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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Long time Rider... Grew up in coil suspension just prefer the feel and simplicity.

Have had one of every Manitou almost since 1999 and the two forks i love the most is Travis and coil Nixon..

Recently made a taper steeerer to run a Travis on my trail bike and beside the weight problem the ride is amazing!

Before it i was running a mattoc boost comp, decent fork but no Travis lol... Got me thinking

Tunability if the abs damper and hydro bottom out, seems like a great candidate for a coil conversion and save a little weight over my Travis.


I think i read at one point dougal had a coil in his mattoc, just looking for some advice on potentially swapping mine too coil..
 

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Long time Rider... Grew up in coil suspension just prefer the feel and simplicity.

Have had one of every Manitou almost since 1999 and the two forks i love the most is Travis and coil Nixon..

Recently made a taper steeerer to run a Travis on my trail bike and beside the weight problem the ride is amazing!

Before it i was running a mattoc boost comp, decent fork but no Travis lol... Got me thinking

Tunability if the abs damper and hydro bottom out, seems like a great candidate for a coil conversion and save a little weight over my Travis.

I think i read at one point dougal had a coil in his mattoc, just looking for some advice on potentially swapping mine too coil..
Interesting you mention the Travis. I've got a plan to put a taper steerer in one also. I've got the parts here to build a SC203!

I have run coil in a Mattoc Pro. The Comp however has smaller ID stanchions which may cause you issues. I used Manitou Nixon coil springs with custom adapters each end and removed the seal from the piston. But I had two issues, which were related.
Firstly I couldn't get the last 10-15mm travel.
Secondly I kept yielding the springs. They kept getting shorter.

But you're in luck for coil selection. Just last week I finally stock taked and cataloged all our New-Old-Stock Manitou Coil springs. They're listed by length, diameter and rate: https://www.shockcraft.co.nz/manitou-hayes/fork-parts/coil-spring-parts
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Awesome to hear from you dougal.

I love love love my Travis... Also have a 203dc on my dh bike that i have spent a few seasons getting the school stack tune dialed and it rides amazing in all conditions.

I think i might need some springs from you, how did you get the rates?

I have been going through my Travis collection trying to figure out the springs rates using this calculator

Suspension Spring Rate Calculator

But then seem to come out a lot softer then yours.

I imagine Nixon spring would fit the comp considering it's a 32 mm stanchion.

I guess i needed to take my fork alert and measure, any pictures of the adapters you made for the spring...

I assume once i go spring that's it cause i am sure a air piston won't seal again

What did the mattoc ride like with the coil?
 

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Awesome to hear from you dougal.

I love love love my Travis... Also have a 203dc on my dh bike that i have spent a few seasons getting the school stack tune dialed and it rides amazing in all conditions.

I think i might need some springs from you, how did you get the rates?

I have been going through my Travis collection trying to figure out the springs rates using this calculator

Suspension Spring Rate Calculator

But then seem to come out a lot softer then yours.

I imagine Nixon spring would fit the comp considering it's a 32 mm stanchion.

I guess i needed to take my fork alert and measure, any pictures of the adapters you made for the spring...

I assume once i go spring that's it cause i am sure a air piston won't seal again

What did the mattoc ride like with the coil?
I've had a 150SC and 180DC (modded to 200mm) for ages but never ridden them much. I had both on a Turner 6 pack but ended up riding my coil Nixon more than anything else.

We've got a brand new DC203 in box here too. Sold it's mate early last year.

I just ran the same rear shock spring through my calculator and the RSP one. Got 465lb/in for mine and 461 lb/in from their one. So I'm happy with that. Coil is rated at 450lb/in but I'm measuring the powdercoating thickness too.

I use my calculator to rate all the coil springs on my site. They're difficult to rate with tapering end coils etc, so probably within 10% of actual rate.

I had no problems going from air to spring and back again. But I used heat-shrink bands and grease on the spring so there was no scratching of the stanchion.

Mattoc rode fantastic with the coil. They were a bit softer than ideal but provided amazing small bump sensitivity and great mid-stroke support.

The spacers were just acetal rods turned to spigot the spring and seat on the piston and into the top-cap.
 

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I was hoping you'd say "tried a Mattoc with the spring and didn't notice much improvement."

Sounds like maybe even a Mezzer could benefit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Dougal

What exact Nixon spring did you run in it?

Why do you think the spring kept getting shorter? Think maybe the diameter was to small and to much side way difflection?

I have some questions about how you converted Travis to longer travel but maybe that's a tough for a new thread.
 

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Dougal

What exact Nixon spring did you run in it?

Why do you think the spring kept getting shorter? Think maybe the diameter was to small and to much side way difflection?

I have some questions about how you converted Travis to longer travel but maybe that's a tough for a new thread.
83-3221 Nixon 07 W/D Soft 160mm: https://www.shockcraft.co.nz/nixon-2007-soft-ride-kit-160mm-w-d-manitou.html

The spring was being over-compressed. This was yielding it and gradually shortening the length by a few mm every month.

The DC180mm travis extension is easy, take out the 20mm bottom-out spacer block and slide the tubes 20mm further down in the crowns.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Gotcha, so a firmer spring would prevent the compressing? I don't know what you weigh but soft seems soft haha

Is the wd mean wind down? I was browsing through your springs and i am looking for a nixon 160 rtwd firm spring for my nixon.
 

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Gotcha, so a firmer spring would prevent the compressing? I don't know what you weigh but soft seems soft haha

Is the wd mean wind down? I was browsing through your springs and i am looking for a nixon 160 rtwd firm spring for my nixon.
One of the reasons I went softer was more space in the coils and less stress. Here's the firm and yes WD is Wind-Down for the RTWD system. The WD springs have D shaped end-coils so the top-cap can turn the spring and the WD system on the compression rod:

https://www.shockcraft.co.nz/nixon-elite-06-07-firm-ride-kit-w-d-manitou.html

I'll pull these out and get some approximate spring-rates. There was also the 10lb/in booster spring which fits inside the main spring if you need to split rates.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Hey dougal, just wondering what you did for a top out spring?

Did you keep the rubber in there or swap to a actual spring?

I have test fitted a spring in mine that i had, firs perfect between the air piston and the top cap!

You think the top cap is up to the task of keeping a spring in?
 

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Hey dougal, just wondering what you did for a top out spring?

Did you keep the rubber in there or swap to a actual spring?

I have test fitted a spring in mine that i had, firs perfect between the air piston and the top cap!

You think the top cap is up to the task of keeping a spring in?
The standard top-out bumper worked fine. Yes the top-cap is up to the task. My adaption had a plastic seat spreading the load onto the cap.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yes i am planning a plastic shim for the top as well that would help spread the load.

Did you take the quad ring out of the compression shaft seal head?

I am just trying to make the fork as supple as possible and this is something that can be adding friction.

My Travis has the nice open compression rod nut into the stanchion, sorry to tired to think of the name, and i run about 100cc of 0w20 in the spring side and it feels so good and keeps the spring so lubed, much better then greasing the spring which the grease always makes the semi bath really thick and sticky

Really lengthened my service intervsl to
 

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Yes i am planning a plastic shim for the top as well that would help spread the load.

Did you take the quad ring out of the compression shaft seal head?

I am just trying to make the fork as supple as possible and this is something that can be adding friction.

My Travis has the nice open compression rod nut into the stanchion, sorry to tired to think of the name, and i run about 100cc of 0w20 in the spring side and it feels so good and keeps the spring so lubed, much better then greasing the spring which the grease always makes the semi bath really thick and sticky

Really lengthened my service intervsl to
I left the lower seal in place. Firstly to make it faster to swap between the configurations. Secondly to keep the bath oil away from the grease. I used grease on heat-shrink around the spring, worked great.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hey dougal, got my first ride in tonight finally had some time... It's hard to say coming from my Travis which is like basically heaven on Earth I do have the matocc with the loose bushing problem which is a little distracting

But I was very impressed so far initial ride did have a question I was wondering what spring rate you were riding with if you remember and approximately how much you weigh if you don't mind sharing?

I really don't want to make too many adjustments until I get the bushing sorted out but I was wondering just what the difference spring rates of the coil versus air what kind of damping adjustment so I can make to really bring it to life?

It seems like I may need to add a small shim to the rebound as I did have the adjuster fully closed fully closed!

I did get pretty close the full travel and with the factory hydraulic bottom out, felt just as smooth as silk
 

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Hey dougal, got my first ride in tonight finally had some time... It's hard to say coming from my Travis which is like basically heaven on Earth I do have the matocc with the loose bushing problem which is a little distracting

But I was very impressed so far initial ride did have a question I was wondering what spring rate you were riding with if you remember and approximately how much you weigh if you don't mind sharing?

I really don't want to make too many adjustments until I get the bushing sorted out but I was wondering just what the difference spring rates of the coil versus air what kind of damping adjustment so I can make to really bring it to life?

It seems like I may need to add a small shim to the rebound as I did have the adjuster fully closed fully closed!

I did get pretty close the full travel and with the factory hydraulic bottom out, felt just as smooth as silk
I was running 30lb/in this one: https://www.shockcraft.co.nz/nixon-2007-soft-ride-kit-160mm-w-d-manitou.html

It was softer than ideal but felt amazing. I'm 70-75kg.

How heavy are you? Run through these spring rate calculators: https://www.shockcraft.co.nz/technical-support/calculators-14/bike-spring-rate-calculators

You'd be the first I've found on the full slow of the Mattoc rebound.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I'll have to double check what oil i have in there but might be 2.5 red line.... Maybe going back to 5wt red line will be a little closer to factory cst before i as a shim to rebound

The spring i have feels like it has a lot of energy stored in it by the time you get mid travel...

I did remove the quad ring but i think there is still some temporary sealing from the glide rings?
 

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I'll have to double check what oil i have in there but might be 2.5 red line.... Maybe going back to 5wt red line will be a little closer to factory cst before i as a shim to rebound

The spring i have feels like it has a lot of energy stored in it by the time you get mid travel...

I did remove the quad ring but i think there is still some temporary sealing from the glide rings?
Redline seems to do a great job of corroding shims too.
 
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