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so I just built a wheel for my SS that has a flip-flop hub. Ive got a suicide hub on my roadie, and it works fine (I dont skid or anything) Is there any reason I cant use one on my MTB?
 

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FlatFender said:
so I just built a wheel for my SS that has a flip-flop hub. Ive got a suicide hub on my roadie, and it works fine (I dont skid or anything) Is there any reason I cant use one on my MTB?
No, there is no reason why you can't use it. You're allowed to ride whatever you want, however you want. That said, there's a reason it's called a 'suicide hub.'
 

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Flat,

I researched this late last year when I decided to fix my Inbred. From what I read I wouldn't run a suicide(free/free) hub. I read accounts of the threads stripping out on the even on fixed hubs when used offroad. I guess the extra torque of the lower gears used offroad in combination with alot more skidding/slowing down is very hard on the threads. I know you say you won't skid, but I don't see how you'll avoid it sometimes if your trails have any roots or rocks to contend with. I opted for the Boone ISO Disc Fixie cog. If you do the math, the Boone is a bargain versus having to build up a new wheel(assuming you had disc wheels).

Check out www.63xc.com, lots of great info there on this topic.

Good Luck,

MC
 

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I ran a suicide hub for ~6m (Surly free/free), it worked fine with BB lockrings and locktite.

I then converted to a true fixie hub (Kogswell) and managed to strip the threads (~3M), which was probably a combination of a cheap no-name cog (poor thread depth) and the low gearing.

I then used a WI Eno fix/free hub with a Miche cog, which worked fine.

I'm currently using this: (http://www.fixedgeargallery.com/articles/tomchow/dischub/) it's a front hub with a rear axle and a bolt on cog. I originally posted that to MTBR back in March '04 (!) but all the pictures got lost during the MTBR server upgrade. It is being riding today virtually unchanged.
 

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MellowCat said:
I read accounts of the threads stripping out on the even on fixed hubs when used offroad. I guess the extra torque of the lower gears used offroad in combination with alot more skidding/slowing down is very hard on the threads.
Most of the failures are due to the cog not being on tight enough in the first place, the lockring being tightened, then you go for a ride and the cog tightens but the lockring doesn't, you get some play, and the hub eventually strips.

Best way to mount is use antisieze on the cog threads, use a chainwhip with an extension and tighten the cog down hard, then loctite the lockring on.

I've been riding offorad fixed for several years with no stripped threads...RC
 

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2xPneu said:
What the fock is a suicide hub? I assume you mean fixed gear?

Never heard the term sucide hub.

There's a lot of us who ride fixed offroad, you can also check http://www.63xc.com/index.htm for more info.
A suicide hub is a freewheel hub used a fixed gear hub. Using a BB lockring. Since both are right-hand threads, they don't work against each other and under enough torque they will both thread loose. In worst-case scenarios, the cog becomes completely free, the rider loses control and ... Thus "suicide hub".
 

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2xPneu said:
Best way to mount is use antisieze on the cog threads, use a chainwhip with an extension and tighten the cog down hard, then loctite the lockring on.
I would be careful using a chainwhip with an extension like this...that is a lot more torque than you will ever (even in low gearing) apply with your legs. I have broken (sheared) a steel EAI track cog with a chainwhip on installation. Since then, I simply use anti-seize (automotive), tighten the cog real good with a chainwhip, install the lockring also with anti-seize and a good Kozan lockring tool, and then ride up a good sized hill, dismount with no backpedaling, and further tighten the lockring. On the first couple of rides I will avoid hard backpedaling and check the lockring again, tighten as necessary.

But you are still better off with a bolt on cog solution for really low gear MTB applications. I use a Boone and its 100% hassle free for me, though I know someone who had to cut one off because the bolts seized.
 

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You'll be fine...

FlatFender said:
so I just built a wheel for my SS that has a flip-flop hub. Ive got a suicide hub on my roadie, and it works fine (I dont skid or anything) Is there any reason I cant use one on my MTB?
I have a Phil FreeFlipFreeFlop that I have set up FixedFixed with both a 26" wheel and a 700c...no problems at all. I am about 180lbs. and really don't skid too much. If you are heavy and react to the bike in a hurky jerky way that would add stress to the threads and could result in failure?! My buddy at the shop is a hella good mechanic as well, he put a surly cog on either side with a lockring and it works great. He tried a EAI cog and the base was too wide and would not allow a lock ring. I have had good luck with the SurlyPhil combo.

Giv'R
 

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A fixed hub and a wheel rebuild will cost you what - a hundred bucks? I think me and my bike's physical well-being are worth that.
 

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When I ran fixed the first time a few years back I had issues, hence why I decided to try the Boone. Back then I ran a Surly "New Hub" with a Surly lock ring and a DA cog. The Cog came loose alot. I never used an extention on the chain whip though, my old track racer buddy would have said something else is wrong if you need this much force to keep it tight.

As usual we all have different experiences to share.

MC
 

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I have never used a suicide hub offroad...

but I would surmise sooner or later you are going to apply significant backpressure on the cog. Which no matter how tight you get it on in the beggining, sooner or later there is going to be trouble.

I you must try a suicide hub, cleanliness at the beginning of the installation together with good fitting parts (read a quality cog) reaps huge benefits in the longivity of your setup.

Further, I agree with FODM, a new decent hub (such as the new Surly hint hint) with a new cog and wheel build is going to set you back $100 bucks plus or minus. Money well spent for the the peace of mind in my humble opinion for this particular use.
VTW
 

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What we are missing here

Is that your mountain bike has brakes, a front one at least. They call it a suicide hub because if it comes off during pedal braking you suddenly have no brakes. I don't think it would be a big deal if the cog unscrewed as long as you have a brake to slow the bike down.

I'd say go ahead and try it. Do it as cheaply as possible because you'll try it for a short time and probably realize that fixed mtb riding has a lot of limitations.
 

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Traktor said:
Do it as cheaply as possible because you'll try it for a short time and probably realize that fixed mtb riding has a lot of limitations.
This tired old saw always comes up in these discussions.

Sure you're not going to be bombing down rocky technical hills, but when you've tried fixed on things you never thought you could make and find you can, your tune might change.

Check the 63xc.com a couple of others have posted in this thread.
 
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