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I see the reviews of the American Classic Disc hubs are not kind. I always had good luck with older American Classic stuff. I was planning on building up a light weight set of wheels with these but if the seals stink and QC is garbage, probably won't use AC. Are these reviews of current models or early production models?

Any input appreciated.

REEK
 

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Reek said:
I see the reviews of the American Classic Disc hubs are not kind. I always had good luck with older American Classic stuff. I was planning on building up a light weight set of wheels with these but if the seals stink and QC is garbage, probably won't use AC. Are these reviews of current models or early production models?

Any input appreciated.

REEK
Unless you are "big" they are great. As for respected wheel builders using them, Dave Thomas built my rear wheel and with an AC disc hub and Mike Garcia built my front wheel on an AC disc hub. Don't come much more respected than that... I'm going on two years and they are smooth as silk. BTW, I weigh about 150 LBS. with gear. I crashed many times with these wheels, as well. No probs.
 

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Chris2fur said:
Unless you are "big" they are great. As for respected wheel builders using them, Dave Thomas built my rear wheel and with an AC disc hub and Mike Garcia built my front wheel on an AC disc hub. Don't come much more respected than that... I'm going on two years and they are smooth as silk. BTW, I weigh about 150 LBS. with gear. I crashed many times with these wheels, as well. No probs.
I'm at 175lb and the same builders steered me away from AC hubs. I think they indicated the flange design had changed and they were having problems with lateral stiffness.
 

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Latest version a different kettle of fish....also consider WTB

The flanges are not "weaker" on the new Am Classic hubs, nor were they weak on the old hubs. Am Classic hubs have perhaps the strongest flanges of any XC hub out there, and in 6 years of selling their products I have never had a flange break on any of their hubs.

The latest version of the Am Classic hubs has different rear flange spacing (distance between the two flanges) which is narrower. This can affect the lateral (side-to-side) stiffness of the wheel. I suspect that this new spacing issue is what builders were referring to. The new hubs also have a lot smaller bearings than the earlier editions, which concerns me. Speaking of bearings...

In addition, Am Classic released the initial batch of their new model hubs with insanely low quality bearings that literally fell to pieces in some cases. These bearings had red seals and I must conclude they were made from a generic processed cheese substitute, not even brand-name stuff like Velveeta or Cheez Whiz. Out of 6 hubs we sold with these red bearings we had 5 bearing failures, all within weeks (sometimes days) of selling the wheel. One hub I had to send in to them to be upgraded BEFORE even selling it because the bearing was ticking like a freehub right out of the box. The good news is that this problem HAS been addressed. They have now switched to a new Japanese bearing supplier (blue seals) and results with the new bearings have been much, much better. Unfortunately, it is not possible to undo the extremely poor impression that many dealers and customers received after getting the "Mission Impossible" bearing model.... ("This Bearing Will Self-Destruct in 10, 9, 8, 7....") I know I was personally pleased to spend a couple hundred bucks shipping brand new wheelsets back-and-forth to replace the bearings for clients :-( .

I would also encourage you to consider using the WTB Lazer Disc, which is a licensed version of the design from the prior Am Classic hub. You don't have the narrower flange spacing and you have much larger bearings for better durability. They do weigh 18g more on the front and 30g more on the rear, but they also cost significantly less, and have the improved freehub mechanism being used on the current Am Classic hub. I think it combines the best features of both the old and new Am Classic disc hub models. The other product to consider in this category is the DT Swiss 240S model, now that DT has solved their freehub slipping problem and hubshell cracking problem from the original Hugi 240 models. (See, nobody is perfect on the first try.)
 

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Good timing....

bianchi4me said:
The flanges are not "weaker" on the new Am Classic hubs, nor were they weak on the old hubs. Am Classic hubs have perhaps the strongest flanges of any XC hub out there, and in 6 years of selling their products I have never had a flange break on any of their hubs.

The latest version of the Am Classic hubs has different rear flange spacing (distance between the two flanges) which is narrower. This can affect the lateral (side-to-side) stiffness of the wheel. I suspect that this new spacing issue is what builders were referring to. The new hubs also have a lot smaller bearings than the earlier editions, which concerns me. Speaking of bearings...

In addition, Am Classic released the initial batch of their new model hubs with insanely low quality bearings that literally fell to pieces in some cases. These bearings had red seals and I must conclude they were made from a generic processed cheese substitute, not even brand-name stuff like Velveeta or Cheez Whiz. Out of 6 hubs we sold with these red bearings we had 5 bearing failures, all within weeks (sometimes days) of selling the wheel. One hub I had to send in to them to be upgraded BEFORE even selling it because the bearing was ticking like a freehub right out of the box. The good news is that this problem HAS been addressed. They have now switched to a new Japanese bearing supplier (blue seals) and results with the new bearings have been much, much better. Unfortunately, it is not possible to undo the extremely poor impression that many dealers and customers received after getting the "Mission Impossible" bearing model.... ("This Bearing Will Self-Destruct in 10, 9, 8, 7....") I know I was personally pleased to spend a couple hundred bucks shipping brand new wheelsets back-and-forth to replace the bearings for clients :-( .

I would also encourage you to consider using the WTB Lazer Disc, which is a licensed version of the design from the prior Am Classic hub. You don't have the narrower flange spacing and you have much larger bearings for better durability. They do weigh 18g more on the front and 30g more on the rear, but they also cost significantly less, and have the improved freehub mechanism being used on the current Am Classic hub. I think it combines the best features of both the old and new Am Classic disc hub models. The other product to consider in this category is the DT Swiss 240S model, now that DT has solved their freehub slipping problem and hubshell cracking problem from the original Hugi 240 models. (See, nobody is perfect on the first try.)
I was just going to post a question about why you still have the Lazer Disc hubs on your web page (since they are AC-made)--thanks for clearing up the issue. Why in the world did someone at AC make such bad decisions? I thought Bill Shook (do I have the name right?) had gotten involved again...
 

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Chris2fur said:
I was just going to post a question about why you still have the Lazer Disc hubs on your web page (since they are AC-made)--thanks for clearing up the issue. Why in the world did someone at AC make such bad decisions? I thought Bill Shook (do I have the name right?) had gotten involved again...
bianchi4me speaks the truth, go for the WTB hubs. Shook is indeed involved again and he defends his narrow flange rear hub to the hilt. The speculation is that the magnesium rims that he is selling in his AC wheelsets suffer a bit in the vertical rigidity department and by moving the flanges in, the straighter spokes make for a stiffer wheel while sacrificing lateral strength. Give and take I guess but I know which one I prefer.
 

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The WTB hubs did no good for me. I bought 2 front hubs, and one rear. One set is pretty much gone now, the front has play and ticks, the rear has simply gotten a few mm narrower on the driveside. At one point the chain ran against the frame when on the smallest cog, so I set my derailer to prevent going there. Then the cassette lockring (in a race) decided to brutally hub the frame, causing my drivetrain to grind to a halt. When things cooled down, or ground off, I was able to somewhat continue the race. Before I got the mentioned troubles, there was a long period where the hub would either not engage until after 180º crank movement (full boddy rotation or more), or the body would drag causing chains to drop. At once point, no matter how I adjusted the hub, it would produce both problems.
I had these wheels built with Velocity Dyad rims and CX-Ray spokes, I was hoping to get a bit more life out of them.

I was actually searching for reports on the new AC's, to see if there's reason to think they'd be better than the prior ones and WTB's, to give it one more go with the same expensive spokes. It doesn't look promising. How am I ever going to find rims and hubs to re-use these bling spokes?
The wheels didn't get much much, and I avoid bad weather.
The second front wheel hardly got used, thus still works as far as I know.

I respond in this old thread because my own experiences aren't in line with above posters, actually advising riders to invest in WTB hubs for what's inevitably going to be pretty bling wheels, even if the hubs don't break the bank. I'm currently broke and without wheels. Had I gone DT when I had the cash, accepting the handful of extra grams, I'd still have good racedays wheels now.
 

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Dt

Go with DT centerlock hubs for disc brake use; light and durable. Super smooth swiss quality. DT makes a trick 30 gram adapter that will mount 6 bolt rotors to these hubs with no bolts! A supercool setup IMHO.
 
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