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Big Wheel Homer !!
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I thought someone (Mikesee) might know if Devin has a 4" upgrade kit available yet. I know he's busy so I hated to call him. Last time I talked to Devin, a couple of months ago, he told me he should have some complete later in the summer. After riding the Monk with 4.5" travel, I'm very interested now in changing my Leviathan. Anyone?

Steve
 

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Sam
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Please correct the following information if it is wrong. My conversation with Devin was brief and I'm not sure if I followed every thing he said.

It does not look like the 4" conversion for existing 3" Leviathans is going to happen. At least not anytime soon.

The original plan was to replace the seatstay and the rocker to gain another inch of travel.

There are two issues with this:

1) The seatstay hits the disk brake mount, so it looks like you would have to replace the whole rear triangle.

2) The seatstay hits the front derailleur cable stop. Devin is moving it farther up the seattube for the 4" Leviathans.

Again, this info. was from a very brief discussion with Devin and I might not have everything right. Please correct me if I got something wrong.

thanks,

Sam
 

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Big Wheel Homer !!
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
scrat said:
Please correct the following information if it is wrong. My conversation with Devin was brief and I'm not sure if I followed every thing he said.

It does not look like the 4" conversion for existing 3" Leviathans is going to happen. At least not anytime soon.

The original plan was to replace the seatstay and the rocker to gain another inch of travel.

There are two issues with this:

1) The seatstay hits the disk brake mount, so it looks like you would have to replace the whole rear triangle.

2) The seatstay hits the front derailleur cable stop. Devin is moving it farther up the seattube for the 4" Leviathans.

Again, this info. was from a very brief discussion with Devin and I might not have everything right. Please correct me if I got something wrong.

thanks,

Sam
Sam, you may be right. My conversation with Devin a while back was not that in depth. It was just a basic question "is the kit coming" and the answer was"yes, but later". We did not talk about any problems or snags he was encountering trying to retro fit the 3" models. If this is the case I hope he gets it all worked out.

Steve
 

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i can confirm what sam said..

cruzthepug said:
Sam, you may be right. My conversation with Devin a while back was not that in depth. It was just a basic question "is the kit coming" and the answer was"yes, but later". We did not talk about any problems or snags he was encountering trying to retro fit the 3" models. If this is the case I hope he gets it all worked out.

Steve
Thats exactly what devin told me the last time i talked to him. Also that IF the travel upgrade was to be offered for the existing 3" lev version it could cost upwards to a grand and require repositioning the FD stop on the seat tube.
 

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Big Wheel Homer !!
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
jrm said:
Thats exactly what devin told me the last time i talked to him. Also that IF the travel upgrade was to be offered for the existing 3" lev version it could cost upwards to a grand and require repositioning the FD stop on the seat tube.
$1k!:yikes: Sounds like I need to start saving for a new frame.:D

Steve
 

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cruzthepug said:
$1k!:yikes: Sounds like I need to start saving for a new frame.:D

Steve
wow! sounds like 1" of travel makes a huge difference. can you go into any specific detail about the difference you feel between the monk and the lev? where does the lev "let you down"? thanx - i'm close to purchase, so any information would be helpful.
 

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Big Wheel Homer !!
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
starre said:
wow! sounds like 1" of travel makes a huge difference. can you go into any specific detail about the difference you feel between the monk and the lev? where does the lev "let you down"? thanx - i'm close to purchase, so any information would be helpful.
The Leviathan has not let me down in any way, it's just the Monk is very plush. It may not be anything more than the difference in shocks. The Lev. has a RP3 and the Monk a Swinger 3-way. I seem to have to keep the air pressure up in the RP3 so it dosen't "bob" and that takes away from cush. Don't get me wrong, if I had to choose between the two, I would take the Leviathan everytime. I can only imagine what it would ride like with another inch of travel. Maybe I just need to try a different shock on the Leviathan:idea:

On the topic of the Monk, my first few impressions were great. I had it out th other day on some really tight, twisty, rockysingletrack and the Monk isn't quite as nimble as I first thought. This trail has some very quick turns as well as some slow moving techinal, almost trials like, sections. The Monk felt quite sluggish in some of these areas. It was very nice on the rocky downhills but the tight turns got tough. I've ridden the Leviathan on this trail many times with no problems.

Steve
 

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lev rear shock

cruzthepug said:
The Leviathan has not let me down in any way, it's just the Monk is very plush. It may not be anything more than the difference in shocks. The Lev. has a RP3 and the Monk a Swinger 3-way. I seem to have to keep the air pressure up in the RP3 so it dosen't "bob" and that takes away from cush. Don't get me wrong, if I had to choose between the two, I would take the Leviathan everytime. I can only imagine what it would ride like with another inch of travel. Maybe I just need to try a different shock on the Leviathan:idea:

On the topic of the Monk, my first few impressions were great. I had it out th other day on some really tight, twisty, rockysingletrack and the Monk isn't quite as nimble as I first thought. This trail has some very quick turns as well as some slow moving techinal, almost trials like, sections. The Monk felt quite sluggish in some of these areas. It was very nice on the rocky downhills but the tight turns got tough. I've ridden the Leviathan on this trail many times with no problems.

Steve
thanx for your input. seems like the lev is very sensitive to rear shock type and adjustment. i think there were others on the forum who were unhappy with RP3 and 'heavyg' had difficulty tuning out 'bobbing' with the DT shock. the last few months i've seen recommendations for Rock Shox MC 3.3 on the lev.
 

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Sam
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Don't give up hope based on my info. alone.

1) The seatstay hits the disk brake mount, so it looks like you would have to replace the whole rear triangle.

2) The seatstay hits the front derailleur cable stop. Devin is moving it farther up the seattube for the 4" Leviathans.

These were the two issues I listed before.

I'm pretty sure that issue 1) above I got wrong. In looking at my Lev, I don't see how more travel could cause this to happen. Maybe the extra travel causes the calipers to rub the disk. This could potentially be solved by putting some spacers on the caliper, or using a different rotor/caliper combination. Or you could just use V brakes on the rear.

As for the seatstay hitting the front derailleur cable stop. Why not just buy the new rocker from Lenz and hire a frame builder to make you a curved seatstay (to avoid contacting the cable stop) out of steel or titanium?

Regardless, I'd wait for more information (are you out there mikesee??) before writing off a 4" upgrade completely.

cheers,

Sam
 

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I'm bummed about the delay/difficulty/expense that seem likely. I was going to have my marginal RP3 Pushed when I did the 4" kit but now the whole thing seems too expensive. Recently I've been thinking my frame is too big anyway so now I'm considering the Niner Rip although it is a big unknown.
 

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This place needs an enema
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cruzthepug said:
I thought someone (Mikesee) might know if Devin has a 4" upgrade kit available yet. I know he's busy so I hated to call him. Last time I talked to Devin, a couple of months ago, he told me he should have some complete later in the summer. After riding the Monk with 4.5" travel, I'm very interested now in changing my Leviathan. Anyone?

Steve
I've only got a few rides in on it. The 4" kit effectively splits the difference between the 3" Lev and the 5" 'Moth in most areas. Very efficient yet surprisingly plush. Feels closer (in amount of travel) to the 'Moth than the Lev. I need more hours on it to be able to quantify/explain all the differences.

The 4" kit will only be offered on new frames, for the reasons listed elsewhere in this thread (caliper interference and housing stop interference). I know that Devin had hoped/planned to be able to retro the 4" rear onto existing frames, and I know that he worked hard on finding creative ways to solve the interference issues. Ultimately, he was unable to get it to work out.

A few pics of it as ridden around CB all weekend.

MC
 

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Sam
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Mikesee,

Could you post some more pictures of the updated suspension? Also, do you think the seatstay interference issues could be solved with the 4" rocker and a curved steel or titanium seatstay? (for a 3" retrofit)

thanks,
 

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i like how it..

mikesee said:
I've only got a few rides in on it. The 4" kit effectively splits the difference between the 3" Lev and the 5" 'Moth in most areas. Very efficient yet surprisingly plush. Feels closer (in amount of travel) to the 'Moth than the Lev. I need more hours on it to be able to quantify/explain all the differences.

The 4" kit will only be offered on new frames, for the reasons listed elsewhere in this thread (caliper interference and housing stop interference). I know that Devin had hoped/planned to be able to retro the 4" rear onto existing frames, and I know that he worked hard on finding creative ways to solve the interference issues. Ultimately, he was unable to get it to work out.

A few pics of it as ridden around CB all weekend.

MC
steepens the geometry..
 

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This place needs an enema
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scrat said:
Mikesee,

Could you post some more pictures of the updated suspension? Also, do you think the seatstay interference issues could be solved with the 4" rocker and a curved steel or titanium seatstay? (for a 3" retrofit)

thanks,
Those are the only detailed pics I have, and as the bike is out on demo until Friday, there won't be any new ones til at least then.

The interference issues are tiny, and *could* be solved using a curved seatstay. The reason Devin decided to not *force* the issue with adapting the 4" rear to the existing 3" frames was primarily cost. In other words, when it looked like he was going to be able to just retro the control levers (a.k.a. 'rockers') and the seatstay, he was amped because it would have been relatively low cost. But when you add in the cost of a new chainstay (including all of the machining, mitering, and welding, plus heat treatment and anodization) you end up with a whole new rear end and a retail cost of ~$800+. I'm not speaking for Devin, but I sensed that he lost interest in offering a retro kit because it just wouldn't be a good value to his customers.

A few pics attached from the trails that I slogged through in 'testing' the 4" Lev last weekend. The lengths I'll go to help other people out...

MC
 

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