on my TB4. I would not hesitate to try that damper plus a coil in my Enduro, I just wanted to jump straight to the 11/6 all along and top out that bike. For the most part I don't think anyone complains about any of the good coils out there, you just have to pick where along the price point curve you want to land. Anything custom, tuned, or heavily tunable (sophistication) is going to cost more.

For bang for the buck, just to double down...I am very pleased with the stock tune on my air SDU. A tractive tuned SDU plus coil is probably pretty great.

I don't think I've ever read anyone complain about an EXT Storia, Avalanche tuned anything, etc.
 
#30 ·
ocnLogan said:
I've been coil curious for a while, as my current bike (Banshee Titan) is fairly compatibile with a coil, while my old one was not. The problem, is I don't know much at all about coils.

I've got a 205x65mm Fox X2 right now, and while I didn't know it at the time, the fact that I could hear the shock compressing from the day I took it out of the box, is a bad thing. And while I've not had any reliability issues with it so far, I know its a common problem with them. I'll probably try to pick something up sometime around/just after new years, so I'm starting my research/etc for what I want now.

I'm a bit curious about the overall stack ranking of the common options in peoples view. I've read a bunch of older threads here, as well as a fair number of <specific shock> vs <specific shock> sorts of threads, but I'm more curious about the general consensus these days. Especially curious how the new 2023 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil with HBO shakes things up. I also shared the lift this summer with one of the co-owners of EXT USA, and it sounds like I could potentially get one of their demo shocks rebuilt/with warranty at a discount.

And while I'm curious about all models, it looks like the Titan has a known incompatibility list.

Shock Incompatibility: Push 11-6, DVO Jade X / Topaz 2, Suntour TriAir2 and FAST Fenix are not compatible with this frame model. The Manitou Mara Pro requires the short reservoir option, and side knob climb switch.

Here are the main ones I've been thinking about:

EXT Storia
Avalanche'd Bomber CR
Cane Creek DB
Ohlins TTx22M.2
2022 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
2023 Rockshox Super Deluxe Ultimate Coil
Bomber CR
Fox DHX2

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I just got a Rune with a Storia shock. Unfortunately I have been sick for a while now and have not been able to ride it yet. Something I did not anticipate and you may want to consider: the rebound adjuster sits well inside the "shock shell" (for lack of a better word), and it is a royal PITA to turn it without removing the lower shock bolt.
 
#31 ·
I am running a Tractive tuned Super Deluxe Ult Air from 2020 and just wanted to state that ever since I had the Tractive treatment done this shock has been pretty mind blowing for an air shock. In the stock form the SD didn’t track well at all and riding at speed was no where near as confidence inspiring as on my last setup. Previous bike I ran an 11/6 and I loved the way the Push would allow me to hit corners faster with more confidence because grip made it feel like the bike was on rails, especially in high speed berms. If you do get an older SD coil definitely get it Tractive tuned
 
#32 ·
Balgaroth said:
I think it is more complex than that. You can have an HBO that starts at 70% if the transition is smooth that won't be a problem, and you can have HBO at 15% that will hit like a brick wall.
Click to expand...
No doubt, but if the the HBO force is too high, you are going to notice it far more frequently in a design where it acts on a greater range of travel.
 
#35 ·
I had a Banshee Rune v3 for about a year up until this summer and used both Ohlins TTX and EXT Storia on that frame.

Both can be setup and adjusted/customized (Ohlins USA/Shock Howse/Trail Labs, EXT USA, etc) and both are excellent but they differ a bit in ride feel.

TTX is pretty invisible (in a good way), not magic carpet ride uber plush feeling and not as dynamic/active feeling as the Storia. Really good option if you are more of a set it up and not goof around much with settings, all around pretty great shock.

Storia is a bit more active/sporty feeling on the bike, also excellent, has HBO which is nice but not a deal breaker in my opinion as far as other shocks.

Storia is probably a little lighter than Ohilns, the TTX isn't a boat anchor by any means and is in the same ballpark for weight. Have had a Super Deluxe Ultimate Extreme Mega wtf they are calling them at the moment and it is definitely heavier than the TTX and Storia.

Honestly, you can't go wrong with either of these options, definitely not on a Banshee bike, and having something dialed in for your weight, frame curve, and riding preferences is pretty hard to beat.
 
#36 ·
Dougal said:
How many of you guys are bottoming out your rear coils with a bang?
Click to expand...
I think I know where you're going, but not sure. Never in either ElevenSix. The new one has HBO in the last 15% of the travel it says. Don't know if the original version had it. I ride big and fast enough to where I get into that travel, but whether I need it I couldn't say. It does have a smoother feel at the far end of the travel than the Float X2 does but there's a lot of variables there.

Definitely like HBO in the Smashpot and the ACS-3 air spring for the same reason from PUSH, I have both and do feel the need for those up front.
 
#37 ·
I have a SDU RCT coil on a GG with the LL tune. Even with correct sag and spring weight, I feel it's heavily overdamped. So much so that I run no compression, and it still feels like poo. I can't even imagine this platform with HBO. I'll be sending it to Craig over the winter for some love. I don't use the Ramp Control on my Ribbon coil either. I feel it's a crutch for a properly set up fork. I've never ridden air suspension (25 years on nothing but coil) but HBO on a coil may be catering to air riders crossing over to coil.
 
#38 ·
Dougal said:
How many of you guys are bottoming out your rear coils with a bang?
Click to expand...
Frequently with a Van RC - M/M, but my frame is a GT Force 29 Alu which doesn't have a massive progression and a cruve that flattens towards the end. Surprisingly I don't particularly bottom out big jumps as those usually have landing but more with small rocks and steps, usually at low enough speed.
 
#40 ·
Jayem said:
I kind of knew I'd need a re-tune with the Ohlins, given the lower-leverage ratio of my GG. One problem for I think just about any aftermarket shock is that many manufacturers are using metric shocks to lengthen the stroke...so lowering the leverage ratios...but the "medium" aftermarket tunes are not coming down to match the lower leverages, so most everything ends up overdamped for a lot of applications. But after the re-tune...crap, that Ohlins was just "glued" to the ground. Like more than any other shock I've owned, crazy traction. That's how I wanted a coil shock to work. One other real good way to describe the EXT coil is that it always felt like an air shock. So overdamped it never had that supple "cling to" the terrain feel, where it's just sucking into the roots and bumps. It was deflecting off all of those small terrain features. The exact place where I usually feel the most difference between a coil and air...except the EXT felt a lot more like an air shock.
Click to expand...
What GG do you have your ohlins on? I’ve got a Hazzard on my smash that I’m pretty happy with, although I’d love to try a better tuned ohlins. What about the tune did they change?
 
21 - 40 of 254 Posts
About this Discussion
253 Replies
58 Participants
Last post:
bad mechanic
Mountain Bike Reviews Forum
posts
16M
members
534K
Since
1990
A forum community dedicated to Mountain Bike owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about bike parts, components, deals, performance, modifications, classifieds, trails, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
General Discussion Downhill - Freeride California - Norcal Shocks and Suspension Passion