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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
When my group of riding buddies get word I am switching to tubeless, they will swear HELL FROZE OVER. The reason: I am the only guy NOT running tubeless. I have DT Swiss 4.1 rims. I do have a few questions....

1) Are some rim strips better than others and why? The video on Stan's website implies their strips are superior. DT SWISS has their system. The Maxxis rim strips have been well received- they look pretty thick though. Going "ghetto" tubeless is another option. Etc. Etc. Etc.

2) Should I be concerned with the weight of a rim strip w/ regard to rolling resistance? Maxxis weighs 95g while the Eclipse rim strip weighs 35g?

3) As for sealant, should I go Stan's and be done with it? Anything better? Any issues with sealant delaminating tires?

Thanks!
 

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Tech geek and racerboy
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The DT Swiss system is made by eclipse, and supposedly fits in the DT rim very well. The Stan's strip works fine as well. Either one would probably be fine. I don't know anything about the Maxxis rim strip, but that sounds really heavy, so even if it works I'd stay away. I've had good experience with the Stan's rim strip, and I'm sure the eclipse one is fine as well.

I'd use Stan's sealant; it seems to be the most universally accepted one, and I've had really good personal experience with it.

RE: Delaminating tires, I believe Shiggy did an unofficial test on a number of tires and found no real adverse effects from long-term use of sealant in a tire. I've never had a tire last long enough to show any effects myself.
 

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No, that's not phonetic
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The Maxxis strip weighs more because it covers the entire channel including up the rim inner side walls, and over the hook. The whole bead area of the tire engages the strip top to bottom. The strip also follows the contours of the hook and and you get the full benefit of the hook, so there is no burping (that's what scared the crap out of me with Stans).

Maxxis strips only cost $5 each as Maxxis was blowing them out and has since stopped making them. Go-Ride bought out a lot of the remaining stock as they love the things. If you want to try them (some sizes no longer available), try Go-Ride.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
TSCHEEZY- The whole tubeless thing makes me nervous. Burping tires make me nervous. The thought of YOUR tire going kaBOOM makes me nervous!!

In your opinion, is the DT system good enough? Stan's good enough? Is the MAXXIS rimstrip worth the weight penalty? I don't want to add (rotational) weight uneccessarily. From your description of the Maxxis rim strip, it may indeed be worth it.

Thanks for the Go-Ride mention
 

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you'll gain some rotation weight with the Maxxis rim strips. They weigh about 90 to 100 grams each, plus 1 or 2 cups of sealant and you are at around 150 to 200 grams per wheel (versus 100 -150 grams for a light tube). However, the flat protection is worth it.
 

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I used a Stans setup on my 4.2 rims. I had a little trouble mounting the tire as the rim strip kept squeezing out but I kept fussing with it and it eventually stayed in. No burping so far. Both rim strips weighed 117 grams for the pair. I couldn't get a Swiss conversion for the 4.2 or I probably would have went with them.
 

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DT or Eclipse

I got my DT 5.1s last week together with the DT Tubeless kit. I would recommend that kit over Stans or the Maxxis strips. First, the DT Kit is specific to the rim. Second, and more importantly for me, the valve stem and the rim strip on the DT Kit are separate. Thus, if you have a flat and need to put in a tube, you can simply take the valve stem out and put in a tube without having to take out the rim strip. My understanding of the Stans Kit and the Maxxis Strips (I aplologize if this is wrong -- emphasize "my understanding") is that the valve stem is part of the strip, so you have to take out the whole strip rather than just the stem.

Once I got the strips and valve stem in, I was able to air up my tires with a floor pump without any problem. Overnight they lost no air and held up great for a ride a day later. Although I used the DT sealant, I will liklely use Stans sealant when necessary to add more, as the Stans is cheaper and appears to be roughly the same thing (and I have two bottles of Stans already).
 

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Years ago when I first set some wheels up with Stans (Mavic F219 w/ wide strips) I burped about half the front tire's pressure on a steep, grippy, off camber, downhill braking turn. The tire was massively side loaded and just enough of a gap opened to allow a pile of air to rush out. I was only running the pressure slightly lower than I did with a tubed setup (about 32psi vs 36psi). The fact that the Stans strip ate a lot of the space under the hook, effectively reducing the area that the bead is supposed to sit to grab the hook, is what I thought led to the burping. That experience and a few flats that the sealant didn't heal made me hang it up. I fiddled with it a number of times over the years, but never really came to terms with it. It just seemed like a huge bother with no benefit.

Fast forward a bit. We do desert road trips twice a year, and on some trips we go the whole time without flats, and other times we just seem to be cacti magnets. We were riding with Krispi from Go-Ride and he wondered why we didn't run tubless (he had the Maxxis strips). I explained my history with the stuff and he assured me the Maxxis strips would not burp. Maxxis was blowing the strips out dirt cheap ($5 each and you got a free t-shirt :)), so I ordered a bunch to fit various rims. They proved to be quite easy to air up.

I just would stay away from light single ply tires with Stans. Schwalbe tires also seem to have periodic issues. Nice thick DH tires are probably a lot safer and that is what I will run tubless in the future, or get UST tires if I can find some that are in the 2.5 range.

I know folks here have had good luck with Stans and run paper thin Kendas and stuff, but I only need one near death experience to make me think otherwise. ;)

Edit: jfh is correct- the Maxxis strips have permanent valve stems so you would need to pull them if you have to toss a tube in. Depending on the rim, the Maxxis strips can be very easy to seat (Mavic 219 and 321 or WTB dual duty) or not so easy (Mavic 317/717), so it depends whether this is a pain or not...
 

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Problem

The difference between UST non-UST rims is not just the holes..
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Like car, truck, motorcycle and any other UST (tubeless) rim

The rim is shaped differently..

The rim is essentially "flat" across the inside with a "groove" (where the spokes would be) with the sole purpose of creating clearance for removing and installing the tire

It also has "lips" near the bead..

The purpose of this design it to keep the tire on the rim... when it is low on pressure, or when it is hit from the side.

This is why you need a tire-machine to get the tire off a car or motorcycle rim

This is why a tube-less UST (or car etc.) tire "pops" when the bead "seats" over the ridges

That is why you have to "push with you thumbs really hard" to get the UST tire off the bead..

This is why UST tires don't "burp" when you hit something

This is why UST tires stay on the rim when they go flat..
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Non-ust rims don't have these features.. some of the newer one narrow the spoke "groove" but they are not the same

The result is, when a non-ust tire goes flat, the tire easily goes back from the rim edge
The tire will "burp" easily with lo pressure
The tire will come off the rim (like a tube type) when it goes flat..
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Some people have success with "conversions" and if you keep the pressure up and use Stans.. you should have no problem..BUT they are not as secure as UST rims..:thumbsup:

Overall, since a any UST setup with Stans is FAAARRRR superior to tubes for flat prevention, it is worth the time and money..
 

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Master of None
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I'm rollin on Maxxis rimstrips with Stan's sealant. The Maxxis strips are sweet - they have a lip on the inside to seal the tire (Like a UST rim) and they also go all the way over the edge of the rim. No burping with Maxxis; a couple times I have burped with the Stan's strips.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks Presslab. I purchased a pair of Maxxis strips on closeout- may give them a try. The DT, Stan's and Ghetto systems are still being considered.

Should I be concerned about the added weight of the 100g Maxxis (ie. added rolling resistance) versus the lighter DT or Stan's kits?
 

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Had a couple of sets of stans on 717s and now have the DTSwiss kit. The issue I had with stans strips is the valve part pulling out of the rim. The DTs have a separate piece and like someone mentioned, makes it easy to stick in a tube if needed. The DTs are the better choice, IMHO.
 

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DRTRIDR said:
Should I be concerned about the added weight of the 100g Maxxis (ie. added rolling resistance) versus the lighter DT or Stan's kits?
Yes, 200 grams for both wheels plus the weight of sealant (about 50 grams per cup and I used 4 cups for 2.35 or 2.5 tires) and you are at 400 grams per tire. A lightweight tube setup is around 250 grams for two... However, if you live somewhere where goatheads or thorns are a problem, the Maxxis strips plus Stans are a great combination... I never had a tire burp with the Maxxis and Stans combination...
 

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That is very good to know..

presslab said:
I'm rollin on Maxxis rimstrips with Stan's sealant. The Maxxis strips are sweet - they have a lip on the inside to seal the tire (Like a UST rim) and they also go all the way over the edge of the rim. No burping with Maxxis; a couple times I have burped with the Stan's strips.
I didn't know that.. I wonder if the Mavic ones have them..

I have one set of Single-Trax.. they have so many holes in them, I didn't see how I could run them UST, now I will try... :thumbsup:
 

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DRTRIDR said:
Thanks Presslab. I purchased a pair of Maxxis strips on closeout- may give them a try. The DT, Stan's and Ghetto systems are still being considered.

Should I be concerned about the added weight of the 100g Maxxis (ie. added rolling resistance) versus the lighter DT or Stan's kits?
It won't affect rolling resistance, so at constant speed it won't take any more power. However they will take more power to spin them up, slow them down, and being heavier it will have more gyro effect making handling a little bit slower, etc.

My bikes with the Maxxis strips are 30 and 36 lbs so it's no whoop for me.

A couple times trying to get the Stan's strips to seat was really pissing me off. Even with a compressor they were a biotch. Goop all over the place, trying to grab the thing to seat the bead with goop all over my legs. Ended up using a strap on the O.D. of the tire like those 4x4 guys do it. The Maxxis strips all seated with just a floor pump!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
The weight isn't really an issue. The gyro effect is also no biggie. I thought there would be a little more talk about the Ghetto tubeless method? Not trying to bounce around.

I can't decide whether I should experiment with the GHETTO method and save my MAXXIS strips for a later date or just go Maxxis and be done with it.
 

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So you have Maxxis strips just sitting there, ready to install, and you are instead considering mucking about with some bmx tubes and scissors and crap?? Are you nuts? Just mount the Maxxis strips already! Save them for what? Jeeze. :)
 

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One think I found out about Stans

presslab said:
You can see some pics here on Shiggy's site:
http://www.mtbtires.com/tech/sealant_test/index.html
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What I have found out about Stans, is it sometimes won't work without actually riding the tire...
Seems to have something to do with the flexing and the way the sealant is disbursed .
I tried to mount a tire with holes in it, and Stans.. rotated the tire.. wouldn't completely seal and went flat..
I filled it up again, took it for a ride and it never leaked again..
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Just an observation..

:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
tscheezy said:
So you have Maxxis strips just sitting there, ready to install, and you are instead considering mucking about with some bmx tubes and scissors and crap?? Are you nuts? Just mount the Maxxis strips already! Save them for what? Jeeze. :)
Tscheezy- Thanks for the kick in the a$$!!! I needed that. :thumbsup: The Maxxis should be mounted sometime this weekend! Aaaah, I feel better already.
 
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