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$400 for brakeset. Hope or Shimanos?

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#101 ·
To me the M4 is Hope's all-round do everything brake, the X2 is the lightweight XC brake and the V4 is the super strong DH brake. The V4 is also a 4 piston brake, think of it as a bigger, stronger, and more badass M4.

As for brake setups, I'm firmly in the overkill is just about right camp. Unless you're counting grams on your bike, go right ahead and stick the most powerful brakes that you can afford on your bike. 99% of the time you'll never come close to needing the full power of the brakes and the few extra grams aren't going to kill you. But that 1% of the time when you need them, you really need them, and you will be thankful that they were there to save your butt. This is why I have DH brakes on my steel hardtail despite weighing only 150 lbs and having no DH runs of any significant length in my area.
 
#103 ·
JanBoothius said:
I have been using the M4 front and rear for over a year, and upon demo-ing a bike equipped with XT M785's, I'm tempted to put the Shimano's on my next bike.

Why? The Shimano brakes allowed me to use one finger for the whole ride, where that has never felt comfortable on the M4's.
However, the M4 does have more power when you really get on the brakes hard.

I may stick with the Hopes due to financial limitations, but the reliability and build quality are another big reason to stay with the Hopes.

How does the M4 compare with the V4?

Are the Shimano Zee/Saint brakes even more powerful than the XTs? Hmmm....
Click to expand...
The V4 is more powerful, more than I think any other brake out there currently. You do use more pressure on the m4/v4/x2 than you would on the shamino because of the servo wave going on with the shamino, but you then need to clap down harder on the shamino as the force manipulation is 4-5 times on the shamino than the hopes. The hope is very consistent all the way through the pull which makes for top level modulation, where the shamino is different from early pull to the end of the stroke making modulation more difficult.
 
#104 ·
aerius said:
To me the M4 is Hope's all-round do everything brake, the X2 is the lightweight XC brake and the V4 is the super strong DH brake. The V4 is also a 4 piston brake, think of it as a bigger, stronger, and more badass M4.

As for brake setups, I'm firmly in the overkill is just about right camp. Unless you're counting grams on your bike, go right ahead and stick the most powerful brakes that you can afford on your bike. 99% of the time you'll never come close to needing the full power of the brakes and the few extra grams aren't going to kill you. But that 1% of the time when you need them, you really need them, and you will be thankful that they were there to save your butt. This is why I have DH brakes on my steel hardtail despite weighing only 150 lbs and having no DH runs of any significant length in my area.
Click to expand...
Could not agree more.
 
#105 ·
I recently put the new Zee brakes on my AM bike. Amazing power and perfectly silent. Almost the best upgrade I've done so far. Highly recommend them.
This is coming from Hayes El Camino brakes with 203mm rotors. No comparison.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
 
#106 ·
bitewerks said:
What is the advantage of Hope's floating rotors?
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I bought floaters before checking the board's opinion, then found reports that the rivets can loosen up. Some said it takes 2 years, others said less. I'm not sure exactly what that means in practice except maybe they'll rattle some. Anyway, search for hope floating and the posts should come right to the top.
 
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#111 ·
Discussion starter · #113 ·
Just an update:
These brakes are just awesome. Been riding some of the more aggressive trails here in central TX, faster and faster and I just feel so much more in control. I've ridden City Park here in Austin a couple times in the last week, which is a really technical, rocky and incredibly ledge-y trail. I can drop off a series of ledges fast enough to bomb down em, and still have enough control to make the turn at the bottom f the last ledge. They even allow me to slow down and control myself halfway down the ledges and make adjustments on the fly.

Haven't had any problems with them except for occasional squealing (not that loud) that I pretty sure is caused by dust building up n the rotors as I ride. No leaks and still feel super solid. Glad I spent a little more money and got the hopes over the shimanos
 
#114 ·
I'm so glad that my elixir CR's crapped out on me yesterday. Have been looking for an excuse to call up Hope in Spring and order my x2/m4 combo. Going to get the blue bore caps cause i'm flashy.

Sooner we need to ride sometime man! I'm over at 183/360 area.
 
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#115 ·
mazspeed said:
The V4 is more powerful, more than I think any other brake out there currently. You do use more pressure on the m4/v4/x2 than you would on the shamino because of the servo wave going on with the shamino, but you then need to clap down harder on the shamino as the force manipulation is 4-5 times on the shamino than the hopes. The hope is very consistent all the way through the pull which makes for top level modulation, where the shamino is different from early pull to the end of the stroke making modulation more difficult.
Click to expand...
Bolded contradiction? It seems like you're saying you have to pull both brakes harder.

I'm a Shimano user, I really like Servo Wave and its really unique and simply engineered solution to the pad clearance/lever force issue. At first, I thought I might have had a hard time getting used to the "detent feel" that they have due to the free stroke mechanical advantage changing, but I didn't really notice it and I actually quite like the mechanical advantage it gives. I'm a light dude, maybe 145 geared up, and I love how touchy the brakes are, yet I never have a problem controlling them. For whatever reason I like having more than I think I could ever use. I'm actually planning to install a Saint caliper and 203mm rotor just because.

I also do wonder about all the heat management features Shimano is packing in, and if they really can dissipate more energy than others. The fined pads and rotors, ceramic pistons...etc. It would be cool if someone set up a dyno test of brakes. I've never seemed to come close to any sort of brake fade; I don't have huge descents around here.

I haven't used Hopes so I can't comment, except to say that I think they look fantastic and super well made and finished. Only the forged beauty that is the XTR caliper measures up to Hope stuff; it is of course the only one piece caliper shimano makes. I don't really like their lever designs though, I much prefer the short Shimano geometry and I like the single bolt swing clamp more as well. I could do without the cheap looking chromed plastic reservoir covers on XT levers though. I actually think SLX and Zee look better...

And I think the final thing I prefer about shimano is that I don't have to worry about the fluid when I bleed them like I have to with DOT fluid. I love the no mess situation with shimano. No spilling required.
 
#116 ·
Kanik said:
Bolded contradiction? It seems like you're saying you have to pull both brakes harder.

I'm a Shimano user, I really like Servo Wave and its really unique and simply engineered solution to the pad clearance/lever force issue. At first, I thought I might have had a hard time getting used to the "detent feel" that they have due to the free stroke mechanical advantage changing, but I didn't really notice it and I actually quite like the mechanical advantage it gives. I'm a light dude, maybe 145 geared up, and I love how touchy the brakes are, yet I never have a problem controlling them. For whatever reason I like having more than I think I could ever use. I'm actually planning to install a Saint caliper and 203mm rotor just because.

I also do wonder about all the heat management features Shimano is packing in, and if they really can dissipate more energy than others. The fined pads and rotors, ceramic pistons...etc. It would be cool if someone set up a dyno test of brakes. I've never seemed to come close to any sort of brake fade; I don't have huge descents around here.

I haven't used Hopes so I can't comment, except to say that I think they look fantastic and super well made and finished. Only the forged beauty that is the XTR caliper measures up to Hope stuff; it is of course the only one piece caliper shimano makes. I don't really like their lever designs though, I much prefer the short Shimano geometry and I like the single bolt swing clamp more as well. I could do without the cheap looking chromed plastic reservoir covers on XT levers though. I actually think SLX and Zee look better...

And I think the final thing I prefer about shimano is that I don't have to worry about the fluid when I bleed them like I have to with DOT fluid. I love the no mess situation with shimano. No spilling required.
Click to expand...
What I meant and I think others knew what I meant is that Shamino in the saint, xt, xtr, the initial hit of the brakes are very light and quick and strong, but the more you use/need them in a downhill situation you need to really crank on them more in the last 2/3's power delivery than the Hopes. The Hopes deliver a very linear brake feel, med clap at start and a tad more as the hill gets more serious and as the speed increases, but not as much as the shaminos in that point of the hil when speed and control are a factor. In other words you get more control with the Hopes than with the Shaminos. Now I have a set of xt's on my tranny, and they work fine. It's a good brake, but the Hope is in another league. The Hope delivery is far different than the Shamino. Now some like the Shamino and that's great, like I said I own a set, but when the going gets rough, the Shaminos have faded in fact I tore up a brand new xtr set over a year ago. Burned the living hell out of it and almost killed myself along the way. It's not a downhill brake for a 225 pounder. The Saint is more adapt for that. But the Hope is wonderful in all aspects because of the control you get in the craziest situations. I cannot fad my brakes at all. I have tried so hard to make these things smoke or fade and I can't. I gave up, and that's on the stock pads.
 
#117 ·
aerius said:
As for brake setups, I'm firmly in the overkill is just about right camp. Unless you're counting grams on your bike, go right ahead and stick the most powerful brakes that you can afford on your bike. 99% of the time you'll never come close to needing the full power of the brakes and the few extra grams aren't going to kill you. But that 1% of the time when you need them, you really need them, and you will be thankful that they were there to save your butt. This is why I have DH brakes on my steel hardtail despite weighing only 150 lbs and having no DH runs of any significant length in my area.
Click to expand...
Thats a reason why I put the Stealth V4's (instead of XTs) on my SB66c. I think the are awesome in performance, and the floating rotors look great, bonus! (203 & 183)

Another reason, was the posts by mazspeed and 007 sold me on Hope, so thanks :thumbsup:
 
#120 ·
Dictatorsaurus said:
Thanks to this thread I bought two sets of hope brakes. 1st set running M4 front X2 rear and 2nd set running X2 front X2 rear!
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mazspeed said:
We should get a commission from Hope :)
Glad you got the Hope's you won't be disappointed.
Click to expand...
Okay, now I really DO think we should get commission! :thumbsup:

(Phil if you're reading this, I'd be happy with a set of stealth V4's. KTHXBAI!)
 
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