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Discussion Starter #1
just picked up my new 04 Burner with Manitou Swinger 3 way S.P.V shox.
so wondering... what fork should i use ?

thinking of at least a 4" since i'll eventually get some of those longer travel plates.

also, trying to build her lightweight, perhaps 24lbs ;~)

 

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Do It Yourself
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A 100mm Minute 2 would be a good match so you have SPV front and rear to balance things out.
 

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freaky franky said:
just picked up my new 04 Burner with Manitou Swinger 3 way S.P.V shox.
so wondering... what fork should i use ?

thinking of at least a 4" since i'll eventually get some of those longer travel plates.

also, trying to build her lightweight, perhaps 24lbs ;~)

I'm trying to make the same decision right now - here's my short list:

Fox Float 100 RLC
Fox Talas
Manitou Minute 2 or 3
Marzocchi Marathon SL 105

I like the Fox and Marz quality, and the SPV on the Minute - tough call. For sure you should look for no less than 4" - the Float and the Minute 2 are the lightest listed. The Talas and Minute 3 offer travel adjust, which I've grown accustomed to on my Psylo, but you pay a small weight penalty. I can't make up my mind!
 

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I believe the people who have been running the Talas forks have said that the bike doesn't feel right at 125mm and they end up with them between 97-105mm. Go figure, Turner is pretty careful at designing their bikes to ride with a certain fork length, in the case of the Burner a 100mm. I would go with the Float 100 or the Minute. Last month, I would have said defintely the float, but having just aquired a Skareb for my hardtail, I cannot believe how plush the manitous are. You might also throw in a Black Platnium to the list.
 

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sooo...help me here!!

I am in the same dilemma(?) , and I may have screwed up. I bought a Sheman Fire Fly, with SPV and rapid wind down, it's a 90-130 mm fork, so it's possible I may pull it back off after the bike is built. I'm wondering if I'll ever use the 130 setting. Maybe I should throw it back on e-bay and get a Minute, but the reviews here are not so good, whereas the Sherman was a 5/5. I want an SPV fork to match the swinger shock, and maximize my climbing. I do alot of fireroad and singletrack, not much hucking, and (obviously) enjoy full on downhill ripping. I posted recently about this, and Tcheezy pointed out that the fork I selected was a 5". My fault for not looking at the FAQ on the Turner webpage, I guess. What do you guys think? Should I not even install it and get the Minute 3? I'm jonesing to build/ride this beautiful piece of equipment sitting in the living room since I got it...patient wife, have I. MUST RIDE SOON!
I really appreciate this forum, I am glad you who have gone before can enlighten dunderbrains like me...
 

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OK, so the Firefly has "rapid wind down travel adjustment?" That is important, and you may be alright after all. Manitou has two basic travel adjust systems (for 04 anyway): rapid travel adjust, and travel wind down. The rapid adjust is a sort of catch which stops the fork from reextending after it has compressed past a certain point. This keeps the fork a few inches down in its travel. It can still compress further but not reextend to its normal full length. The fork's spring is heavily preloaded at that locked down setting, so initial movement is very stiff. It may be ok for climbing, but NOT for normal all-around riding. When I demoed the Minute 3:00, I did not care for this feature, especially since the knob was at the bottom (!) of the fork leg. How dumb is that? The Sherman Breakout Plus I demoed also had the TA system, but the knob was on top. A little better.

The travel wind down I tried on the Minute 1:00 was another critter entirely. You can set the travel at any point between 100 and 130mm and the spring rate does not change. The SPV chamber pressure may increase a bit, but this was not very noticeable. Cranking the fork down did not diminish the fork's rideability at all. This is similar to Fox's Talas feature. Very nice.

If the Firefly really does have the travel wind down feature, try it out. If it has the rapid travel adjust, I'd dump that thing. Either way if it is too much fork for the bike, someone here will GLADLY take it off your hands. It would be a super nice upgrade for a 5-Spot.

If you need a new fork ASAP, look at the new Floats (lightest), a Talas (medium weight), or the Minute 1:00 (coil fork). Larry (Ventanarama) just got some of the new Fox forks in. Call him up. I think the Minute is on sale in a few places. Not sure...

My $0.02
 

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Do It Yourself
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The Sherman is definitely a bit much for the Burner. It's a sweet fork and would probably be much better suited to the 5 Spot. Firefly is pretty much a beefier version of the Minute 1. It's stiffer with 32mm stachions vs. 30mm on the Minute but it's also heavier and has a taller axel to crown for the same travel. The Minute would be much better match for a Burner. If you want the adjustable travel, the Minute 1:00 is good. But if you just want 100mm, the Mintue 2:00 is lighter.

Whatever you get, be sure to give the fork a once over before you ride. It seems Manitou has been shipping fork with too much SPV oil making the ride a bit harsh. At the proper oil height, they are fantastic.
 

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tscheezy said:
OK, so the Firefly has "rapid wind down travel adjustment?" That is important, and you may be alright after all. Manitou has two basic travel adjust systems (for 04 anyway): rapid travel adjust, and travel wind down. The rapid adjust is a sort of catch which stops the fork from reextending after it has compressed past a certain point. This keeps the fork a few inches down in its travel. It can still compress further but not reextend to its normal full length. The fork's spring is heavily preloaded at that locked down setting, so initial movement is very stiff. It may be ok for climbing, but NOT for normal all-around riding. When I demoed the Minute 3:00, I did not care for this feature, especially since the knob was at the bottom (!) of the fork leg. How dumb is that? The Sherman Breakout Plus I demoed also had the TA system, but the knob was on top. A little better.

The travel wind down I tried on the Minute 1:00 was another critter entirely. You can set the travel at any point between 100 and 130mm and the spring rate does not change. The SPV chamber pressure may increase a bit, but this was not very noticeable. Cranking the fork down did not diminish the fork's rideability at all. This is similar to Fox's Talas feature. Very nice.

If the Firefly really does have the travel wind down feature, try it out. If it has the rapid travel adjust, I'd dump that thing. Either way if it is too much fork for the bike, someone here will GLADLY take it off your hands. It would be a super nice upgrade for a 5-Spot.

If you need a new fork ASAP, look at the new Floats (lightest), a Talas (medium weight), or the Minute 1:00 (coil fork). Larry (Ventanarama) just got some of the new Fox forks in. Call him up. I think the Minute is on sale in a few places. Not sure...

My $0.02
You guys rock. I'm gonna call Larry tomorrow, and see what he can do. I found his # on the website for his shop. I think rather than risk it, I'll put the fork back up on ebay and look for a Minute 2, and in the future I'll not read too much into the gear reviews, but rather try out the parts at my LBS (assuming they have a bike with the part I'm considering). It's tough buying components when you can't really test them before you buy...
My build kit came today, so all I'm waiting for is the fork. And last question, do you guys build yer own , or do you have someone do it? How hard is it? Special tools? I am very mechanically inclined, and fix appiliances/HVAC for a living, but I also know there are some things I shan't mess with. Opinions?
 

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If you've never worked on a bike, probably a good

mr magu said:
You guys rock. I'm gonna call Larry tomorrow, and see what he can do. I found his # on the website for his shop. I think rather than risk it, I'll put the fork back up on ebay and look for a Minute 2, and in the future I'll not read too much into the gear reviews, but rather try out the parts at my LBS (assuming they have a bike with the part I'm considering). It's tough buying components when you can't really test them before you buy...
My build kit came today, so all I'm waiting for is the fork. And last question, do you guys build yer own , or do you have someone do it? How hard is it? Special tools? I am very mechanically inclined, and fix appiliances/HVAC for a living, but I also know there are some things I shan't mess with. Opinions?
idea to have it built. Then as things need to be adjusted or replaced, buy the needed tools and learn to do therepair
yourself. B/B, headset, disc brakes and fork installation are probably the easiest to screw up, if you are not careful. Once you do it , it becomes easy. Rich
 

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mr magu said:
I am in the same dilemma(?) , and I may have screwed up. I bought a Sheman Fire Fly, with SPV and rapid wind down, it's a 90-130 mm fork, so it's possible I may pull it back off after the bike is built. I'm wondering if I'll ever use the 130 setting. Maybe I should throw it back on e-bay and get a Minute, but the reviews here are not so good, whereas the Sherman was a 5/5. I want an SPV fork to match the swinger shock, and maximize my climbing. I do alot of fireroad and singletrack, not much hucking, and (obviously) enjoy full on downhill ripping. I posted recently about this, and Tcheezy pointed out that the fork I selected was a 5". My fault for not looking at the FAQ on the Turner webpage, I guess. What do you guys think? Should I not even install it and get the Minute 3? I'm jonesing to build/ride this beautiful piece of equipment sitting in the living room since I got it...patient wife, have I. MUST RIDE SOON!
I really appreciate this forum, I am glad you who have gone before can enlighten dunderbrains like me...
I use both the 03 and 04 Sherman Firefly forks. Neither of them has "rapid travel wind down". How did you get that? It is a great fork, which I have used on an Id and a 5-Spot, but don't think it would be at all appropriate for the Burner since you would seldom want to run it at the 90mm travel adjust.

I also have two Minute Three forks. It is a great fork, really smooth, very adjustable, but again, it only has settings for 130mm or 110mm on its travel adjust. The 110mm is great for climbing but not where you want that fork set for going downhill. So again, you would end up with the fork at 130mm, which is not appropriate for the Burner.

I suggest you rethink the issue ASAP.

John W.
 

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papajohn said:
I use both the 03 and 04 Sherman Firefly forks. Neither of them has "rapid travel wind down". How did you get that? It is a great fork, which I have used on an Id and a 5-Spot, but don't think it would be at all appropriate for the Burner since you would seldom want to run it at the 90mm travel adjust.

I also have two Minute Three forks. It is a great fork, really smooth, very adjustable, but again, it only has settings for 130mm or 110mm on its travel adjust. The 110mm is great for climbing but not where you want that fork set for going downhill. So again, you would end up with the fork at 130mm, which is not appropriate for the Burner.

I suggest you rethink the issue ASAP.

John W.
Thanks, John. I guess I'll rethink it. It does have rapid travel II, which is apparently not the same as RTW, eh?...so I don't know if they are the same as yours. Mine is the Answer version? I don't know if they're different.
Here's the link:http://www.answerproducts.com/items.asp?deptid=1&itemid=7

Weight: 4.9 lbs
Travel: 90/130mm New Rapid Travel II top-mounted travel adjust with 40mm range
Damping: SPV Damping
Adjustments: Rebound, SPV Platform Pressure, SPV Volume, Travel
Lubrication: Semi-Bath with Evil Genius Seals
Spring: Ti Coil
Casting: Magnesium RA
Stanchions: 32mm Aluminum
Steerer: 1 1/8" Aluminum
Axle: Hex Lock
Options: onepointfive aluminum steerer
 

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mr magu said:
Thanks, John. I guess I'll rethink it. It does have rapid travel II, which is apparently not the same as RTW, eh?...so I don't know if they are the same as yours. Mine is the Answer version? I don't know if they're different.
Here's the link:http://www.answerproducts.com/items.asp?deptid=1&itemid=7

Weight: 4.9 lbs
Travel: 90/130mm New Rapid Travel II top-mounted travel adjust with 40mm range
Damping: SPV Damping
Adjustments: Rebound, SPV Platform Pressure, SPV Volume, Travel
Lubrication: Semi-Bath with Evil Genius Seals
Spring: Ti Coil
Casting: Magnesium RA
Stanchions: 32mm Aluminum
Steerer: 1 1/8" Aluminum
Axle: Hex Lock
Options: onepointfive aluminum steerer
That is the fork that I have. Both the Firefly and Minute Three have the Travel Adjust that allow you to choose either 130mm or 90mm (Firefly)
or 130mm or 110mm (Min 3), but not anywhere inbetween.

Manitou does have forks with the "wind-down" feature that allows for choosing any travel within the range, much like the Rock Shox U-Turn feature of the last several years, and they claim it does not change the spring rate when you adjust along the range of travel.

This feature is not available on the Firefly or the Min Three however, and my experience is that the spring rate is significantly different when either of these two forks is dropped to its lower travel, which is a big reason you only use that feature for climbing.

As someone else said, you might let us know if you decide to part with the Sherman Firefly. It is one of the best forks I have used for a bigger travel "all trail" bike, and I bet you could find a taker. (I might even be interested if it was a bargain!)

Good luck.

John W.
 

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Build it, break it, fix it, ride it

I built my XCE from scratch and would recommend to everyone and anyone to do so. I bought some items from Jenson and they included a promotional cd called Break it, Fix it, Ride it, or something like that. It gives you generalized descriptions on how to install each part. Together with the instructions, you should be set. I think it is invaluable to build it yourself because these bikes are always breaking or needing adjustments etc. Knowing how its works makes this stuff so easy, particularly when you are on a ride.

There really aren't that many special tools, and those you do need are pretty affordable. I would get assorted allen wrenches, your basic screwdriver sets, a pipe cutter, a reaming tool, an adjustable crescent wrench or two, the park bottom bracket tool and the park crank puller. You will use these in the future. You can fabricate other tools, also. For example, I found that a carefully cut piece of scrap PVC pipe was perfect for setting the race on the steer tube. You can do all the other stuff, like cutting the steerer tube and reaming it, or installing the stem nut pretty easily if you follow some of the simple rules which you undoubtedly follow in your work, i.e., measure twice, cut once or don't use a hammer where a screw driver will work. Leave extra just in case--it's easier to cut off more later than to replace the part.

That said, there are some items you should probably have your LBS do. Installing the headset is one. Someone on one of the forums recently related his attempt to install his using a BFH and ended up with a cracked headtube. :( You don't want that.

Any way, you'll get great pleasure from doing it yourself and gain a level of understanding of your bike that will be invaluable. Good luck and dont hesitate to ask questions--there are plenty of people on the boards with experience who are willing to help..

mr magu said:
You guys rock. I'm gonna call Larry tomorrow, and see what he can do. I found his # on the website for his shop. I think rather than risk it, I'll put the fork back up on ebay and look for a Minute 2, and in the future I'll not read too much into the gear reviews, but rather try out the parts at my LBS (assuming they have a bike with the part I'm considering). It's tough buying components when you can't really test them before you buy...
My build kit came today, so all I'm waiting for is the fork. And last question, do you guys build yer own , or do you have someone do it? How hard is it? Special tools? I am very mechanically inclined, and fix appiliances/HVAC for a living, but I also know there are some things I shan't mess with. Opinions?
 

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Just curious, but why hasn't the Manitou Skareb Platinum been recommended? Last I checked ColoradoCyclist.com had these on sale.
 

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TXrider said:
Just curious, but why hasn't the Manitou Skareb Platinum been recommended? Last I checked ColoradoCyclist.com had these on sale.
The Skareb is more of a lightweight XC race type fork. It has even smaller stanchions (28.6mm). It would be a good fork for someone looking to a better alternative to a SID.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
o4 burner, what fork ?. got it :)

hey guys,
thanks for all the great sugestions :)

eventually went with a 125 RLC, will redude it to 100mm and add longer travel plates for rear., planing to run it with an AVA RL rear shox.

also, odered a Minute 2 SPV to run with oem rear shox.

Thompson seat post, time platform pedals and hydro hayes coming on monday....









 

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Marzocchi MX or Marathon

I would highly recommend Marzocchi MX or Marathon with ETA. The ETA is unbelievably useful during climbs, because you get 105 or 120 mm of travel on the downhill (depending on the fork you choose) and it drops to 30mm on a climb, placing you in a much better climbing position. Not to mention that it has the exact same paint finish.

 
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