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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I have taken a few hits on the HL (to the d'er) that would have positively smoked an RFX hanger with absolutely no ill side-affects to shifting or the integrity of the frame or components.

DT, can you design a more durable/robust hanger with 150mm spacing vs 135/142 mm spacing. If so, I vote for 150mm spacing. I hate purchasing these hangers at $25 a pop:madman:
 

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You ride like a stud, however you are a total a**hole. Honestly stop smashing into sh*t with your deruiller* into stuff. That will protect your rig. Then shut your mouth via the net. I hope you can read this. I rarely have negative things to say on here. You my friend need to (mafia style) disappear. Please do. I don't get or understand what your after, go away.
Thanks MTBR for letting me have a voice in this matter.
Scottay
 

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Why the need for a more durable/robust hanger? Its entire purpose is to be weaker than the dropout so it breaks away during a derailleur strike. To make it more durable would only increase the potential for damage to the dropout. I can understand your frustration at having to spend $25 a pop to replace a broken hanger, but its a lot easier pill to swallow than $500 for a new rear end.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
polandspring88 said:
Why the need for a more durable/robust hanger? Its entire purpose is to be weaker than the dropout so it breaks away during a derailleur strike. To make it more durable would only increase the potential for damage to the dropout. I can understand your frustration at having to spend $25 a pop to replace a broken hanger, but its a lot easier pill to swallow than $500 for a new rear end.
I'm not saying make it out of stainless steel:madman:

I'll repeat it'

I have taken quite a few hits on the HL to the d'er with no ill effects (meaning I did not bend the d'er hanger nor did my d'er fail). Nor was there any structural damage to the frame. I would almost rather toast a d'er than have to fork out $$$ on a hanger. SRAM is awesome about warranties these days.:thumbsup:

I'm positive than many of those strikes would have killed one of the hangers from my 2006 RFX. That being said, I was wondering if a more robust hanger requires more clearance. If so, then I vote that Dave should consider going 150 on the RFX.
 

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here you go

Mtn. Biker123 said:
I'm not saying make it out of stainless steel:madman:

I'll repeat it'

I have taken quite a few hits on the HL to the d'er with no ill effects (meaning I did not bend the d'er hanger nor did my d'er fail). Nor was there any structural damage to the frame. I would almost rather toast a d'er than have to fork out $$$ on a hanger. SRAM is awesome about warranties these days.:thumbsup:

I'm positive than many of those strikes would have killed one of the hangers from my 2006 RFX. That being said, I was wondering if a more robust hanger requires more clearance. If so, then I vote that Dave should consider going 150 on the RFX.
now can we close this thread?
 

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Dusty Bottoms said:
The lack of a hanger on my Highline has worked flawlessly since day one. Such a damn shame that Shimano stopped making axle mounted Saint derailleurs.
Yes!, just finished replacing the der & hanger on the Sultan for the 2nd time, I'd run one again if I could find a H normal version.

I think I fried 4 or 5 der/hangers on the RFX till I switched, for sure the weak link on todays MB's.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
rroeder said:
Yes!, just finished replacing the der & hanger on the Sultan for the 2nd time, I'd run one again if I could find a H normal version.

I think I fried 4 or 5 der/hangers on the RFX till I switched, for sure the weak link on todays MB's.
Nice.

I recall those D'ers.

However, no one has answered the question. Does spacing play a role in the how "durable" a d'er hanger can be? What is the best engineered replaceable hanger among the 5-6" travel bikes that are available these days. Who's got the best setup...in your guys opinions?
 

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Mtn. Biker123 said:
I'm not saying make it out of stainless steel:madman:

I'll repeat it'

I have taken quite a few hits on the HL to the d'er with no ill effects (meaning I did not bend the d'er hanger nor did my d'er fail). Nor was there any structural damage to the frame. I would almost rather toast a d'er than have to fork out $$$ on a hanger. SRAM is awesome about warranties these days.:thumbsup:

I'm positive than many of those strikes would have killed one of the hangers from my 2006 RFX. That being said, I was wondering if a more robust hanger requires more clearance. If so, then I vote that Dave should consider going 150 on the RFX.
You need to try reading sometime. It helps you not look like an idiot when replying to posts. Your RFX is not a highline. The above poster mentioned that your RFX hanger was designed with the strength of the rear triangle in mind. He tried to articulate to you that a stronger hanger could damage the rear end. To put it as clear as day... the highline hanger is stronger because the highline is a heavier and more durable bike... you cannot expect the same from your RFX.

Your highland can stand more abuse, and there fore the hanger can impart a bit more force on the dropouts which might otherwise damage a trail-purpose frame.
 

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Do you even bother to think through what you're asking before you ask it? To put it succinctly, correlation is not causation.

The reason 150mm rear end spacing exists is to allow for stronger (dishless) wheels. If you're regularly damaging derailleur hangers, you may want to think about not crashing into $hit so much.
 

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2TurnersNotEnough said:
If you're regularly damaging derailleur hangers, you may want to think about not crashing into $hit so much.
I think it's more about the type of terrain you ride or what type of riding you do, I very rarely damaged the der/hanger from a crash, more like hitting rocks in tight chunky cond's. Never damaged a der/hanger on a shuttle ride or resort riding, always on a few of our local chunkfest trail rides.

I just fried a der/hanger on the Sultan as I was literally JRA, didn't hit anything, no shifting but somehow the chain got behind the cass and BAM!, the rear end exploded including my chainstay.
 

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I have to agree with ProCore here, I actually tried to get DT to make a Highline type hanger for the RFX when I had one, makes sense IMO, even on trail bikes like the Sultan or Spot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Please elaborate.

2TurnersNotEnough said:
Do you even bother to think through what you're asking before you ask it? To put it succinctly, correlation is not causation.

The reason 150mm rear end spacing exists is to allow for stronger (dishless) wheels. If you're regularly damaging derailleur hangers, you may want to think about not crashing into $hit so much.
Correlation is not causation? IMO, in this case it is.

On the HL, I really like the way the hanger is integrated into the TA bolt. This helps in my opinion to give the d'er more rigidity by allowing for more material. Yet it looks like it would still "break-away" under extreme impacts and other potential forces (if lighter material was utilized). I believe spacing does indeed have a lot to do with the amount of material that can be utilized, sensibly, within the tolerances of the existing TA's that are available and the type drop outs that are required for the Syntace (proprietary). You can go "custom" with factory TA's on 135/150. So, I would suggest 150 spacing based on my experiences with the HL.

Let me remind you also that I ride fairly agro. Hitting sh!t with that big a$$ bulky drivetrain is a given. What is the best system that both provides protection for the frame, but is not so inferior that "love taps" won't cause catastrophic failure?
 

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hanging out

wider spaced rears will hit more rocks than 135 type, so the hanger has to be tougher for sure, and unless it is old school Saint derailers will suffer more with the wider rears. Too bad Shimano bailed on the Saint axle ending derailer, seemed like a good thing to me and the Highline and DHR capitalized well on the engagement. But few on DHs would run them as they are heavy and the rest of the OE world did not buy into them. To cool too soon I guess, in a few years when even XC bikes have thru axles (12x142) then the original Saint thing will not seem so far out.

And as so well put by NWFreeride the RFX is no, never was and never will replace the Highline. IF a Highline hanger ever becomes un-useable I am sorry. My intent was to make that the toughest most rock mashing mo-fo I ever designed, and it is attached to an axle lug that can take a hella beating.
 

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Mtn. Biker123 said:
Correlation is not causation? IMO, in this case it is.

On the HL, I really like the way the hanger is integrated into the TA bolt. This helps in my opinion to give the d'er more rigidity by allowing for more material. Yet it looks like it would still "break-away" under extreme impacts and other potential forces (if lighter material was utilized). I believe spacing does indeed have a lot to do with the amount of material that can be utilized, sensibly, within the tolerances of the existing TA's that are available and the type drop outs that are required for the Syntace (proprietary). You can go "custom" with factory TA's on 135/150. So, I would suggest 150 spacing based on my experiences with the HL.

Let me remind you also that I ride fairly agro. Hitting sh!t with that big a$$ bulky drivetrain is a given. What is the best system that both provides protection for the frame, but is not so inferior that "love taps" won't cause catastrophic failure?
So do you mean that by "riding aggro" that you don't know how to pick a line that doesn't involve whacking the rear of your bike into things?

Dropout/hanger design still has nothing to do with the spacing between the dropouts for the wheel. If a TA design with a longer axle to support a beefier hanger interface is necessary, I'm not sure why a 135mm spaced rear end would make a difference.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
2TurnersNotEnough said:
So do you mean that by "riding aggro" that you don't know how to pick a line that doesn't involve whacking the rear of your bike into things?
It's not that I don't know how, it's that I take more risk.

Thanks Dave for the information.

In your opinion what design on the market does the best job of protecting the frame, while maintaining the most integrity in terms of the amount of force that is required for it to fail? Can you design a more durable hanger for the DW RFX with the Syntace system vs an in-house TA setup?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
jncarpenter said:
There's always THIS option if you have threaded axles...tho you risk trashing the derailler and/ or axle when something gives.
You also have the added benefit of paying Specialized for the patent license :D
I liked everything except the last part...JK:p

I don't mind paying Spez for products that I assume they have designed themselves. I say assume because I'm sure they do steal ideas and beat people to the patent office, but I also know they have their own designers/engineers in-house.

Looks like a good product.:thumbsup:
 
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