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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I, and my LBS, have tried everything to get some braking power out of a pair of M6Tis, but they suck. Things we've tried:

- Bleeding
- The new 218mm front rotor (that is NOT a typo)!
- Goodridge brake lines

Front and rear seem to suck equally, and the pads have not been contaminated. They are still much weaker than my Hayes 8" brakes. The Hopes feel really good for light-to-moderate braking but they can't seem to get past "moderate", no matter how hard I squeeze the levers. It's a very disconcerting feeling, I have overshot turns due to the lack of power (with brakes not hot). And on some steep, slidey downs I can't even get the real wheel to lock

Is there some trick to getting these brakes to perform the way one would think they should, given the beefy construction and the beefy price?

Thanks for any help.
 

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Try new pads, and post over at ridemonkey.
 

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Lucky13 said:
Well, keep in mind that Hayes has 2, but huge pistons that will grab hard. My understanding is that since Hope has smaller pistons, it will have better modulation (unlike Hayes).
its not necessarily like that. If 6 pistons have the same fluid surface area as the 2 pistons, then really they are identical (excluding temperature or other effects). What having more than a single piston pair allows you to do is to get a specific piston surface area that comforms to the desired caliper and pad/rotor size. For example, if you wanted twice the fluid surface area as the Hayes, it would be better to add 2 more pistons rather than making the piston area twice as big.

There could also be cooling concerns, where more pistons (and associated components)can dissipate more heat. More heat disspation equals more power.

But really, alot of it comes down to the pads and rotors. You can have a super powerful well tuned car, but it isnt worth **** if your tires suck. Same with brakes, if you cant get the pad/rotor traction, then the amount of force at the piston is irrelevant.

So the number of pistons doesnt necessarily mean more modulation. Modulation has alot to do with the lever design and the pads and rotors. Because all the pistons and master cylinder do is set up a constant 'leverage' ratio between each other, other factors can give you both good modulation and power, not just either or.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks, found this over at RideMonkey:

"Second question the brakes came with two sets of pads reds and golds,
whats better for the north shore? the Reds say Downhill use Soft compound and the golds say High Durability such as riding in wet or muddy conditons "

Checked with LBS and they think only one set came with the brakes and don't know which they were. I will check when i get home tonight, and update tomorrow.
 

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Man those hope brakes are worthless and I can help you out, I'll trade you a 1 month old set of hayes mag with 8" rotors. I'll even pay your shipping. ;) :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Update: Did some research, including calling Hope-USA, and got many conflicting answers. But bottom line it looks like the M6Ti's come stock with pads unsuitable to DH (Hope says they ship Greens, mine look like Golds, which EBC says are "Not for DH"). I've ordered some EBC Red pads. Maybe this will fix the problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Pretty accurate. Except you left out the part where they told me to rub wet mud all over the rotors and ride around on my street with the brakes applied (not kidding here).
 

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Sumo-class Rider said:
Pretty accurate. Except you left out the part where they told me to rub wet mud all over the rotors and ride around on my street with the brakes applied (not kidding here).
yeah, probably has to do with pad wearing on the rotor. Thats why when you clean the rotor, the brakes need to be broken in again...believe they call it burnishing. The rotor need pad material on it to work properly.

My Hayes can be broken in by two passes up and down the street with the brakes applied (like riding a crappy excersize bike). They heat up very fast in not much time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I did the standard break-in routine, rode in the street, then an easy fireroad type ride, then a few increasingly aggressive rides. But they don't feel right. Feel "glazed", but now that I know about the stock pads, I think that explains that feeling. I'm betting the Red pads will fix the problem (hopefully).
 

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Sumo-class Rider said:
I did the standard break-in routine, rode in the street, then an easy fireroad type ride, then a few increasingly aggressive rides. But they don't feel right. Feel "glazed", but now that I know about the stock pads, I think that explains that feeling. I'm betting the Red pads will fix the problem (hopefully).
And if that don't work, you could always resort to buying the right brakes this time...
H A Y E S
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Ha-ha, I have Hayes on my Joker and love them, but I wanted more cooling capacity on my new bike (soon to be revealed here...). I'll be a bit pissed if these $500 M6Ti's have to be tossed in favor of a trusty pair of Hayes....
 

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Sumo-class Rider said:
Ha-ha, I have Hayes on my Joker and love them, but I wanted more cooling capacity on my new bike (soon to be revealed here...). I'll be a bit pissed if these $500 M6Ti's have to be tossed in favor of a trusty pair of Hayes....
Hey Sumo, when you get the new pads and have a chance to check them out can you report back your results or PM me. I'm about to order a set too. Thanks in advance.
 

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milhouse said:
Hey Sumo, when you get the new pads and have a chance to check them out can you report back your results or PM me. I’m about to order a set too. Thanks in advance.
I had the same problem as you Sumo. I replaced the stock pads with the set Hope recommended and it made a HUGE difference. I can actually lock up the rear wheel now. I'm still a little bummed b/c I expected the 6's to be one finger brakes, but I feel the lack of power has me grabbing with 2 fingers. I met a guy from Hope and he said he even runs the 4's over the 6's b/c the 6's don't ever really have that solid feel to them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
By the way, I had ordered spare Hope pads from Universal to keep in my toolkit, and they are the exact same pads as came with brakes, down to the part number stamped in the backing plate. So be careful when you order new pads. I can't recommend the stock Hope "sintered" pads for anything other than level ground rides. Probably will last forever in that app though.
 

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Sumo-class Rider said:
By the way, I had ordered spare Hope pads from Universal to keep in my toolkit, and they are the exact same pads as came with brakes, down to the part number stamped in the backing plate. So be careful when you order new pads. I can't recommend the stock Hope "sintered" pads for anything other than level ground rides. Probably will last forever in that app though.
my stock hope pads work well in all conditions. my C2's, O2's & DH04's all perform flawlessly......
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Hmmm, Ben, have you seen Sumo huffing and puffing around Portola Hills lately???? I need to take pics of my new steed this weekend, it's been on 5 or 6 rides and is filthy and already has a few dings (along with my new full-face helmet)....
 
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