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I got a new rear triangle and it came with all bushings installed. Everything installed with light resistance and rotate very smoothly so no "clearancing" was needed. Just removed the stock lube and used Bel Ray waterproof grease. For some reason, the stock lower link bushings in my rear triangle were mangled. They literally looked like someone took a wood file to them. I'm waiting to see what Ibis says about that after they get the triangle back. I haven't been able to look at the lower link front bushings yet as I can't get my crankset off until I get the removal cap for my Sram cranks. It didn't come with one for some reason. My stock upper link bushings were in great shape still.
Just be patient and once you’ve taken the pedal off the drive side tap the inside and outside of the crank arm alternatively with a nylon faced dead blow hammer and it will come off. My AF didn’t have the cap either and that’s how I had to remove the crank to service the BB every time. It’s not ideal but it works. My V2 came with the cap, which I would expect, and it makes life a lot easier but that bolt is still bloody tough to undo. I do mine up to 45nm instead of 55nm and it’s still a ***** to remove.
 

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Got caught up on the thread and wanted to follow up with a couple of you who helped me with ideas when I was on a trip riding last week…

@sfr4dr. You nailed it. The sound I thought was coming from my Diamond was actually coming from the front brake pads I recently put in my Dominions.

@TanMan Do you ride in “Trail/Med” setting on the prorate spring? I rode the stock spring in “Open” almost all the time, but when I put the Prorate into Trail/Med, it seemed to really cut down on the low speed Bob’s/bouncing sensation.

@kamper11 I saw you talked to DVO; I asked them the same thing a while back and basically full travel (55) is then you completely bottom out the shock and it totally flattens the bumper. I was wondering the same thing….

I think the best way to measure sag on the Jade X is measure the eye to eye distance when you’re sitting on the bike, then divide it by the uncompressed eye to eye length and then subtract that by 100.

I agree though, a logo with marks would be so much easier! My wife would also agree since I usually have to get her out in the garage because it’s sure hard to measure the shock length while sitting on the bike at the same time!


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Got caught up on the thread and wanted to follow up with a couple of you who helped me with ideas when I was on a trip riding last week…

@sfr4dr. You nailed it. The sound I thought was coming from my Diamond was actually coming from the front brake pads I recently put in my Dominions.

@TanMan Do you ride in “Trail/Med” setting on the prorate spring? I rode the stock spring in “Open” almost all the time, but when I put the Prorate into Trail/Med, it seemed to really cut down on the low speed Bob’s/bouncing sensation.

@kamper11 I saw you talked to DVO; I asked them the same thing a while back and basically full travel (55) is then you completely bottom out the shock and it totally flattens the bumper. I was wondering the same thing….

I think the best way to measure sag on the Jade X is measure the eye to eye distance when you’re sitting on the bike, then divide it by the uncompressed eye to eye length and then subtract that by 100.

I agree though, a logo with marks would be so much easier! My wife would also agree since I usually have to get her out in the garage because it’s sure hard to measure the shock length while sitting on the bike at the same time!


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Same. JadeX in open setting most of the time unless climbing long boring climbs. Or when I take it out to the canal path with the wifey like this morning .


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Two of them press in from the outside of the rocker link and and two of them need to installed from the inside of the rocker link. The outside ones are dead easy. The first inside one isn’t too bad but still a bit fiddly due to the rocker link not being dead flat it’s a bit curved but you can install it by driving it in through the hole where the last bearing goes but once it’s in you only have the very small hole through the inner race of the third bearing to work through and you are left without much choice but to drive the last bearing in by tapping on the inner race. This makes the brand new bearing feel a little rough after it’s installed. It still works fine but isn’t as smooth as the others due to the loads you’ve just put through the inner race. There’s very little room width ways to get any sort of clamp or press in there to press it in.
i have not done it myself but just had a thought while reading your process could you not just get a piece of threaded rod and have two nuts with washers inside the link wind them to then act as a press ? once done obviously just unwind it all, the process is working in my head...:rolleyes: I personally never got round to changing my average link bearings in my stock link as i thought of maybe going cascade link which i have just gone for so two birds one stone....
 

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I got a new rear triangle and it came with all bushings installed. Everything installed with light resistance and rotate very smoothly so no "clearancing" was needed. Just removed the stock lube and used Bel Ray waterproof grease. For some reason, the stock lower link bushings in my rear triangle were mangled. They literally looked like someone took a wood file to them. I'm waiting to see what Ibis says about that after they get the triangle back. I haven't been able to look at the lower link front bushings yet as I can't get my crankset off until I get the removal cap for my Sram cranks. It didn't come with one for some reason. My stock upper link bushings were in great shape still.
I must have missed....why the new triangle? How did you remove the stock lube? Remove bearing seals and clean? Why Bel Ray?....What grease is in the factory ones?.....I'm guessing it's waterproof too?

My sram crank removal cap fell out....twice....ordered a new one. Ozibis has a unique way of crank removal without. I would have never thought of that. I just ordered the Sram bottom bracket tool. Last piece to remove. All the bearing/bushings I have removed looked pretty good so far.....maybe I didn't need to order new headset and bb bearings.

I did find my shifter cable had a few broken wires....need to replace that. My new dropper cable has a pinch/tear where it makes the vertical corner into the seat tube...super annoyed. I also should not have trimmed my rear brake line so short....not sure if I have enough length after cutting it for removal......first time experiences!!!
 

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Got caught up on the thread and wanted to follow up with a couple of you who helped me with ideas when I was on a trip riding last week…

@sfr4dr. You nailed it. The sound I thought was coming from my Diamond was actually coming from the front brake pads I recently put in my Dominions.

@TanMan Do you ride in “Trail/Med” setting on the prorate spring? I rode the stock spring in “Open” almost all the time, but when I put the Prorate into Trail/Med, it seemed to really cut down on the low speed Bob’s/bouncing sensation.

@kamper11 I saw you talked to DVO; I asked them the same thing a while back and basically full travel (55) is then you completely bottom out the shock and it totally flattens the bumper. I was wondering the same thing….

I think the best way to measure sag on the Jade X is measure the eye to eye distance when you’re sitting on the bike, then divide it by the uncompressed eye to eye length and then subtract that by 100.

I agree though, a logo with marks would be so much easier! My wife would also agree since I usually have to get her out in the garage because it’s sure hard to measure the shock length while sitting on the bike at the same time!


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RE sag measure on the jade x. I found a perfectly sized, velcro cable wrap that came w a nest cam (for the lil guys room). It allows me to wrap around the stanchion and measure more accurately than eyeball, or any other way... I never tried the wife as a resource, as she could care less about my bike (but she does know how important riding is thankfully) and it would take me 10x longer to explain what Im trying to accomplish :). The little wrap is non abrasive and easy to both put on and remove once im setup. Bike is dialed now as a result!
 

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Got caught up on the thread and wanted to follow up with a couple of you who helped me with ideas when I was on a trip riding last week…

@sfr4dr. You nailed it. The sound I thought was coming from my Diamond was actually coming from the front brake pads I recently put in my Dominions.

@TanMan Do you ride in “Trail/Med” setting on the prorate spring? I rode the stock spring in “Open” almost all the time, but when I put the Prorate into Trail/Med, it seemed to really cut down on the low speed Bob’s/bouncing sensation.

@kamper11 I saw you talked to DVO; I asked them the same thing a while back and basically full travel (55) is then you completely bottom out the shock and it totally flattens the bumper. I was wondering the same thing….

I think the best way to measure sag on the Jade X is measure the eye to eye distance when you’re sitting on the bike, then divide it by the uncompressed eye to eye length and then subtract that by 100.

I agree though, a logo with marks would be so much easier! My wife would also agree since I usually have to get her out in the garage because it’s sure hard to measure the shock length while sitting on the bike at the same time!


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Love getting the wife to measure sag! Haha. She always rolls her eyes so hard.

Glad the brake pads were causing the noise and not the fork. I always check there first when I think my fork is making noise. I recently put a Lyrik on my AF and had the noise again and then realized it was the brake pads. I just swapped them with another bike's rear pads and it's fixed. I had metallic pads on there and swapped to the resin ones, both finned and it's good now. There's some small difference in tolerances that does it, at least with Shimanos.
 

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I must have missed....why the new triangle? How did you remove the stock lube? Remove bearing seals and clean? Why Bel Ray?....What grease is in the factory ones?.....I'm guessing it's waterproof too?

My sram crank removal cap fell out....twice....ordered a new one. Ozibis has a unique way of crank removal without. I would have never thought of that. I just ordered the Sram bottom bracket tool. Last piece to remove. All the bearing/bushings I have removed looked pretty good so far.....maybe I didn't need to order new headset and bb bearings.

I did find my shifter cable had a few broken wires....need to replace that. My new dropper cable has a pinch/tear where it makes the vertical corner into the seat tube...super annoyed. I also should not have trimmed my rear brake line so short....not sure if I have enough length after cutting it for removal......first time experiences!!!
I did an air can service on my Topaz and while it was off I cycled the suspension to see if it was smooth and it was not great. It had a "catch" in it's motion and had more resistance that I liked. I decided to pull it all apart to inspect, clean and lube and when I removed the upper link, one of the bolts came out partially stripped. Mind you, this was the first time it had been removed since new. The threaded insert in the triangle was damaged during factory install. Ibis was great and sent me a replacement. Per Ibis's direction, I tried to clean up the threads first but the thread chaser I bought (less extreme than a tap) wouldn't even get started (a lot of resistance) so I decided to not force it and just send the triangle back. In the end, the threads would have been weakened substantially and not what I paid for with a "new" frame. Again, hats off to Ibis for great prompt warranty service. Personally, I will probably service the bushings once a year or so but won't remove the upper link unless needed. Those M10x1.0 threads are delicate. It's a bummer they didn't use a more coarse thread pitch there.

As for removing the stock lube, I just wiped it out, nothing crazy. I believe the stock stuff they use is thinner, more like Slickoleum. I used Bel Ray waterproof as it's a medium thickness waterproof grease that's been a standby in the moto industry and with me for decades. The new triangle I received had a new upper link installed so I didn't mess with the old one and it's bearings. Now that I have a spare though, it'd be nice to have new bearings installed so I have a fresh one ready to go.

Regarding clearancing, I think it's a good idea to always check the fitment of each bike's bushings. Like OZ keeps saying, why chase down a plush rear suspension, messing with the shock over and over without first ensuring the action of the linkages are smooth. At a minimum, I'd recommend everyone remove the shock and cycle the suspension on a new bike to see how it feels then proceed from there if needed. OZ recommends cross hatching the bushings and it's probably a good idea but I don't know the longer term effect of that on a micro scale. Creating very small micro ridges, reduces the amount of surface to surface contact area of the two parts. It probably does hold lube better, making the bushings operate smoother for longer but might increase wear very slightly. Since bushings are cheap and warrantied for life, I wouldn't worry about it either way. Run them smooth or cross hatch them and see how it goes. There's no big risk either way. The wear surface is actually pretty large so I doubt the joint will develop noticeable play very easily. I'm guessing OZ recommended this originally as it might be a standard tuning method in moto forks but he'll probably chime in on that. I did it once when I first removed my rear triangle and then only rode it a few times while the new part was being sent to me so I don't have enough experience to know how it holds up long term. I didn't do it on my new bushings but might next time I pull it apart.
 

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Sfr4dr
Thanks for the info. I can’t believe they sent an upper link pre installed.. cool. This is the first time going into my bike… I am really happy with how everything seems to be wearing/installed. Not sure who gets that credit… the bike store I bought it at claims to personally tear down every bike they get and build back themselves. Bolts never loose or parts stiff/binding.
 

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I did an air can service on my Topaz and while it was off I cycled the suspension to see if it was smooth and it was not great. It had a "catch" in it's motion and had more resistance that I liked. I decided to pull it all apart to inspect, clean and lube and when I removed the upper link, one of the bolts came out partially stripped. Mind you, this was the first time it had been removed since new. The threaded insert in the triangle was damaged during factory install. Ibis was great and sent me a replacement. Per Ibis's direction, I tried to clean up the threads first but the thread chaser I bought (less extreme than a tap) wouldn't even get started (a lot of resistance) so I decided to not force it and just send the triangle back. In the end, the threads would have been weakened substantially and not what I paid for with a "new" frame. Again, hats off to Ibis for great prompt warranty service. Personally, I will probably service the bushings once a year or so but won't remove the upper link unless needed. Those M10x1.0 threads are delicate. It's a bummer they didn't use a more coarse thread pitch there.

As for removing the stock lube, I just wiped it out, nothing crazy. I believe the stock stuff they use is thinner, more like Slickoleum. I used Bel Ray waterproof as it's a medium thickness waterproof grease that's been a standby in the moto industry and with me for decades. The new triangle I received had a new upper link installed so I didn't mess with the old one and it's bearings. Now that I have a spare though, it'd be nice to have new bearings installed so I have a fresh one ready to go.

Regarding clearancing, I think it's a good idea to always check the fitment of each bike's bushings. Like OZ keeps saying, why chase down a plush rear suspension, messing with the shock over and over without first ensuring the action of the linkages are smooth. At a minimum, I'd recommend everyone remove the shock and cycle the suspension on a new bike to see how it feels then proceed from there if needed. OZ recommends cross hatching the bushings and it's probably a good idea but I don't know the longer term effect of that on a micro scale. Creating very small micro ridges, reduces the amount of surface to surface contact area of the two parts. It probably does hold lube better, making the bushings operate smoother for longer but might increase wear very slightly. Since bushings are cheap and warrantied for life, I wouldn't worry about it either way. Run them smooth or cross hatch them and see how it goes. There's no big risk either way. The wear surface is actually pretty large so I doubt the joint will develop noticeable play very easily. I'm guessing OZ recommended this originally as it might be a standard tuning method in moto forks but he'll probably chime in on that. I did it once when I first removed my rear triangle and then only rode it a few times while the new part was being sent to me so I don't have enough experience to know how it holds up long term. I didn't do it on my new bushings but might next time I pull it apart.
It’s not actually a crossover from when I do my Moto suspension as the bushes in most of those are anodised or at least should be.
The way I see it is that Igus bushes are dirt cheap a rear shock isn’t. Also even if the bushes were to wear after I’ve clearanced them I wouldn’t go to Ibis and claim the lifetime warrantee. I’ve stuffed with them so I take responsibility. I’m sure they would probably agree though that the linkages were never designed or intended to run as tight as some of them are.
As far as the longevity goes I haven’t had any issues to date developing play and doubt I will. The crosshatch that you are putting into the bush is extremely fine using 320 grit. Also I always try to emphasise that you create a crosshatch not straight scratches. In my mind there is a greater chance of developing play in the bushes over time if the scratches are running parallel to the sleeve or bottom link because they are perpendicular to the direction of the load instead of spiralling around which spreads the load over dozens of “high” points instead of putting more load over just a few. I hope that makes sense. Also I believe the better lube retention in the bush will give the bush an inherently longer life span than a bush that pretty much scrapes all the lube of the components during installation. Just out of interest next time you service your linkages put them back together then pull them out straight away and have a look at how much lube is still actually still in there. It’s two parts of nothing.
Anyway if someone doesn’t feel comfortable about doing the clearances on their linkages then they don’t have to do it. I think longevity is not even an issue and there is many other parts that will wear long before the bushes will. Fair chance the shock shaft will be one of them. The bushes are probably pretty close to the cheapest component on the whole bike why would you risk a very expensive rear shock and on top of that get a far superior ride quality for a $2 part. That’s just my view point others may see it another way and that’s fine it’s their bike.
 

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It’s not actually a crossover from when I do my Moto suspension as the bushes in most of those are anodised or at least should be.
The way I see it is that Igus bushes are dirt cheap a rear shock isn’t. Also even if the bushes were to wear after I’ve clearanced them I wouldn’t go to Ibis and claim the lifetime warrantee. I’ve stuffed with them so I take responsibility. I’m sure they would probably agree though that the linkages were never designed or intended to run as tight as some of them are.
As far as the longevity goes I haven’t had any issues to date developing play and doubt I will. The crosshatch that you are putting into the bush is extremely fine using 320 grit. Also I always try to emphasise that you create a crosshatch not straight scratches. In my mind there is a greater chance of developing play in the bushes over time if the scratches are running parallel to the sleeve or bottom link because they are perpendicular to the direction of the load instead of spiralling around which spreads the load over dozens of “high” points instead of putting more load over just a few. I hope that makes sense. Also I believe the better lube retention in the bush will give the bush an inherently longer life span than a bush that pretty much scrapes all the lube of the components during installation. Just out of interest next time you service your linkages put them back together then pull them out straight away and have a look at how much lube is still actually still in there. It’s two parts of nothing.
Anyway if someone doesn’t feel comfortable about doing the clearances on their linkages then they don’t have to do it. I think longevity is not even an issue and there is many other parts that will wear long before the bushes will. Fair chance the shock shaft will be one of them. The bushes are probably pretty close to the cheapest component on the whole bike why would you risk a very expensive rear shock and on top of that get a far superior ride quality for a $2 part. That’s just my view point others may see it another way and that’s fine it’s their bike.
I love Ibis bikes but the fact that we even have to resort to this procedure is pretty ridiculous. I get that no bike is perfect but a complete rear end tear down before you even ride the bike is a big miss on Ibis’ part.

To be fair, this issue is more apparent on the V2 than the AF. However, you don’t know what you are missing until you have a third generation Mojo side by side for comparison. The HD3 had bearings in ALL the pivots. The pivot action on my HD3 is night and day compared to my V2. The rear triangle on the HD3 (when the shock is removed) falls under its own weight when you lift it up and is buttery smooth throughout the action… Do the same on the V2 frame before the ‘clearance’ procedure and you’ll wonder why the frame cost as much as it does when the quality of pivot action is obviously worse.

I get that bearings in the clevis and lower pivots see less rotational speed (or at least that’s what Ibis stated when they switched to Igus bushings) and therefore can cause uneven wear in these bearings but I don’t see that as a reason for completely doing away with them.

Santa Cruz, for example, built in zerk fittings into their frame so owners can pump in fresh grease to keep bearings well greased, even for the pivots that see less rotational speeds. (Been awhile since I owned a Santa Cruz, do they still do that?)

Rant over. Back to your regular programming.


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Took us “yanks” a bit to overcome our pc sensitivities to realize you’ve been toying with us for the better part of a year…. That and I typically have no filter so thought I’d put it out there …. You know. It. Out. For those who don’t get the reference. Seinfeld
 

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It’s not actually a crossover from when I do my Moto suspension as the bushes in most of those are anodised or at least should be.
The way I see it is that Igus bushes are dirt cheap a rear shock isn’t. Also even if the bushes were to wear after I’ve clearanced them I wouldn’t go to Ibis and claim the lifetime warrantee. I’ve stuffed with them so I take responsibility. I’m sure they would probably agree though that the linkages were never designed or intended to run as tight as some of them are.
As far as the longevity goes I haven’t had any issues to date developing play and doubt I will. The crosshatch that you are putting into the bush is extremely fine using 320 grit. Also I always try to emphasise that you create a crosshatch not straight scratches. In my mind there is a greater chance of developing play in the bushes over time if the scratches are running parallel to the sleeve or bottom link because they are perpendicular to the direction of the load instead of spiralling around which spreads the load over dozens of “high” points instead of putting more load over just a few. I hope that makes sense. Also I believe the better lube retention in the bush will give the bush an inherently longer life span than a bush that pretty much scrapes all the lube of the components during installation. Just out of interest next time you service your linkages put them back together then pull them out straight away and have a look at how much lube is still actually still in there. It’s two parts of nothing.
Anyway if someone doesn’t feel comfortable about doing the clearances on their linkages then they don’t have to do it. I think longevity is not even an issue and there is many other parts that will wear long before the bushes will. Fair chance the shock shaft will be one of them. The bushes are probably pretty close to the cheapest component on the whole bike why would you risk a very expensive rear shock and on top of that get a far superior ride quality for a $2 part. That’s just my view point others may see it another way and that’s fine it’s their bike.
For sure. There's no harm in testing it out as you say. The parts are cheap. I can for sure tell that my bike rides WAY smoother when the shock has a fresh air can service and all pivots are confirmed to be running smoothly. Worth the time for anyone with an Ibis, at least on an annual basis, maybe more if you're one that likes to tinker.
 

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i have not done it myself but just had a thought while reading your process could you not just get a piece of threaded rod and have two nuts with washers inside the link wind them to then act as a press ? once done obviously just unwind it all, the process is working in my head...:rolleyes: I personally never got round to changing my average link bearings in my stock link as i thought of maybe going cascade link which i have just gone for so two birds one stone....
theory proven
3/8 all thread with a 3/8 drive 13 mm craftsman 12point socket



1939675
 

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I love Ibis bikes but the fact that we even have to resort to this procedure is pretty ridiculous. I get that no bike is perfect but a complete rear end tear down before you even ride the bike is a big miss on Ibis’ part.

To be fair, this issue is more apparent on the V2 than the AF. However, you don’t know what you are missing until you have a third generation Mojo side by side for comparison. The HD3 had bearings in ALL the pivots. The pivot action on my HD3 is night and day compared to my V2. The rear triangle on the HD3 (when the shock is removed) falls under its own weight when you lift it up and is buttery smooth throughout the action… Do the same on the V2 frame before the ‘clearance’ procedure and you’ll wonder why the frame cost as much as it does when the quality of pivot action is obviously worse.

I get that bearings in the clevis and lower pivots see less rotational speed (or at least that’s what Ibis stated when they switched to Igus bushings) and therefore can cause uneven wear in these bearings but I don’t see that as a reason for completely doing away with them.

Santa Cruz, for example, built in zerk fittings into their frame so owners can pump in fresh grease to keep bearings well greased, even for the pivots that see less rotational speeds. (Been awhile since I owned a Santa Cruz, do they still do that?)

Rant over. Back to your regular programming.


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I agree man. IMO, for what these things cost and how long they've been producing/optimizing them, they should be dialed, especially the things that are obvious to many of us. No one should have to tear into a new high end bike. It also odd that all the other little things aren't dialed on these yet like cable rattles, frame protection, shuttle pads, extra mounting bosses so no one has to use those janky tube straps, etc. It's easy stuff to fix really! I even think frame wrap should be a factory option.

A lot can be said for Santa Cruz and Specialized designs. They're getting closer to solving all those little things that bug me but then sometimes, it seems like they always keep the end user one generation away from perfection, just to keep them coming back. Like the Hightower 2. The thing is great but I knew it was 1 generation off of the Ripmo AF/V2 design. I mean, for today's customer, releasing that thing with a seat tube that still needs to be steepened, not coil compatible, only fits 2.4 tires.... Come on. They know better. The Hightower 3.0 will miraculously "solve" those design issues! The new Stumpy Evo is pretty close to nailing all of the issues but the kicker, it's still a 4 bar bike and isn't the best pedaling design. It's not bad but it's no Ibis. The other aspects like geo, travel, adjustability, protection, progression, pivot hardware, etc., are all pretty dialed.
 

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theory proven
3/8 all thread with a 3/8 drive 13 mm craftsman 12point socket



View attachment 1939675
Nice! Stupid question- this is the setup to press in the bearing correct?

For extraction, do you switch this around with the 13 mm on the right side where the washers are and put a bigger socket on the opposite side to act as a cup for the extracted bearing?


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