Mountain Bike Reviews Forum banner
1 - 20 of 115 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Some folks won't touch this post with a 10' pole but I am interested.

A patent fee is paid for use of the DWL, right? I am not a patent attorney so bare with me.

So how does Giant (heard a little on this "disagreement"), Lapierre, Moonraker, Banshee etc...use the DWL without paying for rights to use it (did not see the DW on the stays).

I heard the argument that these are "slightly" different than the DWL. How so?

With the FSR patent was it not as simple as if "your chainstay pivot is lower and in front of the rear axle" its FSR and you owe Specialized money.

Is it the issue of the inventor of DWL (purposefully vague) having to tackle a large international corporation without capital to pay counsel for the fight?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,370 Posts
Techz said:
Some folks won't touch this post with a 10' pole but I am interested.

A patent fee is paid for use of the DWL, right? I am not a patent attorney so bare with me.

So how does Giant (heard a little on this "disagreement"), Lapierre, Moonraker, Banshee etc...use the DWL without paying for rights to use it (did not see the DW on the stays).

I heard the argument that these are "slightly" different than the DWL. How so?

With the FSR patent was it not as simple as if "your chainstay pivot is lower and in front of the rear axle" its FSR and you owe Specialized money.

Is it the issue of the inventor of DWL (purposefully vague) having to tackle a large international corporation without capital to pay counsel for the fight?
In a word... YES.

Moderator, close this thread. His/her question has been answered.
 

·
www.derbyrims.com
Joined
·
6,766 Posts
Techz said:
I heard the argument that these are "slightly" different than the DWL. How so?
What is claimed by the patent... Read Claim #1 about half way down this page - http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=ezx7AAAAEBAJ&dq=David+Weagle

Currently (I think) only Giant continues to blatantly steal DW's property in the USA.

Other DWL near copies are not aligning a projected line through the upper link to cross through the lower link anywhere in travel. But some do come very near to this link alignment intersection and may have somewhat similar ride time characteristics as a DWL.

Can David slay the Giant?

Personally, I won't even demo ride a Giant Maestro. Giant is already dead in my world.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
466 Posts
derby said:
What is claimed by the patent... Read Claim #1 about half way down this page - http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=ezx7AAAAEBAJ&dq=David+Weagle

Currently (I think) only Giant continues to blatantly steal DW's property in the USA.

Other DWL near copies are not aligning a projected line through the upper link to cross through the lower link anywhere in travel. But some do come very near to this link alignment intersection and may have somewhat similar ride time characteristics as a DWL.

Can David slay the Giant?

Personally, I won't even demo ride a Giant Maestro. Giant is already dead in my world.
go get em dave!!!!
 

·
Ti is addictive
Joined
·
2,894 Posts
Does DW's patent exist outside of the US? The companies you noted are mostly on the international market where Horst linkage bikes are a plenty that aren't paying the Big S.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
436 Posts
Techz said:
Some folks won't touch this post with a 10' pole but I am interested.

A patent fee is paid for use of the DWL, right? I am not a patent attorney so bare with me.

So how does Giant (heard a little on this "disagreement"), Lapierre, Moonraker, Banshee etc...use the DWL without paying for rights to use it (did not see the DW on the stays).

I heard the argument that these are "slightly" different than the DWL. How so?

With the FSR patent was it not as simple as if "your chainstay pivot is lower and in front of the rear axle" its FSR and you owe Specialized money.

Is it the issue of the inventor of DWL (purposefully vague) having to tackle a large international corporation without capital to pay counsel for the fight?
You have to look at the bright side, even if a few bikes are using a system that may infringe the DW link pattent, nobody is using it in the same way that Dave Weagle. (Short, High and Horizontal lower link...)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
750 Posts
It's not as simple as that. After speaking with a design insider whose company makes a very similar design, the DW patent is defined by the relationship of the Instant Center (IC) created by the mini-links and the BB of the bike. I believe mini-link bikes whose whose kinematic characteristics do not defy the patent are considered novel. Whether this is a problem in the patent language or not, I am unsure.
 

·
Amphibious Technologies
Joined
·
3,472 Posts
inzane said:
because the same patent laws do not apply there?
Perhaps because either there is no patent/s there or the patent/s has already expired.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,416 Posts
Apparently, outside of America they have different laws, different currencies and even speak different languages. Amazing huh?
 

·
Amphibious Technologies
Joined
·
3,472 Posts
wilks said:
Apparently, outside of America they have different laws, different currencies and even speak different languages. Amazing huh?
But apparently the patent laws aren't that different and US patent laws will soon be pretty much the similar to the rest of the world's.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
140 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
So there are not intellectual property rights in other countries and US based design patents have no standing in other countries?
 

·
Bandolero
Joined
·
2,438 Posts
Jaws

SCUBAPRO said:
But apparently the patent laws aren't that different and US patent laws will soon be pretty much the similar to the rest of the world's.
You are scaremongering.

I don't have the time or desire to research that spurious comment but unless you have some real examples, I'll have to call that as the talk of someone who has never seen patent law and enforcement outside of North America.

From what I've seen of EU patent law it is untrue. A patent in the UK does not apply to Germany even when done through the EPO.

Things break down even more on other continents.
 
1 - 20 of 115 Posts
Top