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This has probably all been covered, but here's what I want. A 5"+ travel 29er. With 150mm TA rear and lower stand-over than the Sultan. With a ~5" travel fork geometry should be a little more slack than the Sultan as well...not too much, though. Spot and/or RFX tubing, Spot/RFX stays. Some headtube gusseting, this frame is gonna get banged around. Available with an air or coil shock.

Plus (not having anything to do with Turner) a Zoke 66/Fox 36-like 29er fork. Around 150mm travel, with travel reduction down to 100 or so. No lockout needed. Thick stanchions, at least 35mm. Air sprung is preferable, a la 36 Talas or 66SL. Rockshox (and 2-step) need not apply.

Goal build weight with XT drivetrain/brakes, Easton/Thomson bits, "AM" wheels, etc. would be similar to the current RFX: 32 to 35lbs. Should take almost as much abuse as an '07 RFX. I wouldn't plan to go downhilling with it, though.

So in reality we're waiting for the fork manufacturers, not Turner. Maybe if he builds it, they will too?
 

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PCinSC said:
This has probably all been covered, but here's what I want. A 5"+ travel 29er...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're not exactly a dyed in the wool 29"er zealot, are you PC? And yet you are interested in a long travel 29"er and seem to have a pretty good handle on what one should look like. It's definitely a recurring theme on this thread.

I wish the industry would wake up and realize that big wheels aren't a freak show anymore, and that they can appeal to riders of all types (not just stinky singlespeeders). I can't blame DT for not diving in while there's only one fork on the market, but somebody's going to have to break formation. Lenz seems about three or four years ahead of everyone else when it comes to 29" wheels, so we've probably got another couple years before longer travel 29"ers really start popping up. :madman:

In reality the only way a mainstream fork is going to arrive is with an OEM contract (with the possible exception of Manitou), so the small builders will have that to contend with (i.e. a Kona/Trek/Specialized bike) when there finally is a fork worth building a bike around. In some ways that will legitimize the market, but it also makes it that much harder to get your frames out there when someone is selling complete bikes with the "it" fork for the same price (think Fisher Rig a year or two ago).

Don't mind me, just rambling here mostly. I just know I was asking for a Sultan 3+ years before it was released, and subsequently have been asking for a longer travel bike. That leaves approximately two years if things progress at the same rate. :rolleyes:
 

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miles e said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're not exactly a dyed in the wool 29"er zealot, are you PC? And yet you are interested in a long travel 29"er and seem to have a pretty good handle on what one should look like. It's definitely a recurring theme on this thread.
No, I don't own one. I've had one demo ride on a 29er, and while I didn't quite have an epiphany of any kind I could definitely feel the benefits of the bigger wheels. The difference was significant enough for me to want one for trail riding. I still want to have a long-travel 26er for DH/FR duties, but I want a 29er that can handle any aggressive trail riding that I do and still be light enough so that the climbs aren't pure misery (like they are on my overbuilt RFX).

There are plenty of XC/trail 29er frames out there, but regarding the rougher stuff other than the Lenz Lunchboxx I don't see any other bikes on the market that fit the niche I'm looking for. A Sultan with a WB F135 up front is close, but when you get down to it that frame is still just a big Flux. And I wouldn't ride a Flux.

So I guess we wait. That's OK, I don't have the money to buy one right now. And I think a Highline is first on my shopping list anyway. :D
 

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PCinSC said:
A Sultan with a WB F135 up front is close, but when you get down to it that frame is still just a big Flux. And I wouldn't ride a Flux.
...not a flux. If you mean the 4" travel = a flux....um, I guess.:rolleyes:
But with all 5 Spot tubing, it is a big Spot w/ 100mm of travel (when stock) :D
 

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jncarpenter said:
...not a flux. If you mean the 4" travel = a flux....um, I guess.:rolleyes:
But with all 5 Spot tubing, it is a big Spot w/ 100mm of travel (when stock) :D
C'mon Jay.....the 27 lb 6" by 6" Specialized Gheyduro is exactly the same as a 6" RFX, right? Same travel......so must be the same
 

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Proper cable routing

Jerk_Chicken said:
I think we're ready for full housing...


110% torsionally stiffer? What a C.teaser ;)
The hidraulic cable routing, at least on the flux, should be on the left side, and not on the center. In the center should be placed the RD cable routing
A small change but it would made a big diference in proper cable routing.
 

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Discussion Starter #113
Lancaster said:
The hidraulic cable routing, at least on the flux, should be on the left side, and not on the center. In the center should be placed the RD cable routing
A small change but it would made a big diference in proper cable routing.
No, the center is for the brake housing. The reason it's like that is because I'm not going to remove fittings and bleed the brake just to make it more aesthetically pleasing to you. Additionally, there's flashing in the guides from the drilling and I'd rather have it wear on shift housing instead of brake hose.

Thanks for your input.
 

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Discussion Starter #114
Mr Pink said:
A 120mm Flux would be nice! More than 2 std colours.
That was the first 5 Spot. Unfortunately, I don't think a 5" Flux would ever happen because of the forces a 5" bike would see and the light weight of the Flux tubing.

Would be nice to see a heavy duty XC ride like the Burner was, but the Spot has fully surpassed it, in my opinion.
 

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jncarpenter said:
...not a flux. If you mean the 4" travel = a flux....um, I guess.:rolleyes:
But with all 5 Spot tubing, it is a big Spot w/ 100mm of travel (when stock) :D
You beat me to it.

Adressing PC's other request, with the wb135 (or other 5" fork) on the front, the geo is a bit slacker.

Faux Part Deux said:
C'mon Jay.....the 27 lb 6" by 6" Specialized Gheyduro is exactly the same as a 6" RFX, right? Same travel......so must be the same
So I guess the Sultan is the same too, since the big wheels add at minimum 2" of travel . . . Heck, some days whem I am riding my Sultan on the local paved bike path testing my gnarcoreskillz, it feels like 4" of extra travel (tongue firmly in cheek)
 

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My 2 cents

In order from "pretty please" to "nit pick":

* Modular dropouts on all but the lightest XC intended machines - 12mm option, QR option, multiple mounting positions for tweaking head tube angle and BB height

* Slightly beefier stays for the Sultan, basically a Clydesdale option, 12mm axle would help sure things up, horizontally ribbed to increase the lateral sectional modulus

* Grease Zerts in the pivot bolts ala the Banshee approach, universally easier to access, cleaner overall look, fewer manufacturing steps

* Improved rear disk hydraulic hose routing and management, the taco tie down sounds like a good idea

* Improved graphics set under a coat of clear powder, basically have a finish indicative of a $1900 frame

* Finner details on the machined bits, for example machine in a "T" or something in the dropout instead of the seemingly random tool path pattern, sure it looks "industrial" but it sure doesn't looked finished or well thought out
 

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Discussion Starter #119
powersusa said:
In order from "pretty please" to "nit pick":

* Modular dropouts on all but the lightest XC intended machines - 12mm option, QR option, multiple mounting positions for tweaking head tube angle and BB height

* Slightly beefier stays for the Sultan, basically a Clydesdale option, 12mm axle would help sure things up, horizontally ribbed to increase the lateral sectional modulus

* Grease Zerts in the pivot bolts ala the Banshee approach, universally easier to access, cleaner overall look, fewer manufacturing steps

* Improved rear disk hydraulic hose routing and management, the taco tie down sounds like a good idea

* Improved graphics set under a coat of clear powder, basically have a finish indicative of a $1900 frame

* Finner details on the machined bits, for example machine in a "T" or something in the dropout instead of the seemingly random tool path pattern, sure it looks "industrial" but it sure doesn't looked finished or well thought out
I'm not too sure about the Zerks in the pivot bolts because if the pivot gets filled with grease, chances are the threads will be too and I'd rather have loctite on my threads than grease.

Turner has spoken in the past about the logos. This gives the owner the option to remove them altogether, or freshen the frame with new ones. Does it work for all? Perhaps not, but this one can go either way. It's inconsequential to me.

About the finish- I think the Olympic PC is very high in quality. Even after a few years, they can be recovered with very little effort. So I disagree about that. The powdercoat currently used is of great quality and thank god it's not the Ellsworth ano finish. I think it is indicative of the price of the frame. You could always go to E, pay $400 more and get that lovely finish and deal with them when your rockers pit or break, or your rear end isn't aligned right or restricts you from using certain cranks. They sure do pay attention to details, though!

I don't think Turner is in the market to be the flashiest bike line out there. They are certainly well crafted and clean-industrial. They ride well and last a good amount of time and the thought in them is over 12 years of design evolution. Flashiness can go to other companies and so can the money. It's all about choices and the ride takes precedent here. Once can always get their own PC after they get the frame and have the design and stickers any way they want.

Routing-some have had issues, some not. I won't speak since I have not had a problem. Several taco frames and now one tacoless with good routing.

T on the dropout might be nice, but the absence is not an indicator of a poorly thought out design.
 
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