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Glad to Be Alive
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nosewheely said:
i run mavic 219 disc rims on king hubs now. i am considering to go tubeless. what's a good freeride tubeless rim-tire combination? what are the cons of tubeless?
Mavic 823's rims and Michelins, Kenda Blue grooves and Nevaegals, Highrollers and Minions are some of the choices recommended

Pros......a little lighter rolling resistence, anti-pinch flats, thorns, holes seal themselves

cons....some burpage, sidewall tears leave in trouble (you will need a tube if super glue doesn't work

overall...I love the tubeless set up...I have ran it now for 3 years
 

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08nwsula said:
I see it as a bit of a hassle, but you can save some weight.
if you know what you are doing then it is easy....and works very well....all my buds got flats and I had white dots on my tire which sealed because some idiot put thorns all over the trail...

I have not had a flat in 4 years
 

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i drink shower water
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i have ridden both tubeless and tube tires.. maybe it was the tubeless tires i had but they went low alot. i dont remember what tires they were. eventually i went back to the tubes.
 

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Old No. 7
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I went tubeless a few months ago, it was a huge hassle to get it going, but once I did it was great, no flats for quite some time. But.... when you do go flat, it's the biggest pain in the ass ever... I haven't really noticed the huge bennifits of tubeless, like lower pressure for hooking up, or higher pressure for rolling resistance, or even the weight bennifits. I've noticed a bigger difference in switching to a smaller tire to be honest, I'm debating if it's worth it again.... but that's just me, and I'm sure my experiance has been different that others.
 

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noMAD man
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Sometimes I'm convinced tubeless may actually be more successful on DH/FR bikes and wheels than on XC rigs. The DH/FR tires have much more stable carcasses that are thicker with stronger beads. I know SMT always talks about "burpage", but I think most riders who experience this are running too low a pressure and/or the wrong tire. You get excellent traction out of a tire being run tubeless without going way low on tire pressure. Why?...the carcass is able to flex, in a positive way, to maintain a good foot print and therefore a better grip without a tube "stiffening" the tire carcass. Yes, a tube stiffens a tire carcass and its ability to flex in an advantageous manner to grip terrain. This is why DH folk traditionally run such low pressures with their tubed tires...an effort to get maximum traction and tire compliance. A tubeless tire can run higher pressure and yet maintain similar traction and compliance.

Addtionally, people often "poo-poo" the rim strip system. Anyone who's run rim strips on non-UST rims should be able to confirm how the tire bead and rim strip make an almost ungodly bond when done right. In extreme cases the tire can catch a rock at just the right point and the tire and rim strip can actually pull away from the rim at that millisecond. However, since the strip and bead are bonded together by the sealant, no air pressure is lost, the tire doesn't come off the rim, and no adverse effects occur.

There are lots of variables in some of these setup that we refer to as tubeless...UST tires on UST rims, non-UST tires on UST rims, UST tires on non-UST rims, etc., etc...most of them work with excellent results when done correctly and with right tires. All tires are not equal...no surprise, right?
 

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I've been on Stan's tubeless for about 5 years. Both bikes, trail & freeride. For the big bike I ride Mavic 823's with no rim strip. I've ridden a variety of tires from Maxxis dual plys, Specialized 2bliss Enduros, currently on Schwalbe Big Bettys. The key to installing a tubeless tire is HIGH pressure air to get the bead to set. A good trick is to remove the core of the presta valve to get maximum air flow, set the bead, re-install core, re-inflate.
 

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i've used tubeless on my xc/race bike for a while and tubes on my big bike. i think the benfits are much more discernable on a light xc bike with narrower (~2.1") tires. possibly because i don't weigh very much (160) i don't have pinch flat issues with my tubed "big" tires but it definitely helps with the narrower type... just my $.02
 

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I run single tracks with stans rim strip and sealent Specialized Chunder for tires. This system works good for me, no flats and no sidewall tears. I have run in the past Dee Max with Maxxis high roller/ mobsters stans sealent that worked great also, no flats and no sidewall tears. My own 2centz, tubeless works great once set up properly. I was constantly getting pinchflats with tubes and thorns that was a nightmare. All the tire choices I have used have not been ust.

Pros...No more pinchflats
Punctures seal up such as thorns
Able to run lower pressure
Allows more grip
Less weight

Cons..Constantly have to check pressure (you should anywayz)
After a while add more sealent
Possibility of bending rim with low tire pressure
Limited tire choices
 

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Im waiting for a mavic ex823 wheelset and I have a maxxis High Roller 2,5 non ust laying around...so will it work with these rims??is it compulsory to use sealent(stan, slime, etc...)??
 

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I know SMT always talks about "burpage", but I think most riders who experience this are running too low a pressure and/or the wrong tire.
I've now run four different types of tires, both ust and non-ust, on my mavic crossmax ust rims. Every one of them has burped to some degree.
I weigh between 230 and 240 with gear, and I hit a lot of jumps and drops, pretty much whatever I can find. I always run the max psi that the tire is rated for.
I'm currently using the red michy mountain xtrem's in 2.5, tube type, and have been very pleased. They burp, but only a little, and mostly when I land wrong. These are the heaviest, most solid tire I've mounted on the ust rims yet, so maybe if I went to a true, 1000g+ downhill tire, I could eliminate burping all together, but from what I've seen so far, it's a fact of life with tubeless if you're a heavier rider who rides aggressively.
 

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noMAD man
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ban, that setup will usually work with the 2.5 and that rim, but it will require sealant. If you use Slime, make sure it's the tubeless version. I still find Stan's to do the best job, and yes I've tried Slime Tubeless and even a concoction of Stan's and Slime. The latex and corn meal(?) in the Stan'ts just seems to do the job better.
 

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noMAD man
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hardway, I noticed you mention that you always run max pressure on the tire that you're running. That red X'treme tire has a max pressure of 58 psi. I can just about guarantee that if you're running that tire that high, you're way overinflated, and I'm surprised the tire doesn't blow off the rim. I run mine at 32-34 psi on the front and 35-38 on the rear on CrossMax XLs. You can vary a good bit from that, but 58 sounds extreme.

Yeah, if you go to a true DH/FR tire at your weight, you should just about eliminate any problems.
 

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Fort Valley = Gnarl Fest
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TNC said:
Addtionally, people often "poo-poo" the rim strip system. Anyone who's run rim strips on non-UST rims should be able to confirm how the tire bead and rim strip make an almost ungodly bond when done right.
I've run the Ghetto rim strip system, a 24 or 20" tube and cut it down the center, put some stans in and seated, filled it up cut away the excess ruber from the tube and it was good to go. The system worked well. And the only reason I'm not running tubeless right now is that my brother took the Stans to college.
 

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Glad to Be Alive
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TNC said:
. I know SMT always talks about "burpage", but I think most riders who experience this are running too low a pressure and/or the wrong tire. ?
I run about 28 the lowest and upwards to 35.......burbage got me on maxxis non ust tires.....but sometimes on the Michelins if you hit off camber you will see seapage marks at bead.......

BTW...I don't see air pressure loss in my tires
 

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ban said:
Im waiting for a mavic ex823 wheelset and I have a maxxis High Roller 2,5 non ust laying around...so will it work with these rims??is it compulsory to use sealent(stan, slime, etc...)??
you can run without but I wouldn't ...it is nice when you finish a ride and look at a wet spot on your tire and realize the sealant just sealed a hole the size of a pencil
 

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Okay, TNC & SMT, cheers for the advice; I will try to get some Stans sealent but I dont know if its possible to find it here in Spain where I live and I can get slime tubeless locally...so just in case I cant find stans I will run slime...cheers again!
 

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wow, 58 psi is high, but that's talking about the pressure in the tube, right? I run both tires around 40 psi, and figured I was pushing it. I generally fill them up a few psi over 40, so if I burp a bit on a ride I still have plenty of air w/out having to stop and fill up. I'm super paranoid about low psi, having burped hard in the past with catastrophic results (not really, but the road rash took over a month to heal).
 

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I've been running a tubeless setup for a while now... 2.3 Nevaegals front and rear. I'm not sure if they make a single ply 2.5 but if they do thats a perfect tubeless am/freeride tire.

The initial setup is a pain. It took me almost 45min/wheel, but now I can do 2 wheels in about 30mins. It's actually really easy.

The positives are; you can run single ply tires and low pressure for maximum surface area and traction. This is really noticable on climbs. No more pinch flats which is most important and you save some weight if you care about that sort of thing.

The negatives; If you cut your tire you'll need to find a tube. after initial setup they leak when the bike is not being ridden, but thats not that big of a deal of you own a pump. And yes they do burp, and it will scare the hell out of you the first time, but again thats not all that bad. The main hassle is knowing you need to re-do your setup every 4months to ensure a proper seal.

good luck!
 
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