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Help me understand Manitou suspension differences?

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H

hoos

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I am trying real hard to understand Manitou's product line so I know which fork to look at. I just can't figure out what the differences are.

Is it possible to describe the basic differences between a Minute, Machete, Mattoc, and Markhour without resorting to lots and lots of numbers and vendor-specific acronyms? What about Pro/Comp/Expert? I have searched a lot for this and can't find it, and Manitou's site is no help.

It may help to understand where I'm coming from: I just acquired a 2017 Karate Monkey that I'm building up for technical bikepacking. I'd like to have a fork that is reliable, durable, and can handle either 27.5+ or 29 wheels. I will not be DH racing or dirt jumping; just standing on the pedals sometimes and bumping down e.g. Porcupine Rim other times with a bunch of weight on the frame.

I'd love to get a fork for less than $500.

Manitou forks seem to fit the bill, but wow I'm having trouble untangling the different products.

Thanks for any help!
 
#2 ·
Haha, totally understand where you're coming from...just went through this myself. I'm still no expert, but here's what I know:

Minute/Machete/Mattoc/Markhor - some of these are 32mm stanchions, some of them are 34. Some are 27.5, some are 29, some are 27.5+. It sounds like you want 27.5+ or 29, so there's:

- Mattoc or the Magnum, 34mm stanchions (pretty much identical as far as I know, but the Magnum is tuned specifically for larger tires)
- Markhor, 30mm stanchions

There's probably a 32mm variety too, but i don't know it off the top of my head.

Comp shocks are generally spec'ed on bikes (not available aftermarket). I think most of them come with the Absolute+ (ABS+) damper, which is more of a standard platform damper (platform is adjusted via a single knob on the top). There is an ABS+ tuning guide out there on the internet.

The Expert and Pro come with dampers that allow you to adjust HS and LS compression individually. They also have a different air spring, the Dorado air spring, that's a little lighter.


What travel do you need? I have a new take-off Magnum Comp (boost spacing, 27.5+ or 29" up to 2.4, 34mm stanchions, just under 7" tapered steerer, 120mm travel adjustable to 140mm) for sale. Shoot me a message if you're interested, it would be well within your budget. It will be hard to find to a find a Pro model for under $500.
 
#5 ·
Cartridges, travel, and wheel/tire types aside, those four models are ranked below according to their intended use. As you travel down the list, the forks become more durable.

Markhor = XC 30mm, 100-120mm, 3.65-4.17 LBS
Machete = XC 32mm, 80-100mm or 110-120mm, 3.8 LBS
Minute = XC/AM 32mm, 120-140mm, 3.65 LBS
Mattoc = AM 34mm, 80-100mm, 120-140mm, 4.0-4.5 LBS

I've run a Minute the past two years. It is a good compromise between weight and strength. Doesn't slow me down on fast XC trails, and doesn't struggle with the hard stuff.
 
#6 ·
Does anyone know the difference between the Markhor and the m30 except the color of the stanchions? The price on ebay is $150 for m30 and $225 for marchor but there is nothing that says if there is any difference in desighn, performance, weight or durability. All I can see is I think you can convert the marchor from 100 to 120 not sure if this is true about the m30.
 
#7 ·
Kasey1 said:
Does anyone know the difference between the Markhor and the m30 except the color of the stanchions? The price on ebay is $150 for m30 and $225 for marchor but there is nothing that says if there is any difference in desighn, performance, weight or durability. All I can see is I think you can convert the marchor from 100 to 120 not sure if this is true about the m30.
Click to expand...
I know this is a few months late, but I am in a similar boat, and had this same question. Seems like the M30 and Markhor are nearly the same, the only difference being the Markhor can handle more wheel/hub options, and can be adjusted to 80, 100, and 120mm.
 
#10 ·
Memer said:
yep im planning also to buy some new fork i keep researching on between machete and mattoc which is better.

do you guys got idea?
Click to expand...
Machete is 32mm chassis and stops at 140mm. Mattoc is 34mm chassis and goes to 170mm.

If you're doing bike touring or bike packing I steer customers towrads Machete. They have more bath oil volume and can last extremely long tours without any maintenance.

The Mattoc is higher performance and more adjustments but higher maintenance with lower bath oil volumes and lower friction seals.
 
#11 ·
Dougal said:
Machete is 32mm chassis and stops at 140mm. Mattoc is 34mm chassis and goes to 170mm.

If you're doing bike touring or bike packing I steer customers towrads Machete. They have more bath oil volume and can last extremely long tours without any maintenance.

The Mattoc is higher performance and more adjustments but higher maintenance with lower bath oil volumes and lower friction seals.
Click to expand...
Thanks dougal, what if going to trail not too much on rocky thing does machete still include on this type of road? or mattoc is the best here.?
 
#12 ·
Memer said:
Thanks dougal, what if going to trail not too much on rocky thing does machete still include on this type of road? or mattoc is the best here.?
Click to expand...
Depends how big you are and how much travel you need.

I recommend upgrading Machete to the ABS+ damper if the models you're looking at doesn't have that already. It's a big performance improvement over the already good Kwik Toggle.
 
#14 ·
Dougal, I picked up a new old stock 2017 Stache 5 which came with a Manitou Machete Comp. I'm 175lbs(hope to get down to 165 by Summer) and ride rocky, rooty single track here in North Texas. What can I do to my Machete to improve performance? Seems like you think the Kwik Toggle2 is good, but it seems to be binary. Either full open or off. I'm no suspension guru like you. Just trying to understand how to optimize what I have, maintain it, and then ride it until I need to replace it. I really love my Stache. I figure I'll order a OneUp dropper this week. My OEM wheelset will eventually blow a rear hub, but I'll cross that bridge when I get there. if there's a performance gain from a mod to my Machete and not break the bank, I'm game. Appreciate any input. Thx.
 
#15 ·
TXPABIKER said:
Dougal, I picked up a new old stock 2017 Stache 5 which came with a Manitou Machete Comp. I'm 175lbs(hope to get down to 165 by Summer) and ride rocky, rooty single track here in North Texas. What can I do to my Machete to improve performance? Seems like you think the Kwik Toggle2 is good, but it seems to be binary. Either full open or off. I'm no suspension guru like you. Just trying to understand how to optimize what I have, maintain it, and then ride it until I need to replace it. I really love my Stache. I figure I'll order a OneUp dropper this week. My OEM wheelset will eventually blow a rear hub, but I'll cross that bridge when I get there. if there's a performance gain from a mod to my Machete and not break the bank, I'm game. Appreciate any input. Thx.
Click to expand...
Upgrade to ABS+. It's fully tunable instead of the on/off Kwiktoggle lockout.
 
#16 ·
Dougal, Thx! That was a quick response. Do you know if there is any other adjustment/mods that can be done to the OEM Machete Comp 120 that comes on the Stache? I understand that some Markhour forks have travel adjustment. Do you know if that's the case with the OEM fork?

Cheers!
 
#17 ·
TXPABIKER said:
Dougal, Thx! That was a quick response. Do you know if there is any other adjustment/mods that can be done to the OEM Machete Comp 120 that comes on the Stache? I understand that some Markhour forks have travel adjustment. Do you know if that's the case with the OEM fork?

Cheers!
Click to expand...
I haven't seen external travel adjust on a Manitou fork for about 10 years now. Personally the only use I've found for it was shrinking a bike to fit it in a small car.

Internally you can space a fork down in travel and sometimes up depending on the factory configuration.
 
#19 ·
Desertride said:
Dougal, any thoughts on Markhor vs Machete for a very lightweight rider (48-50 kg).

Thanks
Click to expand...
Not much difference. They offer the same spring and damper setups. I recommend ABS+ damper upgrade to everyone if the fork doesn't come with it.
 
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