I think the Phoenix is a classic most definitely worthy of it's own thread even though its really not super old yet. Ive seen some nice ones posted here over the years, so lets put 'em all in one spot to enjoy. Ive got a few pics of mine, but I'll let you guys get this thing going as I find some good pics to post.
The WTB Phoenix Thread
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You're luck you get to ride it. All we get to do is nit pick picsTraction would be compromised if the rear is reverse, which would be more annoying.
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If you follow the arrow's guidance on the rear you get increased rolling resistance, more climbing traction, and less braking traction. Most tires are marked the opposite of this; they go for less rolling resistance and more braking traction (which is what I'd prefer) so not sure what Panaracer was thinking. For the front it's a no brainer as you get poor braking, more rolling resistance and no benefits if you do what the arrow says.Seatpost plan sounds great! I know the spesh is WTB design, but something about that big S.... would the rear TBII reversed do much worse? Labels are a petty grievance, to be sure, but still annoying
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17,663 Posts
A recent (although not great) shot of my Phoenix. Unlike most of my bikes this one is not period correct, but built with purpose.
It has evolved over the years and is what I consider to be the best (vintage) bike I've ever ridden.
95 Phoenix SE suspension corrected frame, 1 1/8" HT - repainted in a dark charcoal with limited black decals.
RB modified Fox Float 80 (knocked down to 70mm)
Chris King No Logo HS
WTB Powerband stem
Easton SL carbon low rise (optional WTB Ti, but I like the slightly wider carbon bars)
ESL grips
M900 XTR brifters, ti clamp bolts
M901 XTR fd, ti pinch bolt (shaved for clearance)
UN91 XTR BB, 107mm
Suntour XC Pro Micro Drive (Sugino) forged cranks, 175mm (shaved for clearance), alloy chain ring/crank bolts
M910 XTR rd, ti pinch bolt, Carmichael pulleys
Wheelset - F: Chris King ISO, Mavic 317, WS XL14 spokes, alloy nips, R: WTB 140mm, Mavic M231CD, WS DB spokes, alloy nips
Dura Ace 11-26 8spd cassette
Brakes: WTB Toggle Cam rear, Avid Road BBDB7, ti rotor bolts
Quick Release: Salsa F/R/Seat
WTB (CC) modified Suntour XC seatpost
WTB SST Ti saddle
Tires: WTB Motoraptor 2.24 rear, 2.4 front
King SS cages
M959 XTR clipless pedals
With heavy tires and tubes its sitting at 25.75lbs. While the mullet look isn't ideal visually, it lets me run a modern fork and the Toggle Cam out back with the M900 levers.
It is otherwise a very unassuming bike, which suits me just fine.
![Image]()
It has evolved over the years and is what I consider to be the best (vintage) bike I've ever ridden.
95 Phoenix SE suspension corrected frame, 1 1/8" HT - repainted in a dark charcoal with limited black decals.
RB modified Fox Float 80 (knocked down to 70mm)
Chris King No Logo HS
WTB Powerband stem
Easton SL carbon low rise (optional WTB Ti, but I like the slightly wider carbon bars)
ESL grips
M900 XTR brifters, ti clamp bolts
M901 XTR fd, ti pinch bolt (shaved for clearance)
UN91 XTR BB, 107mm
Suntour XC Pro Micro Drive (Sugino) forged cranks, 175mm (shaved for clearance), alloy chain ring/crank bolts
M910 XTR rd, ti pinch bolt, Carmichael pulleys
Wheelset - F: Chris King ISO, Mavic 317, WS XL14 spokes, alloy nips, R: WTB 140mm, Mavic M231CD, WS DB spokes, alloy nips
Dura Ace 11-26 8spd cassette
Brakes: WTB Toggle Cam rear, Avid Road BBDB7, ti rotor bolts
Quick Release: Salsa F/R/Seat
WTB (CC) modified Suntour XC seatpost
WTB SST Ti saddle
Tires: WTB Motoraptor 2.24 rear, 2.4 front
King SS cages
M959 XTR clipless pedals
With heavy tires and tubes its sitting at 25.75lbs. While the mullet look isn't ideal visually, it lets me run a modern fork and the Toggle Cam out back with the M900 levers.
It is otherwise a very unassuming bike, which suits me just fine.
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17,663 Posts
Has to be the Road version of the BB7. The feel between front disc and TC isn't too bad either. Better modulation and feel with the Toggle Cam, but the Avid is tolerable.
And ya with the 107 spindle I needed the FD to release inward just a touch more to make the little ring. Cranks would catch the chainstay with the flex, so the end was shaved a little to clear as well.
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11,084 Posts
You animal!
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Nah, he just didn't have the juice to tighten the crank bolt enough.
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17,663 Posts
The opposite. I tightened that thing on there so hard I lost all the clearance.
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809 Posts
Favor request:
Is anyone able to cite the differences in Phoenix headtube lengths (or any other useful measurements), to help determine/confirm if a particular frame is intended to be suspension corrected or rigid? I seem to find conflicting information in some other old threads, even though this is noted as the surest way to tell. Also, did these numbers change throughout the course of the run, or were the suspension models always intended for a 63mm-ish travel fork?
I'm mostly interested in the measurements for the 18" frame, but it might be nice, if anyone has them, to include other frame sizes too, as future reference for others.
Thanks for any info...
Is anyone able to cite the differences in Phoenix headtube lengths (or any other useful measurements), to help determine/confirm if a particular frame is intended to be suspension corrected or rigid? I seem to find conflicting information in some other old threads, even though this is noted as the surest way to tell. Also, did these numbers change throughout the course of the run, or were the suspension models always intended for a 63mm-ish travel fork?
I'm mostly interested in the measurements for the 18" frame, but it might be nice, if anyone has them, to include other frame sizes too, as future reference for others.
Thanks for any info...
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2,568 Posts
Yep, head tube length difference is the key for sue vs non sus. There are a few PDFs floating around. Dig through these yet?: Catalogues | WTB Archive | Retrobike
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809 Posts
Thanks, Nate! That's tremendously helpful. Haven't run across that PDF before. I've looked through as many old catalogs as I could find, along with a "late model hardtails" spec sheet that someone here posted, but they all seem to list dimensions for the suspension-correct version only.
I'm still perplexed about something though, and I guess I'm eventually going to have to embarrass myself with some more information in order to ask the question. (Basically, I'm seeing something where a +/- 385mm a-c fork measurement yields the correct frame angles, on a frame that's supposed to be suspension-corrected...)
In the meantime, just out of curiosity: Did happen to measure the head and seat tube angles on your green beauty, before and after you installed the type II? If so, how close do they actually come to the specified 71/72?
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1,988 Posts
RBI makes no excuses.
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ha!
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Standard process is to tighten until you strip the threads or hear a 'crack', then back off a quarter turn.....which ever comes first.
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2,568 Posts
Haven't measured -- the Type II I have was made for a sus-corrected Merlin, but feels good. Before I installed that I had a Salsa fork (nice if a bit too flexy) and a Manitou R7 which left it rather choppered...but with 80mm of travel. I'll try to remind myself to measure the next time I swap tires out (could be a while).
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6 Posts
what style brakes are the rear studs for a Phoenix? It has a 140mm rear (this is far from a given on a phoenix)?
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3,326 Posts
Either canti or u brake-roller cam option.
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