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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
just checked Zebralight since I hadn't in a while. Now all Mark III's are on sale, Mark II are on deeper sale, and new are Mark IV lights

this is the H600w series (best lens for mtb)

One user gave a sour review for the Mark IV as defective out the gate, but they are now on backorder and I trust ZL that the new batch has any issues remedied.

Mark 3 specs XHP neutral emitter
Light Output (runtimes)
  • High: H1 1126 Lm (PID, approx 2.2 hr) or H2 580 Lm (PID, approx 2.8 hrs) / 312 Lm (4.3 hrs) / 139 Lm (12 hrs)
  • Medium: M1 61 Lm (33 hrs) or M2 28 Lm (73 hrs) / 10 Lm (8 days)
  • Low: L1 3.3 Lm (18 days) or L2 0.37 Lm (2.8 months) / 0.05 Lm (5.1 months) / 0.01 Lm (7.1 months)

Mark 4 specs XHP neutral emitter
Light Output (runtimes)
  • High: H1 1400 Lm (PID, 2.8 hrs) or H2 875 Lm (PID, 2.9 hrs)/502 Lm (PID, 3.2 hrs)/264 Lm (6.3 hrs)
  • Medium: M1 127 Lm (13.8 hrs) or M2 56.4 Lm (28 hrs)/22.9 Lm (2.8 days)/8.5 Lm (7.3 days)
  • Low: L1 2.9 Lm (18.5 days) or L2 0.92 Lm (1.5 months)/0.26 Lm (3 months)/0.07 Lm (4 months)
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
FYI

these are 4000k which I find is --absolutely perfect-- in the woods.

 

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Okay I was just looking at these over on Amazon. This is the type of torch that I call "Periscope" style and mounts sideways. While I'm sure these are very nice and very bright I can't help but wonder how one uses one of these while mountain biking. I mean if you wear a helmet how does this work? I suppose if you use a helmet without a visor you might be able to get the strap system to go over the helmet ( on the outer edge ) but other than that rigging up a mount to work on a helmet with visor would require some different type of mount.

Mark IV looks to have some crazy output with some long run time. Keep in mind though that the output on the ZL's is designed to taper off as the lamp heats up. This is how they get the longer run times. IMHO this is a type of false advertising because unless you read up on how the lamps work you don't know how they come up with the numbers. For once I'd like to see an actual lumen read out from testing inside an integrated sphere "after the lamp has been on high for a half hour". That's because I'm pretty sure that "1400 lumen" output is going to ramp down real quick. I'd be real surprised if the output was still around 1000 lumen after a half hour on high.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I have about 30 lights and my daily driver is a headlight. Thrunite is upping their game with a 3350lm xhp70.2 cool or neutral. Doubt it puts out for very long..... https://thrunite.us7.list-manage.co...e717eb38fab383881f&id=1864b0cc67&e=b71e6de99d
That uses an IMR (very high discharge) fast drain lithium. will have short runtime of 1.5 minutes at max lumens, or else it would catch fire from the heat

compare to the ZL, the thrunite will run about as long as a ZL > High (1275 lumen; 90 minutes)

so all you get with the thrunite is bragging rights, not practicality. also more weight
 

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I have to agree with cat. Though zebra makes some NICE lights, they are still flashlights. No constant output.

I do want one for other uses (always thought periscope style EDC lights are awesome)

Which means 1600 lumens at cold start (or even at 30 seconds as required by ANSI) means its producing 160 lumens when it hits the end of runtime. Cant defy laws of physics there. But seeing as you can swap cells at will it's not of concern.

I wouldn't call it false advertising though. It's how all flashlights are rated. ANSI is simply certifying the lumens at beginning of run time and states that end of run ti.e is when light dims to 10% of it's original rated output.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
most here sit in a box with a keyboard, and fret the numbers. how about actual riding ?

I ride bikes at night, and have the lightest 18650 helmet light possible, it side loads cells easy, and lights up the trail perfectly. who gives a rats arse what it looks like on paper the thing works well and doesn't mess around. gawd damn you can't even get out the gate here fretting about PID thermal reg and whatnot

all I am posting here for... is to say ZL has mark IV now.

damn, how about stepping up and riding with it ? no ? whatever....

go argue ZL 'actual numbers' on CPF they tear thing down hard on paper

sheesh. in the meantime I'll be riding my butt off at night and loving it
 

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1275 for 90 min? Where’s the heat going? 1275 for about 2 mins if that. ZL is lighter, a good benefit until you try running at max output. I don’t care about the battery, I have Sanyo GA which is one of the best mix for high capacity and current. My armytec wizard xhp50 still won’t maintain 1000lm for long. Heat and like RAKC said, battery capacity are going to limit any sustained output. Btw, I had a Zebralight, quickly sold it. Definitely not a light for me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I only ever use H2 for riding, it's fine for me. don't like it, who cares ?

man o man didn't want to start yet another lumens pissing match, yet here we are. how about an actual ride at night in the chunk pissin match ? I'll be hammering

I realize this is the lighting forums where you 'have an integrating sphere or go home' type attitude, but I am a) an engineer and b) decided this is the ultimate headlight for me and my hard, come home bloody style of chunk riding.

as an engineer I think -really hard- about equipment choices and if I end up using it I could write a 500 page dissertation about the reasons why I chose it. that ain't happening here because it's fruitless
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
here is a good quote about the numbers game. I ride at h2 always, btw

----------------------

"That is *exactly* how I feel about H1 levels, whether in ZL or in other lights. I do not mind the fact that I can use it only for a minute or less--that is often all that I need at the highest level. I know that it is not intended for long use. But I want the option of pushing the system at a level that it can only sustain for a brief time.

The comparison that always comes to mind for me is afterburner in a fighter jet. How long can I fly using afterburner? Not long--certainly not all the way back to base. But when I need it for 5 seconds, it is incredibly handy.

Imagine if a pilot came back to the jet manufacturer and said, "that afterburner mode is a fraud; it only works for 10 seconds. You should take it out, and make the maximum cruising speed now your absolute maximum speed for the plane." Anybody would think they were crazy. Making the afterburner available does not *prevent* you from using the maximum cruising speed (i.e. H2). If you want to treat H2 as though it's the absolute maximum on your light, then go ahead. That's what I do, too, 95% of the time. When I'm cruising, I stick to cruising speed. But I want the option of kicking in the afterburner when things get risky!"
 

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....man o man didn't want to start yet another lumens pissing match, yet here we are.
You like the light and it does what you want. We get that and congrats that you have found your "perfect light".

When you post the sketchy, craftily worded claims of the manufacturer, some knowledgeable forum users will call BS for what it is. Not a personal attack on you.
 

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That uses an IMR (very high discharge) fast drain lithium. will have short runtime of 1.5 minutes at max lumens, or else it would catch fire from the heat

compare to the ZL, the thrunite will run about as long as a ZL > High (1275 lumen; 90 minutes)

so all you get with the thrunite is bragging rights, not practicality. also more weight
What I like about the Thrunite is that at least the ad tells you the lamp runs on turbo for only 1.5 minutes and then drops down to about 1K lumen the rest of the way. Not to mention the run time seems more reasonably although it too may not run at the listed output for the time listed. What I don't like about the Thrunite ( the one in the link ) is that the lamp doesn't really have a mid-range mode I'd find appropriate for bike use. The TH30 goes from the 1K lumen range and then to something in the 300 lumen range. Personally I'd prefer a mode somewhere in the 650 to 750 lumen range so it would have something as a workhorse mode. These torches with the newer LED's should be able to hold that kind of output for a longer period before a noticeable loss of output.

The torch I use on occasion is the PFlexPro version of the Convoy M1 using the XPL HI emitter. I've been very pleased with how that works. The turbo on mine ( >1K lumen ) is set to 2 minutes. After that it drops to the next mode which is somewhere around 600-700 lumen. Even when I use it on it's mid mode it does an outstanding job of letting me see well ahead of where I need to see.

I'd love to see how one of these small torches claiming 2K-3K lumen ( on turbo ) actually performs. If you're using a single cell torch though you'd be smart to only use the turbo mode only when really needed. If I'm using a torch on the helmet I want the weight to be almost unnoticeable and I want the battery to at least last an hour. That said when I do rides with a torch on the helmet I can usually get the battery to last for my typical two hour ride without too much problem. ( although I always carry a spare battery )

( Edit; I seem to have found the answer to my own question. I see that Zebralight sells a bracket for the periscope type torches that should allow someone to use on a helmet if they have some good sized Velcro straps to hold it down. Might not work with all helmets but then again that's just the way it is with some helmets )
 

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EAT MORE GRIME
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
^ did you see how I mount it on a helmet ? just the silicone mount strapped down.
works great
 
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