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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey folks,

I apologize in advance since the topic, even to me, seems like I should be able to research with the Search function. But I've come up rather short.

It sounded like the Prophet vs the Heckler may have been a better comparison. But I'm doing my research on a new AM bike. For some reason, I like the simplicity of a single pivot. And while the Blur and the Rize appear to be a virtual pivot, they are about a grand more.

These two bikes appear to strike the closest balance to having great handling, very good climbing, in a relatively light package.

The Lefty fork intrigues me, but not so much the potential maintenance/replacement of them. But I'm hearing great things about their performance.

Only one LBS has a Heckler available for a test ride in the parking lot. Can you really tell a lot about a bike in the parking lot?

Right now I'm just working on hitting the trails with my old HT. Get my skills and fitness back. And work towards a new FS purchase in the spring.

My local trails are mostly technical single track. Lots of roots for sure. Some rock gardens. 1-2' drops in places. I'm hitting these with my HT. Would just like a little "softer" bike to hit that faster as well as go on longer rides without being so intensely focussed that it wears me out quickly. Would like to try some epic rides in the mountains.
 

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One of my riding buddies has a Rush and its a pretty nice bike. I think its a little flexy, but I am also 195lbs and out weight my buddy by 25 to 30lbs. Personally I would go with the Heckler. Beefier frame, but still pretty light and you never hear anyone say anything bad about them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I'm 5'-7" and 165#s.

The reason I ask is that it looks like my local LBS has an '08 model Rush4 with a left fork for a good price.

Also, a different LBS has an '08 Heckler for sale price as well. Both in Medium which should be my size.

Not to mention that Competitive Cycle has a great price on the Heckler RAM for an '09? If I go with an '09 'Dale, then I have to look at a Rush 3 Carbon or Rize 3 for a lefty fork.
 

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The Medium Rush seems to be much longer than the Medium Heckler.
Forget about sizing labels. Even a parking lot test should give you some idea about fit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Right. I can see how at least the fit is something I can determine in the parking lot.

With the bunch of riding I've been doing, I'm finding that I need to make some adjustments even on my HT. So even though I like to ride tiny frames, I may have to rethink that for the new bike.
 

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I bought my '08 Rush 5 this fall. I was upgrading from my 10yr old hardtail, so I probably would have loved any new bike, so my opinion might not mean as much. However, I love my Rush. It is very comfortable for long, bumpy rides, it handles when descending, and it has no more pedal bob than my hardtail with 2.3" tires. I'm 210#, and It seems solid enough for me.
 

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If you can swing the Rize 3 do it, you will not be disappointed. The new rising rate setup is the real deal. A real bottomless feel to it and very plush. The Rize climbs extremely well and a very stiff bike and I can not say enough good things about the lefty pbr 130. The only downside to the lefty is resetting the bearings once and a while but it's so easy and fast it's a no issue but that's why they are so buttery smooth.
 

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traffic002, I'm actually in a similar boat as you - only one step further (i think). I picked up an '08 Rush 4 a couple of months ago because the deal was too good to pass up. It too is my first FS bike. Unfortunately by the time I got the bike, the trails were already covered in snow and it's tough to compare a snowy-trail ride on a new bike to how the trail felt on my hardtail a few months back.

So far so good though, the bike climbs very well - naturally way softer on descents than my old hardtail. I'm not 100% convinced though that this is the bike for me - I ride in Southern Ontario and prefer the technical stuff to the ultra-long climbs/straights (where I've heard the Rush excels)...I wouldn't categorize trails around here "all mountain" at all, but am wondering whether a prophet would be a more "fun" bike...
 

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Your right,
the Rush and Heckler are really two differant bikes.
The Heckler will be better in technical terrain and down-hill but certainly won't climb nearly as efficient as the Rush.
Most of my rides are 6-8 hr rides that can exceed 30+ miles of steep climbs,narrow fast single track and technical fire roads and a few 24hr races,just a few reasons i feel i hit
holy grail when i decided on a Carbon Rush but i can only speak for myself.

Part of your post has me thinking Rush "epic rides" and another has me thinking Heckler "technical with 1-2ft drops",just the info you were looking for.;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
jiar577 said:
If you're doing 1-2ft drops get the Rush, if you plan to do 4-5ft drops get the Heckler. I'd get the Rush just because the Heckler could be too much if you're replacing a hardtail.
Well, the FS bike would be in addition to my hardtail rather than a straight replacement.

I'm taking 1-2' drops with my hardtail now. So I agree that I probably don't NEED a Heckler. In fact, my coworker that races and has a Heckler thinks it may be a bit leggy for me and suggested the Superlight. He's pretty fit, so doesn't mind lugging the extra weight around.
 

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The Rush wins hands down over the SL IMO, they're not in the same league quality wise. Just look at the paint, welds and overall finish on both frames and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

I'd assume the SL is flexier too, but I'm not 100% sure on this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
jiar577 said:
The Rush wins hands down over the SL IMO, they're not in the same league quality wise. Just look at the paint, welds and overall finish on both frames and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

I'd assume the SL is flexier too, but I'm not 100% sure on this.
Hm, I figured the Superlight is a 4" single pivot with aggressive XC geometry. Rush has similar stats. Both have nice finishes. Paint vs anodize. Both have nice welds.

What am I missing?

I would think these two bikes are the MOST similar.
 

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traffic002 said:
Hm, I figured the Superlight is a 4" single pivot with aggressive XC geometry. Rush has similar stats. Both have nice finishes. Paint vs anodize. Both have nice welds.

What am I missing?

The Lefty my friend.

Ok...assuming your not a clydesdale i don't see how you'd suffer any on a Superlight,an efficient single pivot designed bike thats been proven over time and very popular.
After months of research and demo's i actually was down to two bikes and the Superlight was one of them but after riding both i found that i liked the stiffer front and over-all handling of the Rush "enhanced by Lefty".
If your considering a lower end Rush without the Lefty then you won't feel a differance in the front end.
Demo both and see which one feels right.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Bird said:
The Lefty my friend.

Ok...assuming your not a clydesdale i don't see how you'd suffer any on a Superlight,an efficient single pivot designed bike thats been proven over time and very popular.
After months of research and demo's i actually was down to two bikes and the Superlight was one of them but after riding both i found that i liked the stiffer front and over-all handling of the Rush "enhanced by Lefty".
If your considering a lower end Rush without the Lefty then you won't feel a differance in the front end.
Demo both and see which one feels right.
Yes. There is an '08 Rush4 with a lefty at one LBS near my house. To get an '09 lefty, I have fork over almost double the amount since it's a Carbon.

Comparing '09 SL to '09 Rush, the equivalent priced Rush comes with a standard Fox fork.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well, I don't doubt the Fox forks. But at that point, the dividing lines between the SL and Rush gets more blurred.

I'll just keep tabs on the '08 Rush at the LBS. Maybe I can put it on lay-away. :p
 

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The Rush geometry is a little more "aggresive XC" with a head tube angle of 69 deg versus I believe 71 for the Superlight. Plus just a tad more suspension travel, 4 versus 4.7.

For the same money you get a better spec with the Rush also. Just my .02, good luck.

Although, I think the Superlight is a very nice bike also. I bought my Rush instead of the SL because for the money I could get a Fox fork.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Looks like the '09 Rush goes from Rush 3 Carbon to Rush 6. But it does come with a Fox fork. SLX front deraileur and x7 rear. Avid Juicy 3 brakes. So other than the low level brakes, the rest of the specs don't look bad. Certainly as high a component as can be found on any $1500-1800 bike.

The Superlight D has slightly lower components especially forks. And the R is a bit higher priced but has better brakes.
 

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traffic002 said:
Hm, I figured the Superlight is a 4" single pivot with aggressive XC geometry. Rush has similar stats. Both have nice finishes. Paint vs anodize. Both have nice welds.

What am I missing?

I would think these two bikes are the MOST similar.
My friend, if you can't see the difference in quality between this frames...

You're right, this bikes are more similar between them than Rush VS Heckler.

The SL is more XC oriented as it has a steeper head angle, shorter wheelbase and lower bb height. The Rush has a little more relaxed geometry and should be more stable due to the longer wheelbase, and has more travel too.

I highly recomend a Lefty fork with a Rush, the other forks feel flexy as hell once you ride one.
 
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