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I have NITROGEN in my Avalanche FORK and rear shock on my Canfield I love the way craig at AVY sets it up nothing but the best suspension out even better then ELKA. I know i am going to here about that comment but if you have ridden AVY you will know what I am talking about. just my .02 stiff and bottomless suspension ....THANKS CRAIG AVY RULES ...
 

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Elitest thrill junkie
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Yes, and I love my new Avalanche shocks, but what the hell does that have to do with this thread? (yes, theyare better than Elka because there are more tuning parameters and even more fluid flow, but that's also why they costs so much).

Also, pretty sure that there is no nitrogen charged reservior in the Avalanche fork. The avalanche fork is an open-bath fork, as such it doesn't use a nitrogen charged reservior. This was feature on some White Brothers and BOS forks that use closed-cartridge dampers, not very common due to minimal cavitation that forks encounter.
 

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I gotta pee
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Ok, thread wrap up thus far.

Nitrogen sounds cooler, has larger molecules than oxygen, nitrogen is not effected by heat, builds no moisture, both push and cr1 use it when they tune shocks, SMT has little to no idea of the actual benefits of it


Did i miss anything?
 

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I can ride a two-wheeler
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Discussion Starter #44
Dynamatt said:
Ok, thread wrap up thus far.

Nitrogen sounds cooler, has larger molecules than oxygen, nitrogen is not effected by heat, builds no moisture, both push and cr1 use it when they tune shocks, SMT has little to no idea of the actual benefits of it


Did i miss anything?

The part about where you can buy some nitrogen? :confused:
 

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Underskilled
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Oh this thread is brilliant, please don't stop people.

Trained scientist here, so could advise the reason all of this works, but it is more fun to watch.
 

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huntandride said:
Could you put helium in tires to save weight?
Holy S##T, Watch out for that brick wall!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AAAAAAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!

If you watch mythbusters you'll get the answer to that question
 

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Diggidy said:
First, we already got that out of the way a few posts up. Phenomenal reading comprehension.

I still don't quite get what you think that proves though? Other people, including myself, have said the real reason N2 is used is because it's anhydrous, and so it has more consistent thermal expansion.

You seem to have a pretty tenuous grasp on what we're talking about, so I'm just going to stop.
I just read what you wrote...not reading down to everyone else....

and you are right the main focus is lack of moisture and slower temp difference
 

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Demodude said:
Holy S##T, Watch out for that brick wall!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AAAAAAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!

If you watch mythbusters you'll get the answer to that question
what happen
 

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Appologies for bringing this back from the dead, but, who would know how much cooler a Fox X2, RP23, or CTD would run with nitrogen V's air when at race conditions in the summer heat ? I know its a daft questions but I would realy appreiciate an answer from someone who actually knows or has a rough idea, no guessing, thats my job.
Thanks in advance.
 

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Appologies for bringing this back from the dead, but, who would know how much cooler a Fox X2, RP23, or CTD would run with nitrogen V's air when at race conditions in the summer heat ? I know its a daft questions but I would realy appreiciate an answer from someone who actually knows or has a rough idea, no guessing, thats my job.
Thanks in advance.
The heat shedding abilities of the shock are unchanged going to N2.
N2 is just moisture free whereas atmosphere air has varying amounts of moisture (humidity).
All air expands when heated, this is unavoidable. But N2 with no moisture will always expand at a known/ consistent rate whereas air with varying amounts of moisture in it expands at an unknown/ inconsistent rate as a result of the moisture content being dependent on other factors (i.e. time of day, location, weather).
Hope that helps.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
 

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Gas laws don't take into consideration what the gas actually is. The gas law just works.

p1/t1 = p2/t2. So as temp rises, so does pressure. Mixed gas, pure nitrogen, doesnt matter. Temp goes up, gas pressure goes up. They all go up the same.

But air in a shock or fork doesnt overheat. The damper oil does. The best way to fight this is with a high quality high VI oil.
 

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Gas laws don't take into consideration what the gas actually is. The gas law just works.
Not true at all. Taking short cuts is a real trend in society, and 'science' has become so perverted in the last 50 years. It no longer is based on facts. But rather opinion and theories. It's a sad truth.

Taken straight from Wikipedia.
Ideal Gas Law.
"The ideal gas law, also called the general gas equation, is the equation of state of a hypothetical ideal gas. It is a good approximation of the behavior of many gases under many conditions, although it has several limitations."

Avogadro's law.
"The law is named after Amedeo Avogadro who, in 1812,[2][3] hypothesized that two given samples of an ideal gas, of the same volume and at the same temperature and pressure, contain the same number of molecules. As an example, equal volumes of molecular hydrogen and nitrogen contain the same number of molecules when they are at the same temperature and pressure, and observe ideal gas behavior. In practice, real gases show small deviations from the ideal behavior and the law holds only approximately, but is still a useful approximation for scientists."

N2 is cheap, readily available and has a number of advantages over 'air' for both tires and dampers.
Please don't spread incorrect theories and information that we know is wrong. Just because it is 'close enough'

If your whole argument is that air is good enough then say the truth. 'nitrogen is better, but air is close enough (because you're a hack)'.
Sort of how to some people using white sugar instead of brown sugar might be good enough, and not noticeable or measurable to most people......
 

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Underskilled
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Please explain Grand Wizard.

Elaborate, go into detail.

Demonstrate that you know what you are talking about.
 

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... are you seriously trying to discredit ideal gas laws? Thats not internet hack science, its an established gas law.

I assure you, the basic principals of science are plenty sufficient for bicycle use.
 

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... are you seriously trying to discredit ideal gas laws? Thats not internet hack science, its an established gas law.
Only trying to discredit misinformation.

A statement such as "Gas laws don't take into consideration what the gas actually is. The gas law just works." is very misleading and deceptive, without proper context. Because going by the ideal gas law you are technically correct. They don't take into consideration what the gas actually is. But the ideal gas law itself is wrong. Since actual laws of gas do take into consideration what the gas actually is.

As I said in my last post. This is common in engineering to take short cuts. It's the same culture that brings us cheap **** in every day life. Taking short cuts to cut time/cost.
Your comment about the ideal gas law being 'plenty sufficient for bicycle use' is a prime example of this. It's good enough.......
But unfortunately good enough or sufficient doesn't make it right.

This is a discussion about whether using nitrogen instead of air is better. The answer is a clear yes. That is known just by looking at some simple facts about the different gases, and also by the fact that we are talking about a bottle of quality controlled gas compared with an unknown air quality.
If you want to question whether people will notice it, or if one is better over the long term then you are welcome to discuss that.
All I know is that one is better than the other. How much difference is really hard to measure and I will leave someone else to argue that.
 
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