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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
So, here's the story. Last fall I built up an epic, so that I could continue riding longer stuff while not hurting my back. Epic proved to be an awesome race bike, but not so much a trail bike (handlebars five inches below saddle....) worthy of going to the mountains with. Climbed great, sprints great, corners on rails, but it's simply a race bike. I needed an everyday bike that makes adventuring fun.

So I got an industry job this spring, and even though pay isn't great, EP buys on bike parts are cool. Given the things yall have said about these bikes, including the fact that I had never even seen a Turner before (living in South Carolina) gave me the lust. Ordered one in May. Can't say I didn't consider a 5.5 (that special smurf blue color is dope) or one of those Ellsworths, but we all know how Turner owners arrive at realizing their true match. It's been a few weeks wait, due to Turner moving facilities and the fact that when their builder was running behind, they decided to bump the XL frames from the order. Anyway, can't complain, as it's not like I've been without a bike to ride. And I'm kinda glad I had to wait awhile. Shows how many of these bikes Turner is selling, which they truly deserve after putting so much time into bringing wonderful bikes to market.

So here it is. XL spot:
Minute 3 fork, King ISO/Mavic 317 wheels, Hope Mono M4 185mm brakes, SRAM X.0/X.9 combo, XTR front, Deus cranks, WTB Rocket V Stealth, Thomson, TruVativ Team Carbon bars, Nokian NBX 2.3 kevlars, 959 pedals, etc.

Component impressions: These brakes rock. Super easy to bleed, which is necessary to shorten the front hose, reroute the rear through the frame, and then add a shimano deore hydraulic hose to the rear, in order to get the length I needed. The shimano hose is a bit smaller diameter, but for the price, I had to give it a try. Just make sure to use the brass crimp ferrule that comes with the shimano hose, rather than the one sized for the HOPE hose. I know the wheels are a bit light, but they're what I had. Two years good so far. If I have issues, I'll go to a bit heavier rim. Hope seatpost clamps rock, cause bronze bushings are smoooooth. Race Face Deus cranks are SHINY (I know, but we didn't have any black ones in stock, and the Atlas wasn't available yet.) I had a bit of trouble installing the BB, as my Pedro's wrench didn't quite fit onto the bearing shells, without a bit of 'encouragement.' These bars are cool. LOTS of sweep. Hopefully their alloy endcaps will defray any damage from mild crashes. 959 pedals have always had a special place in my heart.

Bike impressions: I love the way the rear suspension tracks terrain. I am now convinced that the epic (the only full suspension I've had till now) isn't really a full suspension bike. Crank combo with this frame makes for a super laterally stiff rear end. Standover is a bit tall, but once I get some weight on the pedals, it sags in and makes mounting the saddle a bit easier. Slack headtubes are new to me. Definately a different feel to this bike. Gotta TURN those bars to make it handle. But, when you do, it seems to lean the bike into the turn for you, making cornering fun even when sitting up tall on this beast. I can't really comment on suspension yet, as I realize I have plenty more dialing in before reaching nirvana.

Turner impressions: Casey was ever patient in me switching back and forth from blue to black three times while I awaited the build of my frame. My rear dropouts got bent in shipping. The night I was building it (the night I received the much anticipated frame) I discovered my wheel wouldn't fit into the dropout. I finally realized what had happened. After eight weeks of waiting on the frame, I was quite upset. I called Turner up (they're three hours behind) and they agreed to air ship me a new seatstay unit. No problem, no biggie to them, they just said hey, it happens, we'll make it a priority to take care of it. And incase you haven't noticed, they put ALOT of effort into that seatstay. Milling and welding and whatnot, and they sent me a new one without hesitation. NICE. That was a monday, and I had the new parts on thursday. I went ahead and tried to straighten out the piece, so I could build and ride the bike. Alignment of brakes and driveline was WAY off, but now with new seatstay, everybody is at peace. Customer service gave me the hook-up in a hurry on that one.

As for the unofficial turner customer service reps on this board, thanks for all the advice and entertainment you have given to me in the posts you have given others. Riding this bike is downright fun, and I look forward to my first trip to the mountains, and every trip to the local trails. I look forward to joining the community here, and giving back to others as you all helped me. Hopefully someday, I'll see other people riding in this area with Turners.

End of application for ninja club membership card.
 

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I'd be carefull with using a shimano hose with hope brakes... shimano lines are made for mineral oil while hope brakes use synthetic (DOT 5.1) oil. From experience I know that dot oil does very unnice things to mineral hoses. One of my buddies put a magura hose (mineral) on his hayes brake (dot)... when he got the right hoses he opened the brake up and found some kind of white gunk in his brakes... probably the inside of the hose that was bitten of by the aggresive Dot oil. So my advice order the a length of hope hose and change it as quickly as possible.

Nice ride even in the big size ;)

greetz
Bettes also a member of the ninja clan
 

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............nice sled! New applicants need only post up their submission HERE. Remember to submit your absolute best photo:p

.....shiny bits will make you stand out of the shadows a bit, but natural selection is how we keep the remnant elite:D

 

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Brass Nipples!
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How Big?

Nice bike. Judging from the stem and seatpost size on the XL frame, you must be
pretty tall. My son, who is 15 and still growing like a weed at 6' 5" is on a budget steel hardtail now: he's growing too fast for me to keep him on anything expensive.

Do you mind sharing your inseam and standover measurements? Once he slows down, he might get a Turner. It would be nice to get a feel for how various size people fit their bikes.

The website lists a "Sasquatch" size that must be gigantic. Anyone out there with the Sasq. frame? If so, how do you like it?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm 6'3, with a bit of extra torso per my height. I've never measured my legs, I'll do so when I find a tape. While the sled isn't on the small side for me, it's still plenty huckable and not cumbersome. I had posted the 130mm stem for sale on the classifieds, but I when I used it to mock up the build, found it to be just in the right ballpark.

On brakes, I have some pretty interesting thoughts on the matter. See, back in the day, english auto manufacturers were still using natural (non-vulcanized) rubber for hoses and wire insulation. Natural rubber comes from a tree, and sets up at room temperature, rather than using carbon and oils and cooking it. Honestly, it was junk. Old jags and sunbeams, riddled with electrical problems. The reason they couldn't use DOT fluid in their brakes, is because the alcohol (which 'american car' vulcanized rubber was impervoius to) would attack the natural rubbers, cause them to redissolve. Vulcanized rubbers can never be melted or redissolved. The reason to use alcohol in brake fluid, is that it will actually absorb a certain amount of water (chemically absorb) which prevents it from boiling at temperature. Thus, old jags have massive brake issues as well as horrible electrical gremlins. Even the germans (VWs, BMWs) had figured out that DOT fluid was good, and majorly prevented brakes from boiling and dragging.

All that to say, I doubt that anyone still uses junk quality natural tree rubber materials in their hoses, which is the only reason to use non-alcoholic mixes in the first place. Mineral oil is just oil, while DOT fluid is oil with alcohol. I'm pretty certain the hose (same construction, uses a silicone inner liner) will stand the fluid. One thing I've noticed though over the years, is that if different types of brake fluid are mixed on cars (DOT 5 or DOT 3/4 or mineral or silicone) a white gooey coagulant will form in the system. My guess is that when your friend changed put DOT in his system, this occured with residual oil that was left behind the pistons and elsewhere. I'll keep an eye on it, and take a look in a few months. What it all comes down to, is that most of the hoses used for bike and motorcycle brakes are made by Parker Fluid and Hydraulic, a huge industrial supplier for such components. Neither Shimano nor hope are in the business of making hoses. DOT fluid is not harmful (other than to paint) to the envoirment, or to people, or to teddie bears, any more than a beer is. It's all a marketing ploy that Shimano and others have used to tout their systems as better. Plus, they get to sell you little bottles of expensive stuff, rather than something that you can buy in an auto shop by the quart bottle for a few dollars. Even so, two teaspoons of fluid in my bike would be far less dangerous to the enviornment than the pint in my car. That said, yes, I also have maguras on my other bike.

X-type: Yes, the Deus uses the x-type system. Yes, it is buttery smooth. Issues: non-drive side cup was a bear to get in. Probably should have reamed out the frame first. Second my Pedros wrench wouldn't quite fit onto the splines of the cup without some persuasion. Could be a problem with the wrench, could be that RF didn't quite make their cup spline the same as XT/XTR. No biggie, I got it in. YES, it is noticeably stiffer than previous RF ISIS Turbines and my FSA Team Issues on the Epic. Also, the Atlas cranks have finally made it to market. Have your bike shops call their wholesalers. They look swank. I'm sure they'll be loved by all. They have more of a bead-blasted finish rather than the shiny machined finish of the Deus, and come in silver and black.

I'll try and get a better picture, involving terrain, but taking it to the booth at work was the best photo op I've had sofar. Beats the workstand...
 

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johnmyster99 said:
X-type: Yes, the Deus uses the x-type system. Yes, it is buttery smooth.
So you don't think your x-type BB has significant more friction than other systems?
(Buttery is what I would call the performance of mine too. As if I had put a pound of butter inside the system!)

The BB on my other bikes (conventional mostly quite cheap ones) will spin about 2 to 3 times when you give the cranks a slight kick, the RF X-type will spin once.
Can that be normal?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
well, it's just that alot of time seems to be spent on these boards complaining about bottom brakets not being smooth. I'd say that they're smooth, as they have no grinding, crunching or pulsating sound or feel to them. I gather that most reasonable complaints about BB systems are about said grinding, or crunching.

Are they frictionless, no. Any bearing system other than a loose ball system will have some friction involved because of the seals. If you're really interested in that, I'll give a report after a few good rides. I'll pull the chain off and check. Since I'm ramping up mileage in order to train for the fall collegiate season (six weeks of racing every weekend, september and october) I'll be doing a big less riding of the mountain bikes and more of the road bike, sometimes on the trainer. It'll take a bit, but I'll get those seals broken in eventually. Also, when bearings are new, the uneven distribution of grease around the balls will make them a bit slow too. Takes awhile to get it all out of the way of the balls. Anyway, I think these cranks will be a good setup, for a good long time to come. Way more sound construction than trying to make an ISIS setup last for a long time. And if I ever have issues, out will pop an XTR BB shell, and on it will go.
 

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Just Grin and HUCK it...
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That's a Beautiful Big Black Bike!! :D

Welcome to the fold, my brother. (I am a card carrying member of the Hi Ho Silver club)

Now get out there and ride that beast!!!!
 

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thanks for your feedback

i'm going to give the BB some more kilometers and see how it performs
i'll have the opportunity to check out some professionally built combos soon and will decide wheather mine is assembled and adjusted correctly
 
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