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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i'd like to go tubeless but refuse to shell out $80 for the stan's kit. i was thinking of trying the following:

debur the rims/spoke holes
use electrical tape or mylar tape for rim tape
use silicon glue at the corners of the rim
cut a presta 20" bmx tube in half, stretch it over the rim, seal/set in place with the glue
mount the tire, fill with half a bottle of slime and inflate

think it'll work? some unsettled questions:

overlap the half tube with the tire bead? if so, inside or outside of the bead? how much overlap, extending outside of the rim or not?
dilute the slime? use more slime? use stan's goop instead?
 

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drunkle said:
i'd like to go tubeless but refuse to shell out $80 for the stan's kit. i was thinking of trying the following:

debur the rims/spoke holes
use electrical tape or mylar tape for rim tape
use silicon glue at the corners of the rim
cut a presta 20" bmx tube in half, stretch it over the rim, seal/set in place with the glue
mount the tire, fill with half a bottle of slime and inflate

think it'll work? some unsettled questions:

overlap the half tube with the tire bead? if so, inside or outside of the bead? how much overlap, extending outside of the rim or not?
dilute the slime? use more slime? use stan's goop instead?
It'll probably work, it is basically the same as the "Ghetto Tubeless" that has been floating around, but there are much better (and easier) DIY systems worked out. It is generally not recommended to run the tube between the bead and the rim. There also formulas for latex sealant floating around on the forums. Slime itself works well for sealing holes, but not the rim of the tire. Like I said, do a search and you'll find all kinds of pros and cons to various techniques for DIY tubeless.
 

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drunkle said:
i'd like to go tubeless but refuse to shell out $80 for the stan's kit. i was thinking of trying the following:

debur the rims/spoke holes
use electrical tape or mylar tape for rim tape
use silicon glue at the corners of the rim
cut a presta 20" bmx tube in half, stretch it over the rim, seal/set in place with the glue
mount the tire, fill with half a bottle of slime and inflate

think it'll work? some unsettled questions:

overlap the half tube with the tire bead? if so, inside or outside of the bead? how much overlap, extending outside of the rim or not?
dilute the slime? use more slime? use stan's goop instead?
Not really an original idea. Ghetto tubeless. Lots of people use it, and it seems that they're all pretty happy with it.

Let the excess tube hang over the rim when you put the tire on, and then after the tire is on, trim off the excess tube around it.

You'll need a valve core remover to get the slime in. Use Stan's, it's good stuff. It dissolves the rubber a bit and bonds it to the rim.
 

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yeah, stan's is way over priced for what you get...the key to Stan's are those rim strips....we need somebody to figure out how to cut a rubber inner tube to the perfect size...this is really tricky if you've never tried...stan wants $25 a piece for these rim strips because he knows this is the key...he definitely wants to make as much as possible...can't blame him since he lives in U.S.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
thanks for the tips. stan's goop isnt terribly expensive compared to the kit/rubber strip cost so that's ok. but should i or should i not run the tube flap between the rim/bead? two conflicting answers...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
adamantane said:
yeah, stan's is way over priced for what you get...the key to Stan's are those rim strips....we need somebody to figure out how to cut a rubber inner tube to the perfect size...this is really tricky if you've never tried...stan wants $25 a piece for these rim strips because he knows this is the key...he definitely wants to make as much as possible...can't blame him since he lives in U.S.
come to think of it, i wonder if a rim strip is needed at all. use duct tape to seal the spoke holes, mount just the valve into the valve hole and seal with silicon...
 

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drunkle said:
come to think of it, i wonder if a rim strip is needed at all. use duct tape to seal the spoke holes, mount just the valve into the valve hole and seal with silicon...
Or just buy the Maxxis rim strips for $5 each. Get the correct size for your rims.
 

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drunkle said:
come to think of it, i wonder if a rim strip is needed at all. use duct tape to seal the spoke holes, mount just the valve into the valve hole and seal with silicon...
no, i think you need rim strips..but after ponder the actual function of the stan's rim strips..they don't have anything to do with the bead and rim...like i first thought...so yeah...maybe maxxis rim strip..an then get the valve in there with silicone
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
shiggy said:
Or just buy the Maxxis rim strips for $5 each. Get the correct size for your rims.
not a bad idea, but they weigh as much as my tubes. plus, i have a couple donor tubes for valves, a roll of duct tape and some chewing gum...
 

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drunkle said:
come to think of it, i wonder if a rim strip is needed at all. use duct tape to seal the spoke holes, mount just the valve into the valve hole and seal with silicon...
shiggy mentioned maxxis rim strips and i did some seearching....i found a review by a guy named steve from Tucson here in the mtb review under stan's...he poionts out the same thing that we agree on...i will probably get myself some maxxis strips in the next week to try...

qouting:
Well, here is how I feel about Stan's NoTubes System. In general I think it's a great idea and works pretty well for the most part. The reality that no tire setup is perfect for every and all conditions every or every rider. If you ride a lot (5 to 6 days a week) you well know that tire maintenance and preservation is key to a good ride. I've used Stan's NoTubes System for a year now on my 717's and it works pretty well. Yes, it's messy at times when you flat (I always bring a small rag for cleanup). And yes, if your tire gets a 1/2 inch gash in its sidewall, you can bet it's not going to hold air....Stan's or no Stan's, slime or no slime. Also, if you follow the advice at the Stan's webpage on tire recommendations, the tire should not blow off the rim. I ride mostly Hutchinson's and have had no problems yet (I race xc and ride very aggressively while training).

Is there anything else out there? Well, yes, sort of. As you may know, the Stan's rim strips are way over priced for what you get. It's basically a 24" tube cut down to fit inside of the rim groove. I think that $22.50 each is a bit steep for Stan's rim strips. As for the latex sealant, I'm working on finding a replacement. But in the meantime, I'll stick with Stan's Sealant.

Alternative: Maxxis sells their own version of a tubless rim strip, allowing you to convert your non UST rims to run tubless, just like Stan's. The difference is the price. Stan's rim strips are $22.50-$25.00 (this is not including their flat shipping rate of aprox. $10.00...do the math!) Maxxis on the other hand sells their TS (Tubeless System) rim strips for $5.oo each. Yes! That's right! I said $5.00 each, and they work too! Maybe even a little better.

The Maxxis rim strip is a little different in that it completely covers the contact area where the tire would contact the rim. I've been riding on the Maxxis rim strips for two months now on an extra set of rims and they have been flawless. One area that they are superior to the Stan's Rim strips is that because they cover the edge of rim, you are much less likely to get a pinch flat from an impact. It can happen I'm sure, but the rim edge is cushioned by the new layer of material and I think also would allow the tire to slide on the rim a little. OK! I'll end this now.

Bottom Line? You can afford $5.oo x 2. Even if it's to experiment.

Oh! One last thing. I did notice that initially the rim strip seemed too wide to fit snug into the rim. I removed all vestiges of rim tape (bare rim) re-inserted the rim strips and they worked perfectly.

Cheers!

:end quote
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
if the advantage of maxxis (besides the cost) is the cushioning of the bead, a bead of silicon run on the corners of the rim should do the same thing...
 

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drunkle

sorry to keep posting on your post but i'm glad you broiught this up...turns out the maxxis tubless strips have the valve in them so they are ready to go....they cost only $5 like shiggy mentioned...

so this really is the cheaper way to go...buy maxxis strips for your rims and then buy stan;s sealant...or make a home brew on the sealant...i recommend staying away from slime...the components in slime are different that stan's which is isoprene based and beomes rubber really fast

thanks for bring this up....this is a much cheaper and possibly better way to go
 

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drunkle said:
if the advantage of maxxis (besides the cost) is the cushioning of the bead, a bead of silicon run on the corners of the rim should do the same thing...
$5 is about as low as one can go for any bicycle part...i would suggest at least buying one and trying it...if you still think you can make one, then you'll have to buy a tube for $8 and then cut it potentially ruining it in the process
 

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I do not believe Stan's is all that expensive

A significant cost of producing a product is the R&D expense. Stan's obviously puts a lot of effort, time, money into making lightweight and very functional products. I for one am very glad companies like that exist. I have dealt with Stan's several times. Very helpful and knowledgeable.
Another example of a great company in my opinion is Speedgoat.
 

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i didn't read all of the above posts but i would think duct tape would work. Also instead of slime Bontrager super juice is like around $14 a bottle i would think it would work better than slime. I'm using it instead of stans and it seems to be working.
 

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real WW idea that works

Just tape off the spoke holes, mount a standard tire (using soap suds), fill with Stan's latex and inflate (likely with a compressor).

You can use Stan's yellow tape which is good stuff or source your own Kapton tape. Kapton can be identified by it's is carmel brown color. Kapton tape is typically very thin and incredible tensile strength - it will not sag into the spoke holes after the tire is inflated like electrical tape will. Be sure to wrap the wheel 3x using kapton tape. I like the 1/4" wide tape - run 1x around each side of the rim, then 1x down the middle. Much less likely to trap air than Stan's wide yellow tape. Kapton will tear if cut, so deburring the spoke holes is also a good idea.

As far as the bead goes, there is no point in attempting to put rubber (i.e. a cut in half inner tube) between the tire bead and the rim. Eclipse kits work well and they don't affect the seal of the tire to the rim. Tubeless rims work well and they don't put rubber between the rim and the tire. Standard tires seal great to standard rims and will not blow off or burp, etc. The idea that you need a rim strip between your tire and rim is only to prevent air pressure from getting under the rim strip - tape solves that problem.

So, bottom line is the tape is $10 for at least 4 wheels and a quart of Stan's latex is about $20. Tape weight is maybe 5g per wheel and stans is about 60g.

Source for tape:
http://www.mcmaster.com/ - search for p/n 7648A721

drunkle said:
i'd like to go tubeless but refuse to shell out $80 for the stan's kit. i was thinking of trying the following:

debur the rims/spoke holes
use electrical tape or mylar tape for rim tape
use silicon glue at the corners of the rim
cut a presta 20" bmx tube in half, stretch it over the rim, seal/set in place with the glue
mount the tire, fill with half a bottle of slime and inflate

think it'll work? some unsettled questions:

overlap the half tube with the tire bead? if so, inside or outside of the bead? how much overlap, extending outside of the rim or not?
dilute the slime? use more slime? use stan's goop instead?
 

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Motivated said:
Just tape off the spoke holes, mount a standard tire (using soap suds), fill with Stan's latex and inflate (likely with a compressor).

You can use Stan's yellow tape which is good stuff or source your own Kapton tape. Kapton can be identified by it's is carmel brown color. Kapton tape is typically very thin and incredible tensile strength - it will not sag into the spoke holes after the tire is inflated like electrical tape will. Be sure to wrap the wheel 3x using kapton tape. I like the 1/4" wide tape - run 1x around each side of the rim, then 1x down the middle. Much less likely to trap air than Stan's wide yellow tape. Kapton will tear if cut, so deburring the spoke holes is also a good idea.

As far as the bead goes, there is no point in attempting to put rubber (i.e. a cut in half inner tube) between the tire bead and the rim. Eclipse kits work well and they don't affect the seal of the tire to the rim. Tubeless rims work well and they don't put rubber between the rim and the tire. Standard tires seal great to standard rims and will not blow off or burp, etc. The idea that you need a rim strip between your tire and rim is only to prevent air pressure from getting under the rim strip - tape solves that problem.

So, bottom line is the tape is $10 for at least 4 wheels and a quart of Stan's latex is about $20. Tape weight is maybe 5g per wheel and stans is about 60g.

Source for tape:
http://www.mcmaster.com/ - search for p/n 7648A721
what about the valve? how to put it in and seal it
 

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YEs

Yeah it should work, I think the hardest part is finding a presta BMX tube, they arent very common- atleast not in Australia anyways. This was a method used by quiet a few Aussie downhillers some time ago. I'd say most now use either UST or Stans...

drunkle said:
i'd like to go tubeless but refuse to shell out $80 for the stan's kit. i was thinking of trying the following:

debur the rims/spoke holes
use electrical tape or mylar tape for rim tape
use silicon glue at the corners of the rim
cut a presta 20" bmx tube in half, stretch it over the rim, seal/set in place with the glue
mount the tire, fill with half a bottle of slime and inflate

think it'll work? some unsettled questions:

overlap the half tube with the tire bead? if so, inside or outside of the bead? how much overlap, extending outside of the rim or not?
dilute the slime? use more slime? use stan's goop instead?
 

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What about weight?

Isn't part of the appeal to Stans over Maxxis and DIY tubeless (w/ a cut 20" or 24" tube) the weight? I thought that the Stans strip is significantly lighter than the other two options. Looking at the Maxxis strips, aren't they only a little bit lighter than standard tubes? I was about to get Stans, and am right now toying with a DIY setup. I was planning on getting Stans still b/c of the weight. Please let me know if I'm wrong.
 

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notenoughtime said:
Isn't part of the appeal to Stans over Maxxis and DIY tubeless (w/ a cut 20" or 24" tube) the weight? I thought that the Stans strip is significantly lighter than the other two options. Looking at the Maxxis strips, aren't they only a little bit lighter than standard tubes? I was about to get Stans, and am right now toying with a DIY setup. I was planning on getting Stans still b/c of the weight. Please let me know if I'm wrong.
do you have a maxxis strip in your hand...my stans strips basically look the same as the maxxis (looking at the internet picture)...the maxxis strips are $5...stan's is $25....if i had known this before buying stan's, of course i would have gone for the maxxis strips...
 
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