Help me with my drivetrain setup!

aeviannce24 · May 30, 2016

Hi everyone! I'm new here and I need help with the drive train I want to setup.

I'm currently running on a 3x8 setup and planning on shifting to a 1x10.

As of now, the setup parts I'm going for would be in this configuration:

Race Face NW 30T + Race Face Crank (no model yet, preferably Respond or Ride)
SRAM GX 2x10 Derailleur + Shifter + Chain
Sunrace 40-11T Wide Range 10 Speed Cassette
Shimano Deore XT Rear Hub

Now for my questions:
I have a Cannondale Trail 6 Frame, I'm sure that I need to change my BB to match with RF Crank but I'm not quite sure what BB is compatible (since I'm still learning about BBs atm). If it helps, I have a Tange LN 3912, squared tapered as my current BB. What would be a good compatible BB for this setup?

Would it possible to run a short cage SRAM GX for this setup? If not, what cage size would be the best?

Any thoughts on this setup? I would surely love to hear them!

Some other note: I'm planning on changing my wheelset to 27.5+ down the line. Hopefully this setup would have enough clearing.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for those who would help!

bvibert · May 31, 2016

If you get a new crank it should come with a new BB, use that. To answer your question though: no, your current square taper BB will not work with either of the above crank choices (nor any modern crank designs).

I'm not really up on SRAM rear derailleurs, but you may be able to just get away with a short cage on your hard tail.

shortnangry · Jun 1, 2016

A square taper BB is an English thread 68mm BB shell. The crankset typically comes with a BB. Choose the 68mm threaded option. Sometimes you'll see it 68/73 because the same threaded BB fits either a 68 or 73mm BB; you just change the spacers. If you're doing the work yourself you need different tools to remove the square taper than to install the new external bearing BB. Also know that the drive side is left thread (NOT righty-tighty). Derailleur cage length depends on the total change in cogs and chainrings. On a 1x hardtail, it's very straight forward: for an 11-40 cassette the required capacity is 29, the difference between 40 and 11. Check SRAM's specs for the capacity but a short cage should be fine. I've never used a Sunrace cassette so I can't comment on that. I doubt you'll be able to run plus sized wheels and tires. The frame won't have the space. The Suntour fork also won't have the space. Consider too that even if you could fit the plus wheels, you may not like it. The rear dropouts are 10mm quick release. It won't be stiff enough when you get rowdy. In the front it's a 1 1/8 straight steerer tube and quick release; not stiff enough for getting rowdy. The plus wheels beg for a stiffer connection. That doesn't mean you can't use a sweet 2.3 to 2.4" wide tire and have a blast. Compared to the 2.0" tires the bike comes with you'll think you're on plus tires. Enjoy.

noapathy · Jun 1, 2016

Question 1: Why do you need a new crank? Good news is if your current crankset is fine, you can just put the narrow wide on there and skip buying a new one. Just make sure the BCD is the same before buying.

Question 2: Why do you need a new rear hub? 8 speed uses the same cassette as 10 speed. Also, if you get a new hub you'll have to re-lace the wheel or get someone to do it for you.

The SRAM stuff with the Sunrace cassette seems like a decent combo if you need the extended range.

aeviannce24 · Jun 1, 2016

Hi guys! Thank you for your replies. Your comments made some parts already clear for me (as I would be ordering much of these parts online, I'm a bit hesitant to decide).

To answer your questions:

@bvibert: Unfortunately, I live in the part of the world where cranks cost as much as gold and with no bottom bracket included (let alone, a decent chainring). Besides, I've read a lot of negative reviews on the x-type hubs which normally accompanies a Race Face crank, so I opt to give Shimano XT Hollow Tech II BB a go. (BTW, mines a BB30, which needs a shimano adapter, I'm pretty sure. Yey for knowledge!)

@shortandangry: Thank you for that calculation! Now I'm quite decided on getting a short cage instead of a medium one. Oh, and are you sure about the 27.5+ conversion not possible? My hardtail has 29er wheels atm, and I do plan on getting an Epicon 15mm thru-axle to replace my existing fork. I've read somewhere that the WTB Trailblazer 2.8 27.5+ tyres were made seemingly for the sole purpose of the conversion. As for the rear wheel replacement, I can't say much other than for the sole reason of BLING! even if they're just 10mm (though I hope there is a bolt conversion for this...)

@noapathy: Answer 1: Unfortunately, my crank is kinda fixed to all the chainrings it has (sorry, I forgot the right term for it), so I have no choice other than getting a new crankset so I could shift to a single NW chainring.

Answer 2: I am uncertain on the quality of the current hubs that I have. I've tried checking the specs of my hardtail online, seems like its just a generic hub. Plus I do intend on upgrading my fork with a 15mm thru-axle, so might as well get a set and put it in the back.

Thank you for the confirmation on SRAM x Sunrace combo! Thats just what I needed!

shortnangry · Jun 1, 2016

No, I'm not sure that 27.5+ won't fit but I wanted to make certain that you're sure that it will fit before you commit time and money to it. The Trail 6 specs I saw showed the bike as 27.5, sorry about that. Even if it's a 29-er, the 27.5+ is not guaranteed to fit. You have to check the space between the rear stays. Just for reference, Nobby Nic 27.5 x 2.8 is 70mm ETRTO width and 3.0 is 75mm ETRTO. You would need about 75mm space between the stays to run 2.8 and 80mm to run the 3.0. WTB doesn't list the ETRTO width for its tires, but I imagine it's around around 70mm. Even though WTB says the Trialblazer is a good 29" conversion, that doesn't guarantee it'll fit your bike. Just check to make sure. Also, the Trialblazer is TCS which is a WTB proprietary bead similar to UST. It is a tight fit designed for its TCS rims. It doesn't play nicely with all rims. If you use a WTB tire make sure it will play well with whatever rim you use.

Are you sure the BB is BB30? A square taper BB is threaded with a 3-piece crank. BB30 has bearings that sit in the BB shell similar to press fit systems, and a two-piece crank (not square taper). From what I saw of the Trail 6's price point and its other spec, I'd be shocked if a BB30 was on the bike or anything other than a threaded sealed bearing BB. I have only seen bikes in this category with square taper, ISIS or Octagon crank and spindle in a threaded sealed internal bearing BB.

You can certainly upgrade your fork and go to a thru-axle, but remember that the 1 1/8" steerer is only so stiff. Even if you can find a 15mm thru-axle 27.5 or 29 fork with a 1 1/8" straight steerer, you won't get all of the benefits of the thru-axle. The only Epicons I saw with straight steerers and thru-axle were 26". Will the head tube accommodate an external 44mm cup to allow the use of a tapered steerer?

It sounds like you're totally refitting the bike. Wheels and suspension fork are the two biggest ticket changes on a hardtail (and make the biggest difference). Drivetrain is the second biggest ticket. Bear in mind the frame only goes so far and you are limited by the frame geometry and spacing. I don't use "limited" in a negative way; just know the geo and spacing bounds what you can do with the bike no matter what components you change. Of course this is true for any bike. This is also usually a more expensive way to build a bike. I'm definitely not trying to dissuade you in any way, but do want to make sure you are certain about what you're getting into and what you want to accomplish.

noapathy · Jun 1, 2016

shortnangry said:
It sounds like you're totally refitting the bike. Wheels and suspension fork are the two biggest ticket changes on a hardtail (and make the biggest difference). Drivetrain is the second biggest ticket. Bear in mind the frame only goes so far and you are limited by the frame geometry and spacing. I don't use "limited" in a negative way; just know the geo and spacing bounds what you can do with the bike no matter what components you change. Of course this is true for any bike. This is also usually a more expensive way to build a bike. I'm definitely not trying to dissuade you in any way, but do want to make sure you are certain about what you're getting into and what you want to accomplish.

Plus size wheels, new fork, new drivetrain - I wouldn't put all that $$$ and effort into this bike. Screw up the fork offset, the bike rides like crap. Plus size wheels don't fit, bike doesn't ride at all. Wheels fit, but barely - ride in even slightly wet and you're rubbing the frame. I love to wrench on bikes as much as the next guy, but this just isn't a good plan.

Take that $1000+ you'd end up shelling out for all these parts, add it to the couple hundred you could probably get for your current bike if it's in ok shape and go find an awesome used hardtail that has most of your wishlist already. Less time, frustration and more riding. Just my 2 cents.

aeviannce24 · Jun 2, 2016

@shortandangry: Thank you for the advise and yes, that is what I intend. Fortunately, 27.5+ tyres and rims are available here and I can test them out before actual purchase.

As for BB30 no. Not really. It's just that it was Cannondale who made BB30s- so I assumed that my frame which was made by Cannondale, has BB30 shell. On a side note, the higher spec'd models of the Trail series have Shimano BB51 Hollowtech as bottom bracket. I'm planning on getting an XT version of this, so I guess it'll be fine.

A bike mechanic mentioned that it is possible for this frame to have an adapter for a tapered tube. However that would cost me like a couple of bucks more than what I'm willing to shell out. If tapered steerer is the best way to go, then I guess I'll make room for this.

Truth to be told, I was bitten by the upgradititis bug. But I've researched quite a bit and decided that with the upgrade of the fork and the drivetrain, its like upgrading this bike to be on par with Trail 1 which I think is still well within the limits of the frame.

As for the plus size tyres- they're more of a personal preference, but if they prove to be more trouble than they're worth, I have no qualms on forgoing this "upgrade."

@noapathy: That was the original plan. However, in this side of the world, its unlikely that I'll be able to find a 2nd hand bike that would satisfy my chauvanistic tendencies to certain brands, not to mention the cheaper price tag.

noapathy · Jun 2, 2016

aeviannce24 said:
As for the plus size tyres- they're more of a personal preference, but if they prove to be more trouble than they're worth, I have no qualms on forgoing this "upgrade."

@noapathy: That was the original plan. However, in this side of the world, its unlikely that I'll be able to find a 2nd hand bike that would satisfy my chauvanistic tendencies to certain brands, not to mention the cheaper price tag.

Good about the tires. Don't tell anyone, but I think that's more of a fad.

Too bad about availability - excuse to take a vacation in Taiwan? I hear they make a few bikes there. Either way, good luck!

Help me with my drivetrain setup!

aeviannce24

bvibert

shortnangry

noapathy

aeviannce24

shortnangry

noapathy

aeviannce24

noapathy

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