Mack_turtle----thanks for responding but seriously just saying something is BS is not helpful for the person asking--all we know is you think it is BS ---do you have any info on how a bike fit should be done these days with the new GEO and having some out of the regular body type?
sorry, I was brash with my initial response. I read too much of this kind of stuff and I assume everyone has read all the stuff about the irrelevancy of KOPS that I have. that's in indication that I need to read less and ride more.
KOPS has been debunked by many cycling gurus for decades. do a quick search online for "knee over pedal" and you'll immediately find Keith Bontrager's "
The myth of KOPS," which should have put the last nail in that coffin almost 20 years ago. it sticks around because of memetic inertia. it provides a simple solution to a complex problem, so people like it. unfortunately, the knee-over-pedal position only has a corelative relationship with pedaling dynamics and bike fit. (how to people set speed records on recumbent bikes, KOPS on a bike that has you basically lying on your back?)
I encourage people not to get too caught up on it. I was caught up on it for a long time too, but the alignment of your knee over your pedal means nothing as soon as you stand up, ride up a hill, steer, or ride down a hill. throw suspension in the fork and frame into the mix and you might as well fit your bike by reading tea leaves. it was a useful way to approximate balancing a rider's CoG on a road bike at one time, but I have little faith that it's even useful for that on most modern bicycles.
if you have fit your bike by the KOPS method because someone told you to do that in the past, you've probably become accustomed to riding with your saddle in that position. I, too would like to hear from the collective wisdom of the forum whether they have been able to adapt to new positions. I would also be curious to hear from a frame designer what they think about it. I was also worried when I bought my last frame as I started looking at all the steep STAs on newer frames.
I would like to hear from a frame builder. obviously different designers take different approaches and have their reasons. Jeff Jones seems to put some crazy-slack seat tubes on his frames but most others are OK with 74-75 degrees.
I have found that it's more important to get the effective stack and reach (horizontal and vertical distance between the BB and the handlebar) than the saddle offset to fit any bicycle, but my experience in this regard is limited.
