[behindbars423]

First off let me start off by saying I’m not the narrow-minded, say “no” to everything type. As a matter of fact as far as the infusion of BMX style riding into Mtbiking I’m all for it; what took so long? My roots are in BMX/freestyle so I love the fact that stunts have made riding a “big” bike more fun and challenging, when they’re done in the right place. But building stunts at Ralph Stover is a VERY bad idea. That will be the quickest way to get cycling banned from there.
We are quite fortunate to have a decent place to ride so close to home. I myself have been riding there for over 14 years. And in that time I’ve seen a lot of changes to the trail. Some for good some for bad. With biking getting so popular, more and more people are in the woods and the trails are showing it. It used to be single track all the way out to the pool/campground area, we can see that has definitely changed. And with this being such a high profile park with hikers, equestrians, campers, climbers and bikers, there’s that much more traffic and many more eyes. You know for a fact that someone is going to complain to the authorities about seeing stunts. And then it’s a matter of putting big “NO BIKES” signs all over the place. Remember it’s easier to close an area to riding than to open a new one up.
You might say that the stunts are off the main trail and they don’t interfere with anything. But the place is already getting to be a mess with all the little side trails and shortcuts around obstacles. Plus you know the stunts won’t be confined to the “off trail” areas for long. Somebody sees one stunt so they think its ok to build one of their own then someone else builds one in the middle of the main trail. How long could that cycle continue before we’re given the boot?
I am by no means trying to get on a soapbox and declare myself “trail boss” or anything like that. I just see the beginning of a bad pattern and the result will be bad for all of us. I’m just trying to make whoever builds there to see the process through to completion, the effects it will have. It’s a public park, and we have to be aware that not just bikers use it. As far as building, why not take a few minutes to fix a problem you see in the trail. Someone already voluntarily has done some great trail maintenance. If we all give a little back to this place it can be bike friendly forever. It would definitely give bikers a better image if they were seen doing a little bit to take care of the joint.
Now you can say I’m an a$#hole and should shut the [email protected]$k up and stop being a whiner and a pu##y or whatever, and you’re quite free to. But I hope you would remember these words when the only place that we’re allowed to ride is the Delaware Canal trail.

Just my meager two cents

A concerned biker

[email protected]

P.S. If this issue was already addressed I apologize for the redundancy, as I’m not a regular to this forum.

 

[Stick]

I cut my MTB teeth riding at High Rocks almost 13 yrs ago and, up until moving ~ 2 yrs ago, I used to ride there a few times per week. I totally agree with you re: how much the place has changed over that time. The amount of traffic (foot, bike, etc) the trails see now is probably 20X what it used to be and the wear & tear is very visible to anyone who's paying attention.

On the other hand, erosion is a natural process and has always been a 'problem' at H.R., even before the popularity of the place exploded over the last decade.

Trail damage aside for now, which 'stunts' are you refering to? Unless they've been constructed in the last two or three weeks, the only 'stunt' I can recall is the crazy ladder-ramp leading over a a big fallen tree and terminating in a drop-off of about 6-8 ft. This is nothing new. In fact, it had been there for many years. It was largely unsafe (very ricketty construction & there was a wheel-swallowing gap in the 'planks' just before the drop) and unfinished for a very long time. I can't recall exactly when, but it was probably some time in the last year that I noticed someone finally took the time to finish it (probably the guys from Mt. Perk, if I had to guess, but I don't know). Anyway, somebody came in not long after it was finished and tore most of it down. Has someone rebuilt it again?

If that's the only one you're talking about, then I think it's hardly something to get very upset about. Most people never even venture out on the trail on that side of the road; opting instead to see the overlooks.

The only other 'stunt' I remember is the big log ride where the trail forks (right goes down to the grayrocks area, left goes up to the campground), but that's more or less completely natural. It is, after all, just a big fallen tree. I doubt most hikers who see the tree would even imagine people are riding on it unless they see someone doing it.

More disturbing than either of the things discussed above, is the "trail" created by people launching off of the small rock outcrop (also at the same fork described above, sort of 'downslope' of the tree). This is a real mess and is a sad sight. Seems people are jumping this rock, then skidding to a stop afterwards (it's a dead-end) only to turn around, walk back up and do it again. If this is allowed to continue, then that entire area is going to wash out and the 'intersection' is going to become a huge eyesore (more so than it is already).

It's sad that people don't have more respect for the forest at High Rocks. Freeriders take note: what behindbars said is very true, but it's not just stunts that will cause the powers-that-be to notice the impact bikes have in the park. You guys have got to stop cutting new lines all over the place. The park is too small and too valuable a resource. Don't let it become an unsightly maze of new & interconnected lines just for the sake of catching a little air. There are plenty of better places to do this. What made High Rocks such a great place to ride was that it used to be this sweet, narrow ribbon of singletrack that made a killer, uninterupted loop around the park. Now, much of that original ribbon is lost; widened to the point of resembling a small fire road in many places.

I still love riding there, but much of it's appeal is already lost. Damaged almost beyond repair by so many careless riders. I hope we can all continue to ride and enjoy the park for years to come, but please, think about the damage done. Better yet, do something to reverse it.

First off let me start off by saying I’m not the narrow-minded, say “no” to everything type. As a matter of fact as far as the infusion of BMX style riding into Mtbiking I’m all for it; what took so long? My roots are in BMX/freestyle so I love the fact that stunts have made riding a “big” bike more fun and challenging, when they’re done in the right place. But building stunts at Ralph Stover is a VERY bad idea. That will be the quickest way to get cycling banned from there.
We are quite fortunate to have a decent place to ride so close to home. I myself have been riding there for over 14 years. And in that time I’ve seen a lot of changes to the trail. Some for good some for bad. With biking getting so popular, more and more people are in the woods and the trails are showing it. It used to be single track all the way out to the pool/campground area, we can see that has definitely changed. And with this being such a high profile park with hikers, equestrians, campers, climbers and bikers, there’s that much more traffic and many more eyes. You know for a fact that someone is going to complain to the authorities about seeing stunts. And then it’s a matter of putting big “NO BIKES” signs all over the place. Remember it’s easier to close an area to riding than to open a new one up.
You might say that the stunts are off the main trail and they don’t interfere with anything. But the place is already getting to be a mess with all the little side trails and shortcuts around obstacles. Plus you know the stunts won’t be confined to the “off trail” areas for long. Somebody sees one stunt so they think its ok to build one of their own then someone else builds one in the middle of the main trail. How long could that cycle continue before we’re given the boot?
I am by no means trying to get on a soapbox and declare myself “trail boss” or anything like that. I just see the beginning of a bad pattern and the result will be bad for all of us. I’m just trying to make whoever builds there to see the process through to completion, the effects it will have. It’s a public park, and we have to be aware that not just bikers use it. As far as building, why not take a few minutes to fix a problem you see in the trail. Someone already voluntarily has done some great trail maintenance. If we all give a little back to this place it can be bike friendly forever. It would definitely give bikers a better image if they were seen doing a little bit to take care of the joint.
Now you can say I’m an a$#hole and should shut the [email protected]$k up and stop being a whiner and a pu##y or whatever, and you’re quite free to. But I hope you would remember these words when the only place that we’re allowed to ride is the Delaware Canal trail.

Just my meager two cents

A concerned biker

[email protected]

P.S. If this issue was already addressed I apologize for the redundancy, as I’m not a regular to this forum.

 

[BuzzHog]

Wow.... this thread is three years old...

I just started to get back into biking and have been riding again for only a month now. A friend and I went to Ralph Stovers and loved the place... I can only imagine what it was like back in the hayday...

 

[Stick]

I can only imagine what it was like back in the hayday...

You have no idea... it was so different - like night and day. I was there last night after being away from the park for only 2 weeks and was surprised to see that many of the logs had been cut out by someone w/ a chainsaw. One of them was a real mess and needed to be cleared (big unrideable tree that came down maybe 3 wks ago on the downhill section before the climb up to the campground) - but the rest? Absolutely no reason to take 'em out. People just end up riding faster and overshooting corners, widening the trail even more.

And, 3 yrs after the original post above, people are still tearing new lines all over the place. I know I sound like a grumpy ol' fck, but it's sad that it'll never be even remotely as nice a place to ride as it once was. Still fun, no doubt - but more eyesore than singletrack paradise.

 

[BuzzHog]

i know the section you are talking about.. There were a lot of trees that were downed there recently before we rode... There was a couple of guys fixing some rock ramps on a tree in the gulley... They told us about the trail on the other side of the pavement at the end of the railing... Since i'm new to trail riding, that place seemed like paradise found...

Doing cc today with nHurD and gonna do pennypack tomorrow... Rs is still my fav so far...

 

[rfm137]

I was there a month or so back and I found the trails quite fun... but I cannot compare them to their previous state.

How do they compare to Wiss technically as I have never ridden there?

Bob