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EDR
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10,430 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm guessing this has been covered but a quick G-search shows nothing and I need to grab a deal before it's gone...

Can I remove the MIPS liner from a TLD A1 MIPS?

Found a deal on one locally but the fit seemed better on the non-MIPS. Can I convert if needed without hacking it up?
 

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since 4/10/2009
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34,356 Posts
based on all the mips helmets I've seen, removing the mips liner will involve some hacking if you want to remove the liner and all the little attachment points to the shell. plus transferring the pads from the mips liner to the foam.

Wouldn't be hard to do, but it would be a hack.
 

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EDR
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10,430 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
based on all the mips helmets I've seen, removing the mips liner will involve some hacking if you want to remove the liner and all the little attachment points to the shell. plus transferring the pads from the mips liner to the foam.

Wouldn't be hard to do, but it would be a hack.
Thanks. Don't mind modifying but don't want to end up with small bits poking into my head. Was hoping it was a simple "kit" to be installed or removed.

I'll buy (or not) expecting to keep it as MIPS.
 

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EDR
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10,430 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Something maybe worth consideration.

Helmets theoretically have a life span. Is the A1 nearing end of life already -they haven't been made for a few years now.
Well that could be. I see 2018s for sale but who knows what the manufacture date really is of those. Plus they still have them on the TLD website. I assumed those are 2019 s. Maybe those are just old stock.

At any rate, the helmet I just replaced was 10 years old so I'm not too worried about it. But yeah, theoretically I get what you're saying.

On a side note, my local REI has a ton of A1s, I can't imagine they're selling stock from several years ago. Last year stock yeah I could see that. But who knows. when I get a chance this week I'll stop by and see what the manufacture date sticker says on those.
 

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high pivot witchcraft
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Something maybe worth consideration.

Helmets theoretically have a life span. Is the A1 nearing end of life already -they haven't been made for a few years now.
Is this a fact? I have never heard this before. Impacts? Obviously. Sitting in a box unpackaged? Never heard of a helmet deteriorating on its own in this fashion. It's plastic. That **** will be around when all there is left are cockroaches. Or at least I would have thought.
 

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Is this a fact? I have never heard this before. Impacts? Obviously. Sitting in a box unpackaged? Never heard of a helmet deteriorating on its own in this fashion. It's plastic. That **** will be around when all there is left are cockroaches. Or at least I would have thought.
some brans recommend replacing after 5 years or after a crash, this is also common for ski helmets, but that's 5 years of use.
 

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I'm guessing this has been covered but a quick G-search shows nothing and I need to grab a deal before it's gone...

Can I remove the MIPS liner from a TLD A1 MIPS?

Found a deal on one locally but the fit seemed better on the non-MIPS. Can I convert if needed without hacking it up?
You could probably hack it, but you'd need to consider how that resizes it. Need to account for the added space after removing the MIPS stuff. And... would it at that point, fit the same as the current A1 non-MIPS?

Something maybe worth consideration.

Helmets theoretically have a life span. Is the A1 nearing end of life already -they haven't been made for a few years now.
I think they're still making them. I recently bought an A1 MIPS with a MFG date tag indicating 2019. They're still a current model at TLD.

As for life span... I never bought into that myself. After all, it takes Styrofoam like a million years to deteriorate. But, I usually damage them before they are out of fashion. :)
 

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since 4/10/2009
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34,356 Posts
Is this a fact? I have never heard this before. Impacts? Obviously. Sitting in a box unpackaged? Never heard of a helmet deteriorating on its own in this fashion. It's plastic. That **** will be around when all there is left are cockroaches. Or at least I would have thought.
Plastics DO degrade over time, especially with UV exposure. They don't easily break down chemically. They mostly break up into ever smaller particles.

I'm not a fan of that website and whoever runs it. It sets off my "strongly-worded agenda that pretends to be science-based but makes leaps that I feel are bigger than the evidence actually warrants" radar.

I looked up the actual paper referenced by them.

https://asmedigitalcollection.asme....aterial-Properties-of?redirectedFrom=fulltext

The writeup on helmets.org doesn't line up with what was written in the abstract of the paper. Different number of helmets tested. The researchers themselves said that they took CORES of the helmets and tested those cores. No word in the abstract about testing done on whole helmets, or under the CPSC standards or anything like that. Unfortunately, without the full text (which I'm not buying for $25), I can't see their charts or additional details about their methods.

I think THIS is the article that helmets.org actually meant to link, as the abstract lines up with their writeup.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10439-017-1842-4

And honestly, even just reading through the abstract (not buying this one for $40, either), I feel like the helmets.org people went too far with their conclusions. The authors of that study DID find, at least for some helmets, a statistically significant and measurable increase in headform acceleration with age. What it comes down to was that they found other variables to introduce larger differences than helmet age.

The age-related differences were also less than the variability observed between different helmets after accounting for style, size and certification effects.
Oh, and also:

other helmet features that may change with age were not evaluated in this study.
Here's the thing, though. When I'm shopping for a helmet for myself, the size of that helmet is going to be pretty consistent. So I can throw that variable out. Certifications, sure. If a more modern helmet is tested to more rigorous standards than an older one, that alone is a good reason to buy a new one. It's also worth noting that the only "styles" they tested were "BMX" helmets and "traditional" helmets. We all know here that there are other shape/style differences in modern mtb helmets. Shame they didn't actually consider other shape variations.

Further with the style thing, there are multiple different types of technologies on the market these days that are attempts to improve helmet safety. Some of those might degrade with age, others may not. But this study didn't look at those.

There's a lot going on with the range of possible helmet impacts that those standard CPSC tests don't address. This study covers some of them in detail, mostly with just a single helmet type as its model (and pretty restricted to looking at road crash scenarios).

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.855.1293&rep=rep1&type=pdf

As for me, I'm going to look for helmets that don't stop at the CPSC tests. An effort to test for oblique impacts, an effort to address other real-world mtb crashes, etc.

Lots of things can happen to a helmet over time. While I wouldn't be so concerned about a helmet that's a few years old, but brand new otherwise, has anyone measured how sweat affects helmet liners? I sure didn't find anything on a quick search.

I did find information about photo-oxidative degradation of motorcycle helmets, but could not find any similar studies of bicycle helmets.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/15389588.2016.1203428

There's a lot of potential research that could be done to fill gaps in understanding, and I feel like helmets.org pushes too strongly considering what's actually available.
 

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That's where it looks like its headed. I recently got some new pads.
That's wild. I've been mountain biking 30 years and I can't even recall how many helmets I've gone through. Some broke on impact, some got funky from sweat and salt, some decayed in little bits getting bounced around during transport and some just disappeared.

My first bike helmet looked like this guy's:
Bicycle frame Bicycle tire Tire Wheel Bicycle wheel


My most recent one(s) looks like these:

Sports equipment Personal protective equipment Motorcycle accessories Black Grey


Blue Sports gear Motorcycle accessories Helmet Azure


I couldn't imagine having used the same helmet for the entire time.
 
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