Travis's Diamondback Sync'r 24 From Santa😉!

Spectre · Dec 31, 2015

cyclocrossen said:
Hi Freakah,

I have the same bike on the way but ordered it from Sports Authority with a discount and coupon code. I am curious if the build is the same as stated or has the changes that were included with your purchase.

Anyway, I have a question I was hoping you could answer. I have a new set of cranks here to switch out with the stock ones but would like to know the bottom bracket size and spindle length? Could you help me with this information?

Also, would you mind providing me an axle to crown measurement in mm? I have a Suntour XCR LO Air 24 on the way as well. I ordered it way before Christmas to replace a fork on my sons Kona. Since then I decided to get a new bike and am entertaining the thought of switching it out with the one on the Diamondback if it is a lot lighter and close to the same length. it is only 63MM of travel so I am guessing it may be 18mm - 20mm shorter.

Have you two had a chance to test it in the trails yet?

Thank you for any info you are able to share with me.

Weight of the XCR Air is 1832 g with an uncut steerer. Crown to axle measurement is 430 mm.

FREAKAH · Dec 31, 2015

Awesome! I hope yours comes equipped the same way as ours did.

The axle to crown measurement is around 432mm. I thought about getting an air fork, but after checking out the Suntour catalog I noticed they sell the 24" LO air cartridge for the XCR fork for around $60, so I might get that instead. I hope it works with the Sync'r's 75/80mm fork.*

As for the cranks, I haven't taken it apart yet. I did just receive a Suntour 152mm crankset that I ordered, but I didn't measure the bottom bracket width yet so I can order the square taper bb.

I'm taking my boy on his first trail ride with the bike this Sunday. We'll be riding along with two other father/son groups so it should be fun for him.

cyclocrossen · Jan 1, 2016

Thank you for the info! That is the same crank I bought from a friend and plan to install. If the fork was not already purchased I doubt I would consider it at the moment. It is funny, I ordered it on the 23rd and will not receive it until after the bike is here. I ordered the bike on the 29th. On the listing it shows the axle to crown is 415 and the weight is 1832. I am curious to take off and weigh the fork that comes with the bike. If it is 432 I think the 17mm difference may be alright. When I get both I will post the weight difference. Maybe I will let him ride it with both forks and let him choose what he likes better? Like you Freakah, I enjoy to tinker. I would like to look into the air conversion for the 80mm fork that it comes with. With a 70 lb. rider I am not sure if 63mm of travel compared to 80mm will make any difference.

Please give me a post trail review on it. I wish you a great New Years and enjoy the ride!

FREAKAH · Jan 4, 2016

Well, Travis had a great time at the trails today with his new bike! The first thing I noticed is that the front fork is a bit stiff for his weight(he's a small 60lb 10yr old). Still, it compressed on the bigger bumps, roots and landings, so at least it's doing its job and softening some of the blows. I like the extra travel this fork gives over the 63mm F1RST and Spinner air forks so I hope the Suntour XCR Lo air cartridge that I want to get works with this fork and still keep its 75mm travel.

As expected, the bike kinda bounced around a lot, again I think due to his weight. I ran both tires at 23psi so I think I'll bring it down to 20, or maybe lower for the next outing.

As for the gearing, I think he managed quite well on the climbs with the 32/36 considering the bike's 27.5lb weight, but I think he still could use a lower gear. I'm hoping the slightly smaller RRons will bring it down a bit so I'll have to wait and see.

Speaking of tires, I ordered a pair of RRons from Spectre and I have decided to use only one for the rear because, despite their weight, I want to keep the more aggressive Kenda Kinetics on the front for more bite.

It seemed he did good with the 165mm cranks, but I think he will still benefit from the shorter 152 that I had ordered earlier. I do wish there were cheap 155mm 104bcd cranks available though, since that arm length is what he uses for his BMX race bike. The bike's higher than usual bb makes it easier to clear logs and such, and there wasn't any rock strikes that I noticed, even with the longish 165mm cranks.

So after today, I'm thinking the only things I'm going to change, besides the performance related tire, air cartridge, and maybe gear change, is the brake rotors from 180/160 to 160/140, using the stock 160 from the rear, to the front, and a KCNC 140 for the rear, and change the heavy seat post to a Ebay Chinese carbon one. The seat post change, along with rotor size reduction, losing the front adapter and related bolts, and the lighter ti bolts, should be the most economical changes to reduce some weight.

Well, I think I...um Santa, made a great choice! I'm very happy with the bike, and so is Travis, especially since he had one of the coolest looking bikes on the trails today! It's a very capable bike at factory spec, and if you're fortunate like we was, it's even better as ours was equipped. Either way, if you can find one below $700, I think it's one of the better bikes in its class. If you see it at Amazon again for $495, don't hesitate!

cyclocrossen · Jan 5, 2016

Thank you for the review!

I am excited that the build received was the same as yours. Well, minus the tires being Kenda. Looking at weights I bet it would be close to a lb. difference from the RR's. I think for now I will let him run the Kendas and order the RR down the road. The larger footprint may give him some added confidence for now. I usually run both my boys tires at 20 psi and have never had a pinch flat yet. These tires are beefy and have a good sidewall so I bet you can get away with a little lower yet.

My 11 year old just graduated to a Trek X-Caliber with a coil Recon fork by Rock Shox. I was very surprised that the spring rate is much softer on his fork in a full sized adult small bike with 27.5" tires than on the DB. I had my 68 lb. 8 year old jump off a curb and very short 18" retaining wall with the DB tonight. With a zip tie on it he only used 32 mm of the fork. had my older 80 lb. son do the same and only compressed it to 40 mm of travel. Overall I am happy with the bike but am not impressed with the fork spring rate. If you find out about the low air kit please let me know as I would be very interested. I would like the extra travel over the SR Suntour XCR LO Air 24 that will be here Thursday. It being only 63 mm of travel and 17 mm shorter axle to crown. For giggles I will put it on and play with the air settings to try and have him get full range out of it.

With the 32/36 I expect him to have plenty of gear. He is a little monster climbing! We rode 3 miles up with about 800 feet of climbing on Sunday with his 36/34 gearing. If I do make a change I think it will be changing the front 32 to a 30 and leaving the rear. We never bomb fire roads and usually climb to drop twisty single track. A 30/11 should be plenty fast for his needs. I may be wrong but I am under the impression the X7 rear derailed is a medium cage and can only handle a 36t rear cassette. Let me know if I am mistaken on that one.

I do have one question about the build. Did anyone have an issue with the bottom bolt holding the the 180 mm mount on? I had to grind a fair amount off the edge to allow the caliper to seat with out hitting the top of it on the caliper body. Just a lower profile bolt would have worked but I had the grinder available and not another bolt. I will switch it out later.

The bottom bracket shell is 68 mm. I am going to pick up a BB for the Suntour crank tomorrow. I think I will let him ride it with 165 mm arms once first and then switch them out. I will weigh both sets and let you know what I come up with. The Suntour cranks seem heavy but I may be surprised once I take off the 3 steel rings.

The last thing I will do before we ride is trim off 30 mm on both sides of the bar. It seems like a fine bar but it is so wide for a child. I also adjusted the brake levers in so he can reach them better. We will see when they break in but they seem alright so far.

Hopefully the weather will cooperate here in Norcal and we can go out on Sunday. My son is so excited to go out now! I will report back after his maiden voyage.

Spectre · Jan 5, 2016

cyclocrossen said:
If you find out about the low air kit please let me know as I would be very interested. I would like the extra travel over the SR Suntour XCR LO Air 24 that will be here Thursday. It being only 63 mm of travel and 17 mm shorter axle to crown. For giggles I will put it on and play with the air settings to try and have him get full range out of it.

The current SR Suntour XCR Air comes in either a 63mm or 80 mm travel versions. My son has the 80mm travel version.

FREAKAH · Jan 5, 2016

cyclocrossen said:
Thank you for the review!

I am excited that the build received was the same as yours. Well, minus the tires being Kenda. Looking at weights I bet it would be close to a lb. difference from the RR's. I think for now I will let him run the Kendas and order the RR down the road. The larger footprint may give him some added confidence for now. I usually run both my boys tires at 20 psi and have never had a pinch flat yet. These tires are beefy and have a good sidewall so I bet you can get away with a little lower yet.

My 11 year old just graduated to a Trek X-Caliber with a coil Recon fork by Rock Shox. I was very surprised that the spring rate is much softer on his fork in a full sized adult small bike with 27.5" tires than on the DB. I had my 68 lb. 8 year old jump off a curb and very short 18" retaining wall with the DB tonight. With a zip tie on it he only used 32 mm of the fork. had my older 80 lb. son do the same and only compressed it to 40 mm of travel. Overall I am happy with the bike but am not impressed with the fork spring rate. If you find out about the low air kit please let me know as I would be very interested. I would like the extra travel over the SR Suntour XCR LO Air 24 that will be here Thursday. It being only 63 mm of travel and 17 mm shorter axle to crown. For giggles I will put it on and play with the air settings to try and have him get full range out of it.

With the 32/36 I expect him to have plenty of gear. He is a little monster climbing! We rode 3 miles up with about 800 feet of climbing on Sunday with his 36/34 gearing. If I do make a change I think it will be changing the front 32 to a 30 and leaving the rear. We never bomb fire roads and usually climb to drop twisty single track. A 30/11 should be plenty fast for his needs. I may be wrong but I am under the impression the X7 rear derailed is a medium cage and can only handle a 36t rear cassette. Let me know if I am mistaken on that one.

I do have one question about the build. Did anyone have an issue with the bottom bolt holding the the 180 mm mount on? I had to grind a fair amount off the edge to allow the caliper to seat with out hitting the top of it on the caliper body. Just a lower profile bolt would have worked but I had the grinder available and not another bolt. I will switch it out later.

The bottom bracket shell is 68 mm. I am going to pick up a BB for the Suntour crank tomorrow. I think I will let him ride it with 165 mm arms once first and then switch them out. I will weigh both sets and let you know what I come up with. The Suntour cranks seem heavy but I may be surprised once I take off the 3 steel rings.

The last thing I will do before we ride is trim off 30 mm on both sides of the bar. It seems like a fine bar but it is so wide for a child. I also adjusted the brake levers in so he can reach them better. We will see when they break in but they seem alright so far.

Hopefully the weather will cooperate here in Norcal and we can go out on Sunday. My son is so excited to go out now! I will report back after his maiden voyage.

Fantastic to hear! I wonder if all the remaining stock of Sync'r bikes come with the upgraded parts. It would be great if they are, especially for those who are currently considering the Sync'r.

I checked the brake caliper to adapter clearance right after I read your post. It is very close on ours but it just clears. I do have to mention that I had to re-tap the threads on one of the caliper mounting hole because they were kinda cross-threaded. It looked as if someone tried to thread the bolt in crooked a third of the way.

The tires that came with our bike was the Kenda's. I received the RRons in the mail today, and after a quick look at the knobbies, I'm definitely only throwing them on the rear. Most of our trails here are surrounded, and most times covered with long ironwood pine needles, and I need the taller knobbies of the Kinetics on the front to dig through the needles to bite, especially during Travis's many off-line excursions. I might mount the RRons on the front later on anyway just to see if they do work in the needles. I might be wrong.

FREAKAH · Jan 5, 2016

Spectre said:
The current SR Suntour XCR Air comes in either a 63mm or 80 mm travel versions. My son has the 80mm travel version.

Do you know if both versions use the same air cartridge?

Does the fork work well for your son, and how much psi are you using?

Btw, the tires arrived Monday. Thanks!

Szy_szka · Jan 5, 2016

cyclocrossen said:
I may be wrong but I am under the impression the X7 rear derailed is a medium cage and can only handle a 36t rear cassette. Let me know if I am mistaken on that one.

When looking into the addition of just the 42 cog I checked the specs on the manufacturer's website (oneupcomponents) and they do state that any medium or long cage rear derailleur is compatible. I would assume that the same would hold true for adding the entire new cassette (such as the SunRace CSMX3 11-42t).

cyclocrossen said:
I do have one question about the build. Did anyone have an issue with the bottom bolt holding the the 180 mm mount on? I had to grind a fair amount off the edge to allow the caliper to seat with out hitting the top of it on the caliper body. Just a lower profile bolt would have worked but I had the grinder available and not another bolt. I will switch it out later.

I did encounter the same issue you're describing but I thought that at least one of my bolts was a 'low-profile' one and I was able to successful tighten the bracket and then mount the caliper.

Spectre · Jan 6, 2016

FREAKAH said:
Fantastic to hear! I wonder if all the remaining stock of Sync'r bikes come with the upgraded parts. It would be great if they are, especially for those who are currently considering the Sync'r.

I checked the brake caliper to adapter clearance right after I read your post. It is very close on ours but it just clears. I do have to mention that I had to re-tap the threads on one of the caliper mounting hole because they were kinda cross-threaded. It looked as if someone tried to thread the bolt in crooked a third of the way.

The tires that came with our bike was the Kenda's. I received the RRons in the mail today, and after a quick look at the knobbies, I'm definitely only throwing them on the rear. Most of our trails here are surrounded, and most times covered with long ironwood pine needles, and I need the taller knobbies of the Kinetics on the front to dig through the needles to bite, especially during Travis's many off-line excursions. I might mount the RRons on the front later on anyway just to see if they do work in the needles. I might be wrong.

You might want to at least try the Rocket Ron on the front tire. This past summer was especially dry in the Seattle area so our trail conditions were a layer of loose dust over hardpack. In those conditions, the Rocket Rons surprisingly worked better than the more aggressive Hans Dampf. The RRs found traction faster while the Hans Dampf with larger knobs seemed to skate a bit before digging in. Test results are at: Pacific Northwest Summer 2015 XC Tire Comparison Test: X-King, Rocket Ron, Ardent, Neo-moto, Hans Dampf & Nobby Nic ? DIRT MERCHANT BIKES

However, I have found the Kenda Kinetics to be a good front tire though haven't compared the Kinetics directly with the Rocket Ron.

cyclocrossen · Jan 6, 2016

Szy_szka said:
When looking into the addition of just the 42 cog I checked the specs on the manufacturer's website (oneupcomponents) and they do state that any medium or long cage rear derailleur is compatible. I would assume that the same would hold true for adding the entire new cassette (such as the SunRace CSMX3 11-42t).

I did encounter the same issue you're describing but I thought that at least one of my bolts was a 'low-profile' one and I was able to successful tighten the bracket and then mount the caliper.

Yes, I believe you are correct. I was going off the product specs that stated a 36t cog was the max but read many places that it will work with a 40t or 42t. After a few of our normal rides I will evaluate the need for the upgrade. This gearing is already a big improvement form his previous bike.

They must have missed giving me a low profile bolt. No big deal, it was an easy resolve.

cyclocrossen · Jan 6, 2016

Spectre said:
You might want to at least try the Rocket Ron on the front tire. This past summer was especially dry in the Seattle area so our trail conditions were a layer of loose dust over hardpack. In those conditions, the Rocket Rons surprisingly worked better than the more aggressive Hans Dampf. The RRs found traction faster while the Hans Dampf with larger knobs seemed to skate a bit before digging in. Test results are at: Pacific Northwest Summer 2015 XC Tire Comparison Test: X-King, Rocket Ron, Ardent, Neo-moto, Hans Dampf & Nobby Nic ? DIRT MERCHANT BIKES

However, I have found the Kenda Kinetics to be a good front tire though haven't compared the Kinetics directly with the Rocket Ron.

I like the look of the Rocket Rons and will look to order some come spring time. As wet as it is here now I will let him run the Kenetics. When I put the RR's on he should really appreciate the weight difference.

Thank you for the info on the forks. Do you know of a dealer for Suntour or should I just email them direct? I have not seen the 80 mm fork for sale online but I have seen the 63 mm. Out of curiosity how heavy is your son and what pressure are you running?

cyclocrossen · Jan 6, 2016

Suntour Cranks

I swapped out the cranks and bottom bracket with the Suntour 152.5 mm cranks and Shimano BB-UN55 68 mm - 107 BB. I was planning on a 109 but the only one my local bike shop had was a 107. I think either would be fine but I am happy with the placement of the chain ring for a nice chain line. The Suntour cranks are a little bit lighter but the bottom bracket weighs more. When I have a chance to weigh the isis bottom bracket I will post the final weights. My guess is the new setup is a tiny bit heavier. I do think he will benefit from this crank arm length.

cyclocrossen · Jan 7, 2016

The Suntour/Shimano BB setup is 17 grams heavier.

cyclocrossen · Jan 12, 2016

What do you think of the air version? What pressure do you run for him? I put the 63 mm Lo Air on my sons bike this weekend. When I set the pressure low enough for him to be able to compress it easily the static sag is at least 15 mm. Even with the pressure that low it takes a decent hit to get it activated and is sticky in comparison to the coiled version. The coiled actives easily but has a quick and harsh rate to it. The most travel I can get him to use on either is 30-35 mm.

FREAKAH · Jan 12, 2016

I'm wondering if you've got the old version. I hope not. Did you see Spectre's Dirt Merchant review of the new fork? Something about the new larger air chamber allowing a linear rate.

Did you check to make sure the lock-out is not slightly engaged.

POAH · Jan 12, 2016

that suntour needs a 118mm BB for the correct chainline does it not?

cyclocrossen · Jan 12, 2016

FREAKAH said:
I'm wondering if you've got the old version. I hope not. Did you see Spectre's Dirt Merchant review of the new fork? Something about the new larger air chamber allowing a linear rate.

Did you check to make sure the lock-out is not slightly engaged.

I am pretty sure I have the new version of the fork. I just received it and had to wait for it to be sent from the factory.

The air fork does have a fairly linear rate, it is the coil that is harsh. The issue with the air fork if the first time the fork is initiated it take way more force that it should to get it moving. Once it is moving it feels smooth. Once at rest for a few seconds it takes the same heavy force to get it moving again. I understand while riding a trail it should always be in motion so that should not be a big deal. What is strange to me is for the fork to be fully expanded to its full length open the pressure has to be so high that my 70 lb. son can barely compress it. For him to be able to get it compressed 30 mm -35 mm of travel the pressure is so low the static sag (with no rider on the bike) if only 50 mm of full travel. This in turns makes a 63 mm travel fork a 50 mm travel fork. And at this he still feels the coiled 80 mm version feels better on the small bumps because it activates easier. It was fairly we out so we have not gone on any faster down hills with big hits yet.

I played with the pressure and lock many different ways trying to find a resolve. I am sure the lock out was not engaged. I am sure either fork will be fine to have him ride but I am disappointed I cannot get it dialed to use all the travel of the fork. At this pint he wants the coiled fork back on after a ride on each.

Overall he absolutely loves this bike and has a grin from ear to ear while we ride. The gearing seems well suited for our needs and he made some pretty steep climbs on our last 15 mile ride.

Be

cyclocrossen · Jan 12, 2016

POAH said:
that suntour needs a 118mm BB for the correct chainline does it not?

I am not sure what the factory specs this bottom bracket to be as I bought this one from a friend as a pull off. You may be right because the bottom bracket that it came with is a 118 mm. I chose no to use it because it was way heavier than than a Shimano BB. The crank came as a triple and with the 1 x 10 the 118 put the front chain ring in line with the second or third rear cog from the outside. I think a 109 mm would be perfect to have the chain line right in the middle of the rear cassette but the LBS only had a 107 mm I got a screaming deal on it. The 107 mm puts the chain in line with 5th rear cog from the inside and shifts very crisp through all of the gears. Our riding area is very hilly and he will spend most of his time in 15t - 36t.

You very well may be correct but so far I see no issues with the current setup.

FREAKAH · Jan 12, 2016

well, being an air fork, I could be that it still needs to be broken in. I'm sure there are several more seals/o-rings compared to the coiled version, and all of that increases the stiction. Hopefully it'll loosen up after a few weekend rides.
One thing that I use, and could help is the "Finish Line Stanchion Lube". I use it on all my forks and shocks and it really helps cut the friction of those cheap youth forks.

Travis's Diamondback Sync'r 24 From Santa😉!

Spectre

FREAKAH

cyclocrossen

FREAKAH

cyclocrossen

Spectre

FREAKAH

FREAKAH

Szy_szka

Spectre

cyclocrossen

cyclocrossen

cyclocrossen

cyclocrossen

cyclocrossen

FREAKAH

POAH

cyclocrossen

cyclocrossen

FREAKAH

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