The differences in the materials and the geometry pretty well covers it. VPP vs. DW link and bearings vs. bushings may or may not be significant, and you should ride as many bikes as possible. The Tallboy is geared more towards the XC/Race spectrum, while the Sultan is what I'd call a heavy-duty trail bike, but there's certainly some overlap (I own a Sultan, never ridden the Tallboy).
Sultan vs Tallboy
I've heard many great things about Turners and I was in the market for a 29er. I was trying to decide between a Tallboy and Sultan. I'm 175 lbs, 5'9" mostly XC.
Other than carbon and geometry, what are the noteworthy differences to an average (non-racing) rider?
Any input appreciated.
Other than carbon and geometry, what are the noteworthy differences to an average (non-racing) rider?
Any input appreciated.
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
For me
i think the ETT of the tall boy is too short requiring a longer stem while the longer ETT of the sultan is perfect with a short stem and low riser. Im 5'8.5"s
i think the ETT of the tall boy is too short requiring a longer stem while the longer ETT of the sultan is perfect with a short stem and low riser. Im 5'8.5"s
other than Silentfoe, I would be surprised if any DW Sultan rider would have any interest in a Tallboy given the inherent differences - explains the low reponse count
Never get an objective response
This is the land of the homers! I would be a touch worried about the life span of the bearings on a Santa Cruz. See, I'm a touch of a homer to and like Turner bushings. The grease injector may help them live a little longer. I have ridden a Blur and thought it rode great. It climbed like a billy goat.
This is the land of the homers! I would be a touch worried about the life span of the bearings on a Santa Cruz. See, I'm a touch of a homer to and like Turner bushings. The grease injector may help them live a little longer. I have ridden a Blur and thought it rode great. It climbed like a billy goat.
Why are you posting?Jaybo said:This is the land of the homers! I would be a touch worried about the life span of the bearings on a Santa Cruz. See, I'm a touch of a homer to and like Turner bushings. The grease injector may help them live a little longer. I have ridden a Blur and thought it rode great. It climbed like a billy goat.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=574568
True, my Sultan more closely resembles the implied purpose of a Tallboy than any other. However, I'll take DW over VPP, aluminum over carbon, bushings over bearings and Turner customer service over Santa Cruz's. 'Nuff said.FoShizzle said:other than Silentfoe, I would be surprised if any DW Sultan rider would have any interest in a Tallboy given the inherent differences - explains the low reponse count
My Sultan is solid, rides better and is as light as a Tallboy.
Nuff said, but you can say that again. Hadn't see your XL DWL Sultan at 27 lbs.Silentfoe said:True, my Sultan more closely resembles the implied purpose of a Tallboy than any other. However, I'll take DW over VPP, aluminum over carbon, bushings over bearings and Turner customer service over Santa Cruz's. 'Nuff said.
My Sultan is solid, rides better and is as light as a Tallboy.
Jaybo123, surprised you posted at all, not just because you already cancelled your empty beer account, but because you can't afford the Tallboy either.
FWIW, I do the same thing with Porsches and Gulfstreams. Can't buy em so they gotta suck.
Jaybo preferable to LittleOgre123. I like some of the things about a Tallboy but have a distinct preference for the DWL. I don't hear that the Tallboy is blazing fast or anything so what's the benefit? Now, if it was a really fast climber, I'd be interested. As it stands, it is just okay so I'll take the descending capabilities and solid ride of the Sultan, along with the more durable Sultan. Not really knocking the Tallboy but it doesn't offer me any advantages.
Jello Sundae said:
Sultan Tallboy Economics
Thank you for your cooperative input. I knew I came to the right place for advice.
Another issue is I'm looking at the economics between the two frames, in terms of weight and cost. For frames, Sultan runs about $45 higher (2395-2350) and weighs about 885 grams (almost 2 lbs) more (Med 3155-2270) than the Tallboy. Let's say I shoot for the same target weight in a complete build. The Sultan is already at a nominal cost and large weight disadvantage.
I do like the idea of a lightweight DW Sultan. Stable and durable ride plus all of the other benefits mentioned. It would be the best of all worlds. And of course, Turner customer service is legendary; icing on the cake.
But the whole package seems pricey. I know you get what you pay for, but this 'new economy' has changed things.
Any thoughts?
Thank you for your cooperative input. I knew I came to the right place for advice.
Another issue is I'm looking at the economics between the two frames, in terms of weight and cost. For frames, Sultan runs about $45 higher (2395-2350) and weighs about 885 grams (almost 2 lbs) more (Med 3155-2270) than the Tallboy. Let's say I shoot for the same target weight in a complete build. The Sultan is already at a nominal cost and large weight disadvantage.
I do like the idea of a lightweight DW Sultan. Stable and durable ride plus all of the other benefits mentioned. It would be the best of all worlds. And of course, Turner customer service is legendary; icing on the cake.
But the whole package seems pricey. I know you get what you pay for, but this 'new economy' has changed things.
Any thoughts?
The weight is an issue in two situations- racing XC and extended climbing. A 2 lb difference will make a difference over hours. On flatter terrain and fast trail riding and as long as you're not climbing thousands and thousands of feet each ride, it will not. The suspension efficiency and frame stiffness are more important. Only you can decide, depending on where/how you ride and how competitive your riding buddies are.
I do consider weight and if Turner made a light carbon bike, I'd buy it. However, I would not buy the Tallboy and probably not the SF100 either. I would buy a carbon Turner and probably a carbon FS Niner as well. For now, I'm quite happy with my Sultan and Racer-X 29er. However, if the Racer-X had more than 3" of suspension, I'd not enjoy it as much. It would sag a bit too much on steep climbs and lighten up the front while the Sultan is more planted and can climb and climb over everything. At 3", the Racer-X is just fine though if a 4" Turner or Niner (second choice) comes out, it will be at risk.
I do consider weight and if Turner made a light carbon bike, I'd buy it. However, I would not buy the Tallboy and probably not the SF100 either. I would buy a carbon Turner and probably a carbon FS Niner as well. For now, I'm quite happy with my Sultan and Racer-X 29er. However, if the Racer-X had more than 3" of suspension, I'd not enjoy it as much. It would sag a bit too much on steep climbs and lighten up the front while the Sultan is more planted and can climb and climb over everything. At 3", the Racer-X is just fine though if a 4" Turner or Niner (second choice) comes out, it will be at risk.
Flyer, you aren't even close to the only guy wishing for a 4-inch carbon fiber Turner 29er. Maybe if DT would quit screwing around up at Mammoth and finish the DHR and RFX, we could get his attention!
OP, I've got a Sultan and a very light CF 4-inch race bike. One thing that I think is overlooked by almost everybody is that while a couple of pounds heavier is certainly felt going up, it helps make the bike feel smoother and more planted on the way down, too. Just have to pick your priorities, I guess.
I've never had an mtb that did a better job of combining climbing ability with downhill ripping than the Sultan.
OP, I've got a Sultan and a very light CF 4-inch race bike. One thing that I think is overlooked by almost everybody is that while a couple of pounds heavier is certainly felt going up, it helps make the bike feel smoother and more planted on the way down, too. Just have to pick your priorities, I guess.
I've never had an mtb that did a better job of combining climbing ability with downhill ripping than the Sultan.
Yeah, but you're old, drive a Tahoe, and ride Manny-Poo forks, so why would any hipster listen to you?cutthroat said:Turner already makes a 4" travel 29er that's a pound lighter than the DW Sultan - it's called a 2008 TNT.Rides great, less filling. 28lbs ready to rip.
Seriously, I hear you about the V.1 Sultan being a great bike, but I've come to love the attributes of the DW link compared to the single pivot.
Yeah, that's it. It has to be the DWL and to get the other benefits of stiffness and light weight, it has to be carbon. A 5 lb, 4" FS 29er, that is as stiff as the SF100 but has better geo and the DWL. Dayyumm!!
I did a little bit of both and found a great deal on a Mach 429. The handling really reminds me of my old TNT Sultan, and it pedals like a DW Link. Win-win.kosmo said:Yeah, but you're old, drive a Tahoe, and ride Manny-Poo forks, so why would any hipster listen to you?
Seriously, I hear you about the V.1 Sultan being a great bike, but I've come to love the attributes of the DW link compared to the single pivot.
I get what you're saying, but to me that would also mean people are more interested in long term value, and less so in the latest whiz bang gadgetry that could meet a premature death before it saw its second season (or second ride for that matter).glance2 said:I know you get what you pay for, but this 'new economy' has changed things.
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
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