Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
184 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Next one (whenever I get round to starting it) will have a suspension fork but no gears (although dropout will have a hanger for very occasional geared use).

But for now I'm just enjoying riding #1!
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
11,987 Posts
that is amazing. I have always said that E-stays are the realm of 29ers (maybe fat bikes too). Just too many things going on in the BB area and there were plenty of concepts from the previous E-stay heyday that would still work today.

Though yours are incredibly low profile. I love it!
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
11,987 Posts
Like BB flex?
Sure, but they also had great mud clearance and really short chainstays. Seems to me the metalurgists/material scientists and designers should be able to get around the short comings of the '90's in today's current engineering environment.
 

·
Plays with tools
Joined
·
4,657 Posts
Sure, but they also had great mud clearance and really short chainstays. Seems to me the metalurgists/material scientists and designers should be able to get around the short comings of the '90's in today's current engineering environment.
Says the program engineer. If somebody like specialized or niner thought that short stay 29'ers were as cool as MTBR user did they would build one out of carbon and you guys would love.

Elevated stay bikes had trade offs just like every design. Short stay bikes aren't for everyone or every terrain either. Sure they were cool back in the day but at best they were 50/50 for any given trail outside of new england or arizona
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
11,987 Posts
Says the program engineer. If somebody like specialized or niner thought that short stay 29'ers were as cool as MTBR user did they would build one out of carbon and you guys would love.

Elevated stay bikes had trade offs just like every design. Short stay bikes aren't for everyone or every terrain either. Sure they were cool back in the day but at best they were 50/50 for any given trail outside of new england or arizona
Hey, that's unemployed architect!

Seriously though, Kona has one here, and there is certainly a desire for them. I mean it is alla academic for me as I love the handling of my new El Mariachi but the concept of the short stays intrigues me, only due to the fact that my first boutique bike was a short stayed elevated CS mantis XCR-EC and the thing climbed like a scalded goat was a nice riding bike (of course this was 1992 so my memory may have faded and compared to the days tire offerings it might have been awesome but pale in comparison to the variety we are blessed with now...rose colored glasses and all).

Heck i just do what people tell me anyway.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,039 Posts
Says the program engineer. If somebody like specialized or niner thought that short stay 29'ers were as cool as MTBR user did they would build one out of carbon and you guys would love.
I know it's fun to be negative sometimes, but try not to enjoy yourself too much here :p

As much as all those companies try to understand what their potential customers want they are riders with their own ideas and preferences too, and which aren't necessarily any more or less valid than those of an mtbr user. There are lots of design ideas that many people would legitimacy love but don't have enough widespread appeal to be a profitable investment for those bike companies either. It's great for the custom bike industry but not much fun for curious people with unique tastes and small budgets
 

·
trail rat
Joined
·
7,825 Posts
Like BB flex?
If somebody like specialized or niner thought that short stay 29'ers were as cool as MTBR user did they would build one out of carbon and you guys would love.

Elevated stay bikes had trade offs just like every design. Short stay bikes aren't for everyone or every terrain either. Sure they were cool back in the day but at best they were 50/50 for any given trail outside of new england or arizona
Wow, what a downer. All you innovators, give up! You are wasting your time! Quit thinking. Creativity is a fluke.

If Niner or SpecialE don't wanna do it, it ain't worth doing. American innovation is dead, at least for individuals, only the big corporations can be innovative, IF they think it will sell. If it cannot sell BIG numbers, it is worthless.

Sad

:devil: :eek:

edit - I spoke before I looked at the x posted thread. Innovation is fine, and appreciated by some.
One builder just moved up a few notches on my list. :thumbsup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
184 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Speaking from this experience - there are lots of reasons ultra short stay 29ers aren't mainstream. Some are:-
1) They are fiddly to make / package
2) Tyre clearance with regular width rear hub / bb / Q factor can sometimes stop you running a front mech (so it might limit sales to ss, hub gear or 1xwhatever).
3) Chainline at the extremes of a 9 / 10 speed cassette can be harsh and maybe not work at all (clicking, jumping etc - but mine works fine up to 6 cogs tried so far).
4) The rear tyre and seat tube want to live in the same place - so tube has to be bent, split (e.g. Wolfhound) or offset forward (e.g. Julie Racing Design, Canfield etc). This can sometimes limit the bike in some ways - e.g. by how much the seat post can be dropped, or geo changes because the slacker angled seat tube moves the saddle fore / aft more than regular designs.
5) Mud clearance can be compromised.

But for some people and places, the short stays do work very well so they are worth pursuing if you are confident you know what you want. A short back end can be coupled to a slack / large rake front to give a very agile (but not twitchy) bike.

And Walt rocks - he puts a lot of time, advice and encouragement into the frame forum :)
 

·
Plays with tools
Joined
·
4,657 Posts
FYI, I build my own frames just like the OP. It just so happens that I think short stay bikes of any wheel size suck. I love custom innovation. But some things have been tried and discarded for a reason. Canti's, URT's and elevated chainstays all fit in this category. But if somebody with resources wanted to make a sub 440mm stay bike work with a 29'er, a carbon elevated stay frame would likely be the way to do it.

If you think short stay bikes are so awesome by all means give your local builder some business and have one made just for you.
 

·
Trophy Husband
Joined
·
3,011 Posts
FYI, I build my own frames just like the OP. It just so happens that I think short stay bikes of any wheel size suck. I love custom innovation. But some things have been tried and discarded for a reason. Canti's, URT's and elevated chainstays all fit in this category. But if somebody with resources wanted to make a sub 440mm stay bike work with a 29'er, a carbon elevated stay frame would likely be the way to do it.

If you think short stay bikes are so awesome by all means give your local builder some business and have one made just for you.
The hate is strong in this one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,918 Posts
So just out curiosity customfab, does that mean you hated just about all 26" bikes? I'm a huge fan of the "short stayed" 29er movement. Not because they are short, but because they are getting back to what was long considered average length on 26" bikes.
 

·
aka "SirLurkAlot"
Joined
·
626 Posts
FYI, I build my own frames just like the OP. It just so happens that I think short stay bikes of any wheel size suck. I love custom innovation. But some things have been tried and discarded for a reason. Canti's, URT's and elevated chainstays all fit in this category. But if somebody with resources wanted to make a sub 440mm stay bike work with a 29'er, a carbon elevated stay frame would likely be the way to do it.

If you think short stay bikes are so awesome by all means give your local builder some business and have one made just for you.
Whoaa, relax. Lighten up Francis.

Stripes - Don't Call Me Francis - YouTube

BTW - great job on the bike! :thumbsup:
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top