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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Current frame: 2008 Stumpjumper FSR with Fox RP23

The bike rides well and I don't really have any problems with it, but my riding is about 90% training on a road bike, for about 10 XC races a year.

Stock wheels are as follows:
RIMS: DT Swiss custom for Specialized X420, 24mm w/ eyelets, 28/32h
FRONT HUB: Specialized Hi Lo disc, 28h CNC flange and disc mount, sealed cartridge bearing, 9mm DT RWS alloy QR
REAR HUB: DT Swiss custom for Specialized 370 with DT RWS QR, 32h
SPOKES: DT Swiss Competition 1.8/1.6mm

I'm not unhappy with the wheels either, but I'm fully aware of the advantages of saving some weight. I don't know how much these weigh now, so I'm not sure how much I'll have to spend for a lightweight wheelset and if it is going to be worth it.

On the other hand, I can start looking at lighter HT frame. It's not rotational weight, but I guess I could loose at least a lb or two, as the FSR frame is on the heavy side for a XC orientated frame.

The coin for a whole new bike isn't there, plus I'm happy with the upgrades I've done so far.

I'm 31 and 145 lbs and have been since about 10th grade, so I'm not too concerned about a lightweight, race-day only wheelset.

Thoughts/opinions/comments would be appreciated! :thumbsup:
 

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I have the 08 stumpy expert... While I love the bike, I was not satisfied with the DT Swiss wheels. I race XC, I opted with the stumpy over the epic because I do some longer marathon mtb races, and I ride a bit aggressively. I picked up a set of used Crossmax wheels, and that made my bike handle quite a bit better. Upgrade the wheels, if you still don't like how the bike feels, you can get a HT frame and start to build your lightweight racer bike..
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
That's the way I'm leaning too. One issue is the front fork might be a little tall for a hardtail, plus I'll def need a new front der and possibly a seatpost.
 

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Those wheels aren't terrible, but aren't great either. You could save a LOT of weight by picking up some a set of wheels from No Tubes. Their base wheel build is ~1400 grams and is like $440. Then you can run your tires tubeless without a rim strip kit as well, saving more weight.

I'd get a better set of wheels and race on the Stumpy for now. You will likely find the suspension on the Stumpy to be a bit on the long side for shorter XC racing... but it will be totally doable.

You can always use a nice set of wheels on a new bike down the line!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
As much as I'd like to go tubeless, I'm on the side of the fence now that just doesn't want to deal with. As light as I am, I can ride a higher pressures with no problems, and get the rolling resistance benefits. I have limited off road ride time, and am not currently suffering from any flats.

You can get a set of Hope 2s on XC717 with DT Rev spokes for $370 shipped from CRC....which is the way I'm leaning.
 

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cru_jones said:
As much as I'd like to go tubeless, I'm on the side of the fence now that just doesn't want to deal with. As light as I am, I can ride a higher pressures with no problems, and get the rolling resistance benefits. I have limited off road ride time, and am not currently suffering from any flats.

You can get a set of Hope 2s on XC717 with DT Rev spokes for $370 shipped from CRC....which is the way I'm leaning.
few things.

1 - tubeless is faster, plus, sealant prevents flats. future flats, not past ones. it is the NEXT one that is the issue.

2 - your weight has nothing to do with it. why do you thing higher pressure is better for rolling resistance? lower pressure is faster (less RR)

3 - notubes rims have other benefits, like being very light, some are wider (crest or 355), which gives a tire more volume, and adds handling.

if you really want wheels to perform well, check what the top guys in your area are running... oh let's see, Stan's Sealant and NoTubes rims...
 

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You shoudln't be afraid of tubeless setups. High pressure doesn't equate to lower RR numbers when offroad, it's just the opposite. High pressure means the wheels are bounced around when you hit roots, rocks, bumps, etc. Low pressure makes the tires conform to the terrain and translates to faster times, more traction, and a more comfy ride.

Don't waste money on rims other than ones from no tubes for racing. You can always run a tube in their rims if you really want to. Their rims are inexpensive, light, and offer increased air volumes.

Sealant also prevents a LOT of flats.... not having a flat makes you a lot faster in a race :)
 

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Trust me, tubeless is the way to go if you're racing. It sounds like a hassle, but it's really not, and it makes you so much faster.
 

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I would go with the wheels.

I have done a fair bit of testing with a power meter and a pound or two in frame weight is so insignificant that it cannot be measured. 1/2 pound on wheels on the other hand makes a measurable difference.

And go with tubeless the difference is night and day. I don't think there is a single up-grade that you can make that makes as big of a difference.
 

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I wouldn't outright say that higher pressure does NOT equate to lower RR. I know from experience that running higher pressure helps in many types of terrain, specially the hard-pack that we have here in Norcal. Also find that its better for the long fireroad climbs.

Lower pressure honestly is good for very technical uphills and downhills. I know there have been studies over grass and over gravel but that's not what we ride on. Higher pressure just rolls better on hardpack and fireroads, which are mostly hardpack anyway.
 

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NoBalance said:
I wouldn't outright say that higher pressure does NOT equate to lower RR. I know from experience that running higher pressure helps in many types of terrain, specially the hard-pack that we have here in Norcal. Also find that its better for the long fireroad climbs.

Lower pressure honestly is good for very technical uphills and downhills. I know there have been studies over grass and over gravel but that's not what we ride on. Higher pressure just rolls better on hardpack and fireroads, which are mostly hardpack anyway.
Have you tested that yourself with a Power Meter?

When I have tested the only place where I found high pressure superior was on pavement, and even then not by a very significant amount.

When I compared 22 psi to 40 psi the lower pressure was vastly superior over all types of off road terrain, including fairly smooth fire road climbs.
 

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I know what it feels like to ride low pressure vs high on a fireroad and hardpack trials. Its always more sluggish and doesnt roll as fast or as long. Sure there's more grip and cornering can be better, but its that larger patch of ground that lower pressure causes your tire to use that both contributes to increased grip and loss of rolling capability.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Guess I should look some tubeless ready rims in the build-up so I can convert easily when I'm ready.
 

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NoBalance said:
I know what it feels like to ride low pressure vs high on a fireroad and hardpack trials. Its always more sluggish and doesnt roll as fast or as long. Sure there's more grip and cornering can be better, but its that larger patch of ground that lower pressure causes your tire to use that both contributes to increased grip and loss of rolling capability.
You're comments on loss of "rolling capability" couldn't be more wrong. Yes if you are riding on pavement... no if you are even riding a gravel road. On any type of uneven surface, rolling resistance goes decreases as you lower tire pressure.

Just because something "feels" fast doesn't mean that it is. More likely, it feels fast because you are getting bounced around and the tires are skipping.
 

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NoBalance said:
I know from experience that running higher pressure helps in many types of terrain, specially the hard-pack that we have here in Norcal. Also find that its better for the long fireroad climbs.

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What are you considering as "high" pressure?

I too live and race (alot) in NorCal and I feel that lower tire pressure across the board is better for racing for both rolling resistance and grip. I'm generally running mid-to-high 20's (tubeless, my weight is around 175lb) To each his own I supposse :)

Also -- What LMN said.
 

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cru_jones said:
Guess I should look some tubeless ready rims in the build-up so I can convert easily when I'm ready.
most rims these days can convert easily.

So the next question is.. What are some good UST/LUST tire recommendations? Seems kind of hard to find a lighter tubeless tire.
 

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No, you use Stan's rims (or strips in a regular rim) and run normal tubed type tires tubless.

Flat protection from the Stan's goo and nice light tires by using regular ones.

Specialized 2Bliss tires are quite nice if you really want a tubless tire bead. But, I and lots of others have had great luck with normal tires.

I'm currently running Schwalbe tires, Nobby Nic on the front and a Rocket Ron (both 2.25") on the back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
briscoelab said:
No, you use Stan's rims (or strips in a regular rim) and run normal tubed type tires tubless.

Flat protection from the Stan's goo and nice light tires by using regular ones.

Specialized 2Bliss tires are quite nice if you really want a tubless tire bead. But, I and lots of others have had great luck with normal tires.

I'm currently running Schwalbe tires, Nobby Nic on the front and a Rocket Ron (both 2.25") on the back.
1) I just got two new Maxxis High Rollers for xmas for this year's racing, so it would be nice if I could use those if I went tubeless?

2) What else do you carry on the bike after to you go tubeless? Specifically for racing, but I'd still like to at least finish if I do get a flat, and walking back isn't fun.
 
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