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Why are the new carbon Santa Cruz Tallboys so heavy?

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Edslittleworld

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I just bought a 2017 carbon Tallboy (yellow) with SRAM NX and it weighs 28.4 pounds with no pedals or accessories. In comparison, my 2015 aluminum Tallboy (white) with Shimano XT only weighs 29.8 pounds and that's with a 2X crankset and fully accessorized. Are bikes just getting heavier?
 
#2 ·
The SRAM NX groupset is entry level so it weighs more. I would also guess that the wheels are really heavy. If you move up to a higher tier groupset and wheels, you’ll shave some weight.

As a matter of fact, any entry level carbon bike is about a pound or 2 heavier than the top of the line version. I thought this was common knowledge?
 
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#3 ·
A Carbon frame is no longer synonymous with light weight. Carbon frame weight have been crawling up in an effort to make them stronger and there isn't a big different between AL and Carbon frames anymore.

Take a SC HT CC, from what I can find the med frame is 5.88 lbs. That's the lighter version.

the AL GG Smash is 6.6lbs in a med.
 
#4 ·
TB3 "C" frame is 6.5 vs. 5.4 for a TB2

Fox 34 is heavier than the RS 32.

SRAM NX kit is heavier all around than XT

Minion/Aggressor vs. SB8's....really?


It all starts to add up quickly.
 
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#6 ·
Tallboy carbon 1 & 2 were 5lbs in large and Tallboy LTc was 5.3lbs with shock in large.

I do know the current Tallboy in Medium is 5.3lbs with shock, I don't know what the large is at.
 
#7 ·
Basic wheels, average drivetrain, average cockpit. Durable, capable and reasonable weight? Yes. I weigh 195 and 28lb trail bike is good for me given Ive broken 3 lighter bikes in the last 12 months
 
#8 ·
I think me, and most of the people I ride with, have started to build up bikes to be more capable descenders, and thus a little heavier. I know my tires alone now add almost a pound more to the bike. Worth it! Add to that heavier rims, pedals, dropper, etc. And even with all of that, the weight savings of the carbon frame make it where it is almost the same weight as my previous aluminum bike.
 
#9 ·
mtnbikej said:
TB3 "C" frame is 6.5 vs. 5.4 for a TB2

Fox 34 is heavier than the RS 32.

SRAM NX kit is heavier all around than XT

Minion/Aggressor vs. SB8's....really?

It all starts to add up quickly.
Click to expand...
I was wondering about the weight of my 2017 Tallboy 3 "C" Frame. I have a Medium, what size is yours and did you actually weigh it or did you find the weight somewhere online? Does the weight listed include the shock?
 
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#10 ·
jn24uk said:
I was wondering about the weight of my 2017 Tallboy 3 "C" Frame. I have a Medium, what size is yours and did you actually weigh it or did you find the weight somewhere online? Does the weight listed include the shock?
Click to expand...
Santa Cruz Tallboy 3 XX1 AM29 review - BikeRadar USA

"That's why, while some 100 to 120mm travel race focused bikes with a Race Face Next SL and XX1 build would be rolling out at around 10kg, our sample just scraped under 12kg. The reason is the frame is built tough not feather light at 2.7kg (6lb) for a large"

They do not specify whether that is for CC or C frame....but the build kit is XX1. The C frame is about 1/2 lbs heavier than the CC frame.
 
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#11 ·
New frame is .5lb heaver and they put a .5 heaver fork on it. So with an otherwise identical build it will be 1lb heaver. Now you are getting a lot more capable bike for that 1lb difference.
 
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#12 ·
alexbn921 said:
New frame is .5lb heaver and they put a .5 heaver fork on it. So with an otherwise identical build it will be 1lb heaver. Now you are getting a lot more capable bike for that 1lb difference.
Click to expand...
Considering SC allowed a 140mm Fork on the original TBc, I doubt the frame itself is that much stronger.
 
#13 ·
TwoTone said:
Considering SC allowed a 140mm Fork on the original TBc, I doubt the frame itself is that much stronger.
Click to expand...
The 140mm limit was with a 32mm fork. The 32mm is about 10mm shorter than the 34mm forks.
Having ridden both bikes, I can say without a doubt the the 3 is significantly stronger. The TB2cc I was riding had a fox 34 as well so it's apples to apples. It is most noticeable in the rear end. The extra 10mm is nice too.
 
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#14 ·
If it is going toward stiffness and strength (and likely that is the case here), I will take 1 extra pound in the frame all day long.
 
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#15 ·
One of the problems is buying a complete bike. You are stuck with whatever they put on there. 28.4lbs for an XC bike with around 100mm of travel is pretty heavy, as mine is 22.something with a carbon frame that is at least as heavy as yours, but that's because I built mine. I only buy frames and then I build them up how I want them. I don't necessarily benefit quite as much as far as parts-packages as far as cost, but it's worth it for me to get the stuff on there that I want and I tend to still not spend anywhere near the 8-10K that some bikes currently cost and I don't end up switching a bunch of stuff out either.

Carbon rims, DT swiss 250 hubs, NEXT cranks, 100mm stepcast fork, X01 cassette and derailleur, xpedo pedals, 2.2ish XC tires, etc. Of course, it's a give and take, if I want to meet a weight target, I simply have to pony up and put some $ down on the parts that make it light. A low-end SC build is not going to be like this.
 
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#16 ·
The Santa Cruz bikes are built tough--good for the rider, as you don't have a bunch of small warranty cracks to deal with. Also, with the Santa Cruz warranty, they need to make the bikes last or they will pay out soooo much in warranty claims. Also, people love the molded in tubes for cable routing. That adds to the weight.

As mentioned, all the little bits and a stout fork add up.

If you want a similar style of bike with less weight consider the Rocky Mountain Element. Better climbing with light weight, stiff pedal platform, less frame weight. Not quite at stiff and stout pointed downhill.

No free lunch.
 
#17 ·
Did you weigh the aluminum bike with your purse on it? ;)
Like others have said, 5 pounds 3 ounces for a medium 29er frame in the CC flavor (according to one site, but info is hard to come by) seems pretty nice. It's the stuff you put on it that increases the weight. I used to be a "dollar a gram" guy, but now that I'm trying to spend the kids' inheritance, I'm up over $2 a gram for my bike and my wife's. Anyway, it seems that when Santa Cruz and Yeti, at least, put their builds together, featherweight is not a high priority. But you have a nice bike, enjoy it!
 
#18 ·
DHF/Crossmark combo is 1.25 lb heavier then Kenda SB8. Switch tires between bikes and the TB2 would weigh 31.05lb and your TB3 goes down to 27.15. Move the forks between bikes and the TB3 wight goes to 26.5lb and the TB2 add .5lb and now weighs 31.5lb.


Just adding the same tires and fork that the TB3 has on it, the TB2 is not really comparable. The fork and tires make the TB3 more capable while keeping the weight lower. If you want a lighter bike, lose the dropper, change tires to Scwalbe lite skin Thunder Burt tires 435g vs 925g for DHF. TB3 would weigh 25.7lb, but then it would really be as capable as a Tallboy 3.
 
#20 ·
Tires are a horrible place to skimp on weight. The bikes is plenty light as it is. I wouldn't change tires or lose the dropper personally. I would run DHF/DHR2 combo, but I'm not worried about weight on my bikes.

As the saying goes:

Low price, low weight, high durability. Pick two.

Was just pointing out the differences that components make to the weight and capability of the bike.
 
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