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Commencal Supreme SX - why no stoke?!

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#23 ·
#27 ·
Has anyone figured out how to run an angleset or offset bushings? I'd like to slack mine out .5 - 1 degree.

I'm considering some offset bushings, it seems like there would be plenty of clearance to run them. Check out the squish videos here:

https://www.pinkbike.com/video/481182/. https://www.pinkbike.com/video/481183/.

I am pretty sure I can get one in the bottom/lower side of the shock, but potentially not one up top due to the design of the metric shock. Check the photo below:
 
#28 ·
@daway, did you manage to put an angleset?
I am on the fence of buying an SX, but the description on the website and the press releases are quite confusing. The head tube should have enough room to accommodate almost everything (https://www.pinkbike.com/news/commencal-supreme-sx-review.html).
At the same time, the info on their page says that the frame comes with an upper cup, and it is not mentioned if it's permanently integrated (part of the headtube) or it is there just for convenience (https://tech.commencal.com/bike/SUPREME-SX-650B-BLACK-2018/287.html). There is another page which suggests that it is semi-integrated but again then says that it has an IS headset in it.
So, is this the first and only frame from Commencal series which comes with an integrated headset, or both cups can be removed and replaced with angle/stretch cups? I wrote to Commencal but decided to ask you guys, as you basically shred with this beast every day and should know for sure. Cheers!
 
#29 ·
I've been trying to figure out from Commencal but I can't seem to get a response either, haha. I gave up on it since it feels pretty good at 65, already have 6 days at Whistler Bike Park and a bunch of shuttle days.

I'm also not an expert on headsets/headtubes...but it's definitely a full 1.5" headtube with a removable upper cup (hence the IS41 under the "tech" section). I haven't actually tried to remove it yet, but I believe the fact that it is a full 1.5" head tube but they list the top cop as IS41 is what is confusing folks. To me, it looks just like a regular headset cup up top that can be removed though.

Also..check out this link: https://www.commencalusa.com/ride-alpha-head-is41-zs56-c2x20562654
 
#30 ·
I got a very detailed response from them :)

The head tube of the Supreme SX is indeed straight, and it's 56mm. The frame comes with two cups, and if you put a tapered steerer fork, you only need a ZS 56 cup at the bottom:
- https://www.commencal-store.com/jeu-de-direction-ride-alpha-is41-zs56-c2x19925565

Concerning the reach adjuster headsets, none is compatible with the Supreme SX :D You can put the Supreme DH V4's ones if you want to put a straight steerer fork:
- https://www.commencal-store.com/jeu-de-direction-ride-alpha-offset-5mm-pour-dh-v4-c2x22194578
For a tapered fork, and a 5mm offset, you can mix two headsets:
- The top part of: https://www.commencal-store.com/jeu-de-direction-ride-alpha-offset-5mm-pour-dh-v4-c2x22194578
- Bottom part of: https://www.commencal-store.com/jeu-de-direction-ride-alpha-ec44-ec56-offset-5mm-c2x19925324

So, if you want an angle set, then you have to find one that matches supreme V4.
 
#31 ·
Haha nice! That's a lot better than I got. Here's the response I got from Works Components (workscomponents.co.uk), which seems to align with what you heard from Commencal:

"If the headtube is the same as shown in the attached image then it would be a 56/56 size and something we can provide a headset to fit - I think there has been some mis-labelling of the type of headset used online which is causing confusion. It is possible that they use an IS headset within the headset cups and therefore call it an IS headset.

Using a tapered fork we would need to produce an upper headcup to suit (not a full custom item, just the correct offset to be used with a tapered lower) but that would be no problem and we will add it to our stock size as there are a number of manufacturers beginning to use this size now."​

They can do 1 degree, can also likely do more. I'm going to ride it a bit more at the stock 65 degree angle for a bit before I decide, as it feels pretty good!

Also...I recently had Craig from Avalanche do the Super Deluxe shock and an open bath damper for the Lyrik up front. Made an awesome bike absolutely unbelievable.

That may contribute to why I don't feel like I need it to be slacker than 65 degrees, since the fork now stays much higher in the travel (while somehow feeling more plush).

The shock is also unbelievable. Feel softer in the parking lot test, but stays much higher in the travel and is much more composed coming off of jumps. Before, it felt like I either had to run the shock super soft to feel good in the rough, but it wouldn't feel composed coming off lips. Felt like I was blowing through travel off of the lip of jumps. And the stock "trail" mode felt like garbage, so I would just tweak air pressure depending on what I was mostly riding.

Craig tunes the Super Delux so you keep the switch, but actually have 3 ride-able modes. I ride the bike in the "trail" middle mode most of the time now for high speed jump trails. I run it wide open for steep gnar (e.g. doubleblack tech at Whistler), and really only use the "climb" mode for fireroads. The bike rides great in all three modes as the compression will still blow off if I take a big enough hit.

The shock mod is a bargain at around $250, I'd highly recommend it over getting a new shock! Just slightly more expensive than a service.
 
#32 ·
Cheers man! The guys at Works Components are always super helpful. I'm a big open bath fan, so I'm for sure gonna follow your path. Also, is the HA indeed a 65, as if you look at the geometry charts, it should be 65 with 562mm a2c fork, and all 180mm 27,5 forks are with 570-580mm of a2c, so it should be in the 64 degrees figures. On this note, I am not entirely sure how accurate their charts are - I asked them about that too :D I am looking at the L frame, and my geeky nature did a quick calculation on the reach number, and they can't be right, or their top tube is not measured correctly, or the seat tube angle is not right :D

So the reach for the L with a 170mm fork is only 456mm (while stated as 467), and with a 180mm fork and an offset headset, it will go to 446mm (which is basically size M). Is your frame indeed with 596mm of effective top tube?
Btw, Commencal announced their 2019 range and it seems like they discontinued the Supreme SX range - I guess I'd be one of the last who joins this vanishing species :D
 
#33 ·
Oh man, yeah that's complex! I haven't gone that far into analysis, haha. I will say...I would wager the reach measurement is accurate. My medium feels just right around the stated 442mm. I also have a large Hightower, which has a reach measurement right around 450mm. Both bikes have a 50mm stem, and they feel very close in terms of reach.

Also, the climbing position on the Supreme SX is WAY more comfortable than my Hightower, which is supposed to have ~74 degree seat angle. I run both bikes with the seat slammed forward in the rails, but again...Supreme feels more comfortable than the Hightower, I feel like I am way less over the back wheel and am sitting much more upright. Super comfortable to sit and spin, despite how heavy of a rig it is with the build I have (doubledown tires, etc.). Perhaps the effective top tube measurement is incorrect then?

Too bad about them discontinuing these bikes in 2019! Grab one before they are gone. Although...those new Clash bikes (mini furious) also look pretty sweet.

Here are a few more pics of mine for some more stoke:





 
#35 ·
One of the best darn comments I've heard in a while!

I'm looking to get myself an enduro. I've got myself a trek HT for my XC rides, Moto Hal5 for Trails. And came across this brand and love their Meta AM rigs.

Mr Pig said:
Commencal are under a lot of people's radar, which is a shame as they build good bikes.

They used to sell in shops but weren't happy with the way that worked out. The big brands got the best representation on the shop floor and Commencal typically found themselves in smaller, backwater shops. It kinda gave the impression that Commencal bikes were not as good as the big brands.

So they switched to selling direct, passing the saving onto the customer. The down-side is that now they have no presence in the shops at all. A lot of people find it hard to buy a bike they haven't seen in the flesh although I think that's changing.

Basically, I think the brands who sell bikes conventionally and play the established game get the best publicity. Commencal feel like outsiders in some ways but to be honest I quite like that. I like not having a Giant, or a Specialized or a Trek. Going to a trail centre and having the only bike like mine in the car park. Who wants to be a sheep?
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#36 ·
daway said:
Oh man, yeah that's complex! I haven't gone that far into analysis, haha. I will say...I would wager the reach measurement is accurate. My medium feels just right around the stated 442mm. I also have a large Hightower, which has a reach measurement right around 450mm. Both bikes have a 50mm stem, and they feel very close in terms of reach.

Also, the climbing position on the Supreme SX is WAY more comfortable than my Hightower, which is supposed to have ~74 degree seat angle. I run both bikes with the seat slammed forward in the rails, but again...Supreme feels more comfortable than the Hightower, I feel like I am way less over the back wheel and am sitting much more upright. Super comfortable to sit and spin, despite how heavy of a rig it is with the build I have (doubledown tires, etc.). Perhaps the effective top tube measurement is incorrect then?

Too bad about them discontinuing these bikes in 2019! Grab one before they are gone. Although...those new Clash bikes (mini furious) also look pretty sweet.

Here are a few more pics of mine for some more stoke:

View attachment 1208391

View attachment 1208394

View attachment 1208392

View attachment 1208395
Click to expand...
Long time no see - I went on vacation without a laptop and I couldn't enter the forum on my phone as it was detected as a bot :D
I'm more than stoked, and your build is fabulous. Commencal did check the reach for me, and reassured me that it was correct (which is enough for me) - they mentioned that they have some offsets here and there, which are not specified hence the impossible calculations.
I can't wait for the bike, and I'm still wondering if the L frame (50mm longer seat tube than the M) is going to accommodate the 170mm OneUp Dropper completely flushed to the seat tube, but I guess I'll see :)
 
#38 ·
Has anyone used the SX for enduro racing? I have the supreme DH 29 and love it, so I was about to order the SX but was dissuaded by the commencal store guys, who said it doesn't pedal well enough. If anyone has real world experiences on the SX in enduro, would appreciate hearing them. Thanks.
 
#39 ·
csm024 said:
Has anyone used the SX for enduro racing? I have the supreme DH 29 and love it, so I was about to order the SX but was dissuaded by the commencal store guys, who said it doesn't pedal well enough. If anyone has real world experiences on the SX in enduro, would appreciate hearing them. Thanks.
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I have one, and like it quite a bit.

For something like an enduro type, race, I'd most def go for something more similar to the Meta AM. The SX is a monster downhill, but you will not be happy on your up/transition/climb bits. It'll get it done, but not great.

I've a 2016 Meta AM as well, and would totally opt for it over the SX for any kind of race other than a pure DH kind of thing. The AM doesn't lose out too terribly (depending on setup) on the downs compared to the SX, but on anything flat or uphill, it just kills it.

Built up my SX to get rid of my full DH rig that was just too big/cumbersome/more than I want/need at the lift spots I frequent. Wanted something that even if it isn't great for doing so, at least I *could* pedal it on my local trails, unlike the DH bike.
 
#40 ·
scrublover said:
I have one, and like it quite a bit.

For something like an enduro type, race, I'd most def go for something more similar to the Meta AM. The SX is a monster downhill, but you will not be happy on your up/transition/climb bits. It'll get it done, but not great.

I've a 2016 Meta AM as well, and would totally opt for it over the SX for any kind of race other than a pure DH kind of thing. The AM doesn't lose out too terribly (depending on setup) on the downs compared to the SX, but on anything flat or uphill, it just kills it.

Built up my SX to get rid of my full DH rig that was just too big/cumbersome/more than I want/need at the lift spots I frequent. Wanted something that even if it isn't great for doing so, at least I *could* pedal it on my local trails, unlike the DH bike.
Click to expand...
Very helpful response. Thanks.
 
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