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First of all, I love Ibis, so this is meant as an honest question and not an attack:

It seems like a lot of people have been clamoring for a "true" Ibis 650B, by which them seem to mean something closer to 150/150 in travel with a reasonable (not jacked up) BB height. It seems like BikeCo has more or less come up with the solution people are looking for in a pretty creative way with their modded shock that allows for 147 rear travel without jacking up the BB.

But it does raise the question: why doesn't Ibis just custom order a shock similar to the BikeCo spec and offer this particular HDR option direct to the consumer (via dealers)? Seems like it would make the HDR the ultimate swiss army knife that could be run as a 160/160 26", 130/140 650, or a 147/150 650B.

That said, I haven't ridden a BikeCo modded HDR, so maybe there is downside to the mod they are doing that I am overlooking?).
 

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I think it may have to do with the amount of units they would need to purchase from a shock manufacturer and perhaps the contract they are currently in to buy a certain amount of shocks from particular manufacturers. That's just my $.02.
 

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First of all, I love Ibis, so this is meant as an honest question and not an attack:

It seems like a lot of people have been clamoring for a "true" Ibis 650B, by which them seem to mean something closer to 150/150 in travel with a reasonable (not jacked up) BB height. It seems like BikeCo has more or less come up with the solution people are looking for in a pretty creative way with their modded shock that allows for 147 rear travel without jacking up the BB.
14.1"+ BB height still sounds like a jacked up BB for a stock bike to me. There is no way around the geometry of the linkage and the seat tube.
 

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Well believe it or not, some people can. Just like a lot of people can detect the difference in head angles.

High BB's don't handle well, it's just basic physics. Just because you can't tell the difference doesn't mean others can't. High BB's suck.
 

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Yea, maybe you can, but probably you can't. Blind test, that small of a measurement difference, no way. You are kidding yourself if you think you can. 12" BB to 13"? Sure. Even the difference between a 67 and a 68 degree head angle is at least closing in on a 2% difference that I think someone could notice, especially since the effect is amplified by the length of the fork.

But 0.2% difference in BB height? Laughable. Buy the bike you want and ride the bike you want because of how it rides, not because you think you can parse out some infinitesimally small number difference.
 

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Patronising

Now you're saying 12" to 13". I'm talking figures over 14".

And yes people can tell the difference. You start off with something well over 14" BB, you add a big fork, high volume tyres. It will handle like a pig.

And how patronising are you? Buy the bike you want and ride the bike you want because of how it rides, not because you think you can parse out some infinitesimally small number difference. "

I've been riding long enough to know what I want and don't need patronising advice from a keyboard warrior.
 

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Go to their site. They have numerous builds in the pics section. In one -- sorry, don't have time to look right now -- they compare their 650b build to a stock 26/160. They line up the bottom brackets and they are identical.
That's the whole the whole point. Same BB and decent amount of travel (147mm) -- which is why the OP here is bang on with suggesting it's really something Ibis should offer stock.
Bikeco reduce the eye-to-eye measurement on the shock but use the 26 limbo chip, rather than the 650b one. They've has been very protective of what that measurement is but with a bit of searching you can find it in the forums.
 

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I'd say I'm being about as patronising as the guy who says that I can't tell the difference between a 14.1" BB and a 13.8" BB, but that he can. You know - THAT guy?

The human body just can't tell differences that small. Blind test - truly blind test - a guy gives you two identical looking bikes whose bottom brackets are different height by 0.3" inches - you would have no clue which one was which after riding them.

So yea, you should buy the bike you want. If you want a bike with a low BB height, then buy THAT bike. But that's not going to be a Mojo HD - NONE of the HDs have particularly low BB heights. 13.8" vs 14.1" is not a significant difference.

And speaking of keyboard jockeys, you sound like one. My Mojo HD and its BB definitely does not handle like a pig.

And how patronising are you? Buy the bike you want and ride the bike you want because of how it rides, not because you think you can parse out some infinitesimally small number difference. "
 

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Yea, maybe you can, but probably you can't. Blind test, that small of a measurement difference, no way. You are kidding yourself if you think you can. 12" BB to 13"? Sure. Even the difference between a 67 and a 68 degree head angle is at least closing in on a 2% difference that I think someone could notice, especially since the effect is amplified by the length of the fork.

But 0.2% difference in BB height? Laughable. Buy the bike you want and ride the bike you want because of how it rides, not because you think you can parse out some infinitesimally small number difference.
Yes it is noticeable! & let's get some figures straight 1st! I recently sold my Bike Co mod HD 650 bike & the bb was around 14.25 & with 26" tires 13.8". The 1st thing I noticed was when using my dropper seat post. My feet wasn't flat on the ground, instead my heals were slightly up. Most of the time on turns, I didn't notice a thing, but when the trail got steep & a switch back came up, I felt too high & awkward in turns. I didn't feel that when the bike was in 26" mode. So please stop staying it's not noticeable.

My current bike is Stumpy FSR 29" & the BB is 13.25 & that bike rails around the turns. When using my dropper, my feet is flat on the ground & when the trail gets steep, the bike feels nice & low, unlike my HD 650.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 

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But 0.2% difference in BB height? Laughable.
That does not make any sense. First of all, the difference is 2.2%, an order of magnitude larger than what you are saying. If for me 13.5" is good, comfortable average BB height (many people like it below 13.3"), then a jump from 13.8 to 14.1 is a 100% increase. Also, with BB heights over 14", you are getting to an uncomfortable standover territory, and more importantly, the BB / bike's center of gravity gets above or way too close to wheel axles. That is an inherently unstable setup. Last but not least, the perceived differences between 13.8 and 14.1 static BB height increases when you account for sag - a sag of a 160mm setup / 13.8" BB will drop the BB more than a sag of a 143mm setup 14.1" BB.

There is a reason we do not see bikes with BBs over 14" on the market.
 

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Another way to think about it is .3" is equivalent to 7.62mm. To be honest, I don't know if I can tell 7.62mm difference in BB height, just because I haven't done a back to back test myself, but I certainly can tell 5mm difference with crank length (175 vs. 170mm). Although crank length differences may be more significant than BB height difference, that still makes me believe that there are definitely riders out there, who will notice BB height differences of .3". I just don't have personal experience (yet).

With all that said, I think the real question here, asides from the OP's original question is what the heck is the real BB height BikeCo's 147mm shock? I've read some posts that say a definitive 13.7".

Here's one article that says it raises it .2" (stock is 13.5" with 140mm fork):
Ibis HDR: 2 Limbo Chips, 5 travel settings, Multiple Personality | MyBikeStand.com
"27.5" HDR 147mm Short Shock and 147mm Long Shock options offer two shocks and two personalities. BikeCo's 147mm modifications will raise the bottom bracket height only approx .2". .2" gets you 17mm more travel - and refined travel at that."

and here's BikeCo's article with interesting pictures but no specific numbers:
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10151704248448276.1073741849.322608118275&type=3
 
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