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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So it feels like my Maelstrom has finaly become unridable. This really sucks because after months of riding I just found the sweet spot in the suspension setup and I am really starting to pin my local trails. The bike feels super stable and jumps incredibly well, even compared to my Wildcard. The sizing is spot on and geometry ideal which all results in a confidence inspiring ride that has seriously allowed me to up my game in the short time I have had the bike. When the bike is working its an amazing ride.
I am interested to hear how you are all getting on with your idler pulleys cause I am not.

After originaly setting up the bike I was dropping chains after hits and going through rough corners, I fixed it by ensuring my chainline was spot on. I went through about 3-4 months of fairly hassle free riding till last week my chain and idler pulley jammed, then proceeded to jam 3 times in 1 ride. This is a crap feeling well you are comitted to a line and go to drop a pedal only to find you drivechain has seized up.

Damaged side plate
Circle Still life photography Household hardware Silver Cylinder


Damaged teeth which I think makes this pulley unusable
Brown Metal Photography Natural material Circle


So back to the drawing board and stripping down the drive chain again. The new style of roller just arrives with some other parts, so I am stoked. But after installing I notice some funky chainline action, this is only when pedaling. When I back spin the chain line straightens out perfectly.

This is how my chain line looks running on the 34t front ring and middle cog on the rear casette. This is how it runs when I use the original pulley and if I use the new style after back pedaling.
Wood Automotive tire Bicycle part Hardwood Bicycle tire


This is what happens after one rotation of pedaling with the new roller in the same set up as above. The chain only runs straight from the front ring to the casette if I am in the lower 3 cogs. As soon as I chain up 1 more gear it looks like this.
Hardwood Wood flooring Laminate flooring Machine Wood stain
 

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is the pulley now moving to follow the natural path of the chain when it is in those larger cogs? Does this happen while riding or does it remedy itself when tension is applied to the chain by pedaling? It should float back and forth obviously but not to the point where it causes rubbing or chain loss issues. Try flipping the pulley around on the axle just to see if maybe one of the bearings is not set flush and inspect the axle itself to make sure it isn't bent from all of that jamming you were getting. In the end call Corsair, they are helpful and knowledgeable.
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I decided to try the spare original roller since the chain line issue seemed odd to me and I figured I was doing pretty well with the original. While I was at it I removed another spacer from my BB thinking my chainline couldnt have been perfect or the new roller would have run true. Its a flat roller so shouldnt be dictating the chain line all that much. This is how the new roller looked after 1 ride.

Metal Silver Aluminium Household hardware Still life photography


This is what happened after removing the new roller and attempting to complete 1 ride on the original roller.

Black Computer accessory Circle Plastic Input device


I flipped the bike to try look for other clues and noticed that judging from below, my original BB spacing would have given me the best chain line and the new roller was just throwing me off. I think 2x2mm spacers or 1x2mm and 1x1mm spacer is the best setup on the drive side. This gives a straight chainline and just enough clearance between the granny ring and chain guide, no washers behind the stinger. This is how it looks with
1x2mm spacer running 34t front and middle on the casette, hard to see but there is a bit of a kick in the chain. No major but if I want to switch to single up front then using the biggest cog would become more of an issue. I will be adding a 1mm spacer on the drive side.

Wood Hardwood Tread Gas Wood stain


I think I have been really patient and put alot of effort into getting this bike working and while I hate maintenance I am prepared to work this out. I am frustrated to be in Korea where I have to import parts and weight 1-2 weeks. I have a bike that I am struggling to keep running and have no real option to sell it and get something more durable. Like I said I am prepared to try and work this out so any tips would be great. I bought htis as a bike which can cover some all mountain rides with a granny ring and front mech but I was even prepared to run single up front to reduce any chances of dropping a chain. I dont see how that will help with the idler issue since I stay in the middle of the casette on the runs where I have destroyed all my pulleys. I am emailing Corsair today with the same pics and info and if I get some updates I will post it up.
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
GearTech said:
is the pulley now moving to follow the natural path of the chain when it is in those larger cogs? Does this happen while riding or does it remedy itself when tension is applied to the chain by pedaling? It should float back and forth obviously but not to the point where it causes rubbing or chain loss issues. Try flipping the pulley around on the axle just to see if maybe one of the bearings is not set flush and inspect the axle itself to make sure it isn't bent from all of that jamming you were getting. In the end call Corsair, they are helpful and knowledgeable.
The original style pulles dont seem to float perfectly under pedaling but I have found they set themsleves to the correct position fairly well. I am amazed that there is enough space between the tunnel and the pulley for any chance of the chain lifting up and jamming. The funky chainline is only with the new roller. The pic I posted shows a straight chainline with the original pulley when pedaling and with the new roller only when back pedaling. The pic of the crap chain line between the front ring and the pulley is with the new roller installed, when pedalling and in the middle of the rear casette.
 

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maker of trail
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I don't know, but my gut tells me that the original idler set up should be the better solution, there is a lot of stress on that pulley since it sees direct chain tension, esp if you pedal a lot and I just don't see that roller lasting long at all (as your picture shows).

I'd say the original pulley is essentially a disposable item and should probably just be replaced regularly, kinda like brake pads.

Buy a couple spares and run with that, esp if it worked properly for 3-4months.

I also think that the pulley/idler is simply too small a diameter and will always wear very quickly, probably why the other idlers you see are quite a bit bigger, see the jedi for example.
 

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moaaar shimz
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I think the dudes back at Corsair need to go back to the drawing board. I've seen this issue in more than 1 Corsair (especially the need to clean/lube/maintain the pulley after every ride or so).

Definitely the cog needs to have a bearing, but the bearing should have some sort of slick friction free interface with the axle to avoid excessive wear and especially to avoid chain line issues. Finally it should have some o-rings at the sides to clean the axle as it is moving and avoid excessive interface wear out.

The floating pulley design is the same as in the RaceFace Atlas chainguide only that it uses a cog instead of a roller...

 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
essenmeinstuff said:
I don't know, but my gut tells me that the original idler set up should be the better solution, there is a lot of stress on that pulley since it sees direct chain tension, esp if you pedal a lot and I just don't see that roller lasting long at all (as your picture shows).

I'd say the original pulley is essentially a disposable item and should probably just be replaced regularly, kinda like brake pads.

Buy a couple spares and run with that, esp if it worked properly for 3-4months.

I also think that the pulley/idler is simply too small a diameter and will always wear very quickly, probably why the other idlers you see are quite a bit bigger, see the jedi for example.
I hear you on disposable but I get like 6 months from my brake pads. I got 4 months from 1 pulley and 1 day from the other. Thats not disposable to me and being in Korea I cant go down to the LBS and pick up another like I can with brake pads. One of the worst things about the chain getting jammed up is that it seizes the whole drive chain, this kinda sucks when you belting down the trail, go into a corner and try drop the outside pedal only to find you cant. Its gotten to the point that its starting to mess with my head when I ride and I am focusing on whats happening down there instead of whats ahead and what I need to do. The positive aspect to the new roller is I dont think the chain can get stuck.
Last night I got home after nailing a new perfect drop off and pinning every part of the trail and because of the brand new idler getting damaged I actualy felt negative. I should of been full of stoke:madmax:
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
madafaka said:
Just get a Knolly:thumbsup:
You have no idea about my regrets:skep:
If I could sell this frame I would and pick the DT in a heart beat. I dont think I could give this frame away in Korea and being a large makes it harder for all the shorter Asian riders. I am then stuck with a 83mm BB and 150mm rear wheel I cant use on a DT. When the bike is running its a wicked wicked ride and I just have to try make this work.
All said and done I was swaying to a Rune as a better match to the Maelstrom and due to the overlap between the DT and Maelstrom but now I have to reconsider since I dont know the future of the Maelstrom.
I really feel like I have be conned with this bike.:madmax:
 

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bike rider
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Can it be run without a pulley? Obviously this will make it pedal like a high, single pivot but at least it will pedal.
 

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GUIDANCE COUNSELOR
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madafaka said:
Just get a Knolly:thumbsup:
Haha. My thoughts too.

I've heard the Corsairs work great when they are working, but I've seen the same issue. There was a guy at a race I did this fall whose Corsair locked up whilst he was pinning it and he endoed hard - broken hand.

I would be pissed if I had to fuss with that pulley - and more pissed if it took me months to dial in suspension. I could put a Rock Shox Ario on one of my Knollys and it would still kick arse.
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
NoahColorado said:
Haha. My thoughts too.

I've heard the Corsairs work great when they are working, but I've seen the same issue. There was a guy at a race I did this fall whose Corsair locked up whilst he was pinning it and he endoed hard - broken hand.

I would be pissed if I had to fuss with that pulley - and more pissed if it took me months to dial in suspension. I could put a Rock Shox Ario on one of my Knollys and it would still kick arse.
Okay now you really making me mad. But still I just gotta try work through this. I am putting a photo report together and will send to Chris at DnZ and Corsair. Chris has been super helpful and patient so we will see what happens. That raw 2010 DT is killer. I have enough parts to build up another bike but I was planning on a 160mm fork, which I now have with the other goodies, to make the DT/Rune an AM/Trail ripper to match the Maelstrom.
I keep reading the DT performs best with a 180mm fork but I dont want ot go that route till I know I have lucked out on the Maelstrom. Funny thing is I feel I could cover all bases with the DT with 2 forks and it seems to me it would last as long and I need. Maybe paired up with a hardtail or my Wildcard to more DJ stuff. Time will tell.
What the hell are all these riders supposed to do with their Corsairs now?
 

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bike rider
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Search the RideMonkey DH forum for the Corsair thread. The guy who started it loves his and might know how to help.
 

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Lelandjt said:
Search the RideMonkey DH forum for the Corsair thread. The guy who started it loves his and might know how to help.
You may be referring to me. I always ran mine in a 1x9 setup and had the old pulley when I owned it. I had the chain jam on me only once during the 6 months that I owned it. If someone is looking for a low maintenance simple design I would not recommend the Maelstrom unfortunately. Too much going on with the linkage and idler pulley design. That being said, if someone is looking for an amazing performer and is willing to put up with some maintenance the Maelstrom would be at or near the top of the list. I didn't think the suspension was all that difficult to dial in actually.

Now, this thing that JP has going on with the wandering pulley is unique and should be addressed by Corsair. It is really unfortunate that JP is in Korea and has to wait so long for replacement parts.

JP, maybe we should try out one of these Knollys...I've got a 170mm Lyrik DH Solo Air sitting here that would match perfectly with the new Delirium...:D

Keep us updated on this JP.
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Geartech, I can actually see the finished build of my DT, I have a fork, brand new set of Spank wheels, wont tell you the color till the build is complete, which I was thinking of using but decided to store them to keep them fresh. I have three bikes so while I dont like too much maintenance I am getting used to it. I keep all my bikes super clean in order to keep them running smooth but since the Maelstrom I cant believe how little I actualy have to do to the hardtail and Wildcard. Thinking back it was really changing tires, setting brakes, minor stuff really.
This Maelstrom is another can of worms and while maintenance is acceptable a seized up drive chain on a comitted line is asking for an injury.
Err's Rune is making it a tough call but going though this idler issue and then having the Rune with bushings which require chaing out etc I am realling thinking the DT might be the winner. Since the DT can step up to the plate if the Maelstrom really does die is another motivating factor. All I need is a huge discount on the frame.
 

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Roll on Spring Time!
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I think Scrublover was playing with one on his new Marque, not much updates from him. I dont have access to many DH orientated parts here so I am hoping for some feedback so I can makes some plans. Judging from the wear on the new roller I am not sure how long a chain guide roller will last. As a guide roller I dont think it will take the same amount of abuse as it will with all the power transfer from the cranks when its mounted as an idler.
I created a detailed report and sent it to DnZ and Corsair this morning so I hope to hear back from them soon.
 
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