Lack of stoke on new DW Link?
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12,942 Posts
consider me gushing on the inside after my proto demo rides. just waitin on the rfx. unworldly? nope. otherworldly? id say so. besides not likein the shorter travel spot platform as much, i was blown away by much of its behaviour. jnc may have a word or 2 about his sultan soon.
yer right though. its been kinda quiet so far which may have alot to do with availability and the winter season.
yer right though. its been kinda quiet so far which may have alot to do with availability and the winter season.
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7,018 Posts
Yup, any comments at this point would simply find me gushing. I'll reserve my collective thoughts until I have had ample time to fairly evaluate (I have 2.5 years on the tnt sultan)...however, there is just no comparison to Sultan v.1.
Sultan v.2 is heads & shoulders above v.1...yes, it is that dramatic a difference (this sums it up...no need to read further!).
Here are a couple stand out characteristics:
-V.2 feels bottomless in it's travel...nearly the complete opposite of v.1
-I have been riding mine with 40% sag and the traction seems incredible on most rough chop...yet no bottomout issues (yet). High speed choppy corners are just amazing...no hopping in the rear at all...just stays glued.
-V.2 lateral stiffness is so much better is is literal comical (I lol'd
)
It's real soon to weigh in with a verdict since durability is a major consideration & I have only a few rides...but the performance advantages alone on the new design are staggering. Keep in mind that the new sultan did add nearly an inch of travel & I am sure this is helping a bit, but this is truly a bike you need to test ride to appreciate.
...now if you're interested in a TNT Sultan in large, I might be able to help you out!
Sultan v.2 is heads & shoulders above v.1...yes, it is that dramatic a difference (this sums it up...no need to read further!).
Here are a couple stand out characteristics:
-V.2 feels bottomless in it's travel...nearly the complete opposite of v.1
-I have been riding mine with 40% sag and the traction seems incredible on most rough chop...yet no bottomout issues (yet). High speed choppy corners are just amazing...no hopping in the rear at all...just stays glued.
-V.2 lateral stiffness is so much better is is literal comical (I lol'd
)It's real soon to weigh in with a verdict since durability is a major consideration & I have only a few rides...but the performance advantages alone on the new design are staggering. Keep in mind that the new sultan did add nearly an inch of travel & I am sure this is helping a bit, but this is truly a bike you need to test ride to appreciate.
...now if you're interested in a TNT Sultan in large, I might be able to help you out!
Joined
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2,814 Posts
True
I've been riding my HL Spot for 5 years and it's the best 5-5.5" bike I've ridden and I'm very use to how it handles everything. I rode the DW spot in 2 different sizes at 2 different demos. To me fit and handling are very much the same, the DW advantages are that it's not as bothered by poor peddling technique, It seemed to jump out of corners and it has better standover. The HL advantages are that its a bit lighter, seems less bothered by chaingrowth (very little on either) and I ALLREADY OWN IT AND I GET TO KEEP MY $2400 .
I allso have ridden the old Sultan (my only TNT experience and just a Demo) and the new Sultan and in that comparison the DW version won hands down; I'd definitly go DW for the 29r.
If I were still riding my old cannondale and Turner offered both for the same $$$ I'd buy the DW Spot, but if the HL bike was last years price I'd go with it.
I've been riding my HL Spot for 5 years and it's the best 5-5.5" bike I've ridden and I'm very use to how it handles everything. I rode the DW spot in 2 different sizes at 2 different demos. To me fit and handling are very much the same, the DW advantages are that it's not as bothered by poor peddling technique, It seemed to jump out of corners and it has better standover. The HL advantages are that its a bit lighter, seems less bothered by chaingrowth (very little on either) and I ALLREADY OWN IT AND I GET TO KEEP MY $2400
.I allso have ridden the old Sultan (my only TNT experience and just a Demo) and the new Sultan and in that comparison the DW version won hands down; I'd definitly go DW for the 29r.
If I were still riding my old cannondale and Turner offered both for the same $$$ I'd buy the DW Spot, but if the HL bike was last years price I'd go with it.
Joined
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10,843 Posts
My DW Turner gush:
Climbs great, plush, stiff, no bob
Please keep in mind that I've yet to ride one....
Climbs great, plush, stiff, no bob
Please keep in mind that I've yet to ride one....
Gushgushgushgushgushgushgushgushgush
For the limited number of posts, reviews, commentary, and interviews by people that have actually ridden the new bikes, i haven't heard a single negative comment about the ride. On the contrary, the majority of reviews have been gushing about noticeable improvements in suspension quality. I imagine over the next couple months we'll see some more public reviews in magazines and online...and more Homer-reviews as snow clears and production ramps up.
For the limited number of posts, reviews, commentary, and interviews by people that have actually ridden the new bikes, i haven't heard a single negative comment about the ride. On the contrary, the majority of reviews have been gushing about noticeable improvements in suspension quality. I imagine over the next couple months we'll see some more public reviews in magazines and online...and more Homer-reviews as snow clears and production ramps up.
Joined
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3,370 Posts
I've been on a HL Spot for about 3 years, and a TNT HL for about a year.
A few weeks ago, I took a DW Spot from the factory for a demo week and got 5 rides in. The new design is JUST BETTER. That's all I kept saying to myself over and over during every ride. "It just feels better, it just feels better, it just feels better."
To quantify that, I mean that small to medium trail features are just "soaked up" far better. Much less hang up on each feature sets you up better for the next feature. Far less vibration resonates to the rider which results in much quieter, much more enjoyable riding experience.
The abililty to run about 30-40psi LESS than older models is also an immediately noticeable. The frame hits it's sag point with less resistance, soaks up bumps, and the linkage design then ramps up providing a bottomless feel.
The new rear end is far stiffer laterally, and the elevated chainstays contribute further to a quiet ride. All of the qualities that help forge the Turner brand are still present...the fit and finish, the welds, the grease fittings, the snappy geometry, and of course the customer service.
I mentioned previously that I'd comment on my feelings when I jumped back on my HL Spot. My feelings were....disappointment. It just doesn't comply to bumps in the same manner.
And that concludes this week's edition of the DW Turner 5spot infommercial. Who knew I'd be towing the company line like this! It feels weird but the product deserves the praise. It's just a better design.
A few weeks ago, I took a DW Spot from the factory for a demo week and got 5 rides in. The new design is JUST BETTER. That's all I kept saying to myself over and over during every ride. "It just feels better, it just feels better, it just feels better."
To quantify that, I mean that small to medium trail features are just "soaked up" far better. Much less hang up on each feature sets you up better for the next feature. Far less vibration resonates to the rider which results in much quieter, much more enjoyable riding experience.
The abililty to run about 30-40psi LESS than older models is also an immediately noticeable. The frame hits it's sag point with less resistance, soaks up bumps, and the linkage design then ramps up providing a bottomless feel.
The new rear end is far stiffer laterally, and the elevated chainstays contribute further to a quiet ride. All of the qualities that help forge the Turner brand are still present...the fit and finish, the welds, the grease fittings, the snappy geometry, and of course the customer service.
I mentioned previously that I'd comment on my feelings when I jumped back on my HL Spot. My feelings were....disappointment. It just doesn't comply to bumps in the same manner.
And that concludes this week's edition of the DW Turner 5spot infommercial. Who knew I'd be towing the company line like this! It feels weird but the product deserves the praise. It's just a better design.
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2,667 Posts
Troll or bored?
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=477708
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=478557
Our conclusion was that the 09 is a better bike than both 05 and 08, most notably when climbing and under acceleration. It still feels very much like a Turner in every other respect and the frame is beautifully made,
This bike rides really well. My first impression is that it is an improvement from the original Sultan. I had no complaints about the original but was wanting a little more travel and the new suspension was an added bonus to me. I think the DW link works really well. It was very smooth when seated and pedaling in the rough flat areas. When climbing I felt a definate stiffness in the pedal stroke but the suspension was very complient (pedaling definately separate from the suspension action).
This frame is very stiff. I am not a superclyde but with my weight, (~225 lbs with bike costume) I did not notice any lateral frame flex what so ever. The linkage and rearend definately look more substantial when lookin down while riding.
I did not notice the added .7" of travel (compliment). I am certain it was working and was getting full travel out of my rear shock. In the rough downhill sections it worked great. Nice feel (I need to play with rebound) on both the shock and fork.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=474010
2 Weeks Ago #11
JTBAZ
mtbr member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 724 I have owned Horst link and TNT Spots; and now I own a DW Spot. The Spot handles the rough stuff incredibly well. I have noticed rough sections of trail are smoother to ride through on my DW Spot. The suspension is smooth and plush. You can mash on the pedals and there is no noticeable or very little movement of the rear suspsension. It is incredibly stiff. It also maintains that classic Turner balanced feel. I would recommend it for the type of riding you described - you will not be disappointted.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=474501
Copenhagen
mtbr member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 21 First impression
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alright, I spend +3 hrs on the new 09 Flux today. The bike is a freaking rocket. Turner has a hit here. The bike really impressed me on the climbs. Lots of traction both while seated and while standing. I was positively surprised by being able to clear steep rocky and root filled sections while standing. My old bike - a 2002 Trek Fuel (.. yeah, I know) never had traction out of the saddle in those areas.
Descending is awesome. The Flux is very confidence inspiring and comfortable. I felt, I could go downhill much faster that I used to and it didn't feel sketchy (credit to the tires too, I guess).
On the trails I rode it with propedal set to 1 and OFF, which seemed to work well. With rear sag set to ~30 percent the bike feels really soft when you initially sit on it but at the same time it pedals great and bob is not noticeable on the trail. The combination of the soft feel and the great pedaling is almost a little freaky the first time you experience it (I had the same experience on a Pivot Mach 5 that I demoed). I flipped the propedal ON (still in position 1) for a couple of section on pavement. That almost gave the rear a locked out feel so that worked well for the road and might work well for extended smooth climbs too.
Yeah, they suck and they are soooo expensive, I mean who the fokk would buy a full XT Turner for $4700 when you could have an imported frame and similar parts for the same price.
DT
edit!
Having come off of an Ibis Mojo, I can say that the number one difference in ride quality is without a shred of doubt, the STIFFNESS. An Uber Stiff rear end is a nice thing to have. I felt like I was on my Highline on some of the corners. Like riding on rails. Point and shoot. Even when subjected to the venerable parking lot- grab the tire , hold the saddle and pull- test the Spot passes with aplomb. Before I received my Spot Jarret at Turner told me that
this Spot was one of the stiffest frames thatTurner had ever produced. I figured he was hyping up the product. Turns out he was right on.
I ran the rp23 with about 35% (eyeballing) sag, and it seemed to keep up with the z1light just fine. I'm sure Push will be providing a nice upgrade to those who feel like they need it. I did bottom out the rear on couple of drops but I attribute that to poor rider style if anything.
Trail chatter was easily soaked up, it really feels like it has more than 5.5" of travel. I weigh 210 geared up, give or take a couple of burritos, and ran about 160 lbs of pressure in the large volume rp23 can.
On a section of trail that was downhill but littered with baseball sized mini baby heads, I purposely stayed seated just to feel the ride. The spot has a very smooth suspension path. It was so easy to just relax and let the bike do all the work.
I did notice on two occasions, a slight almost imperceptible pedal kick when climbing the rough in the granny gear. Not as pronounced as I've experienced on VPP bikes like the Intense 5.5 or 6.6, but still there. Not sure if its right to call it a pedal kick, maybe like a slight tug. Still, overall the ride quality matches the craftsmanship that Turner is famous for.
When climbing, the DW linkage shines. Really neat to look down and see very little movement, when you expect to see a whole lot of bobbing. This Spot is the perfect synergy of suspension design, frame craftsmanship, and fit. Add in the awesome Customer service and you;ve got a pretty cool thing going.
I think I'm gonna keep this one for a while. I may have to give up my Homer Poseur status this year.
http://www.mtbr.com/mfr/turner/allmtn-full-suspension/5spotdwlink/PRD_425923_1547crx.aspx
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=477708
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=478557
Our conclusion was that the 09 is a better bike than both 05 and 08, most notably when climbing and under acceleration. It still feels very much like a Turner in every other respect and the frame is beautifully made,
This bike rides really well. My first impression is that it is an improvement from the original Sultan. I had no complaints about the original but was wanting a little more travel and the new suspension was an added bonus to me. I think the DW link works really well. It was very smooth when seated and pedaling in the rough flat areas. When climbing I felt a definate stiffness in the pedal stroke but the suspension was very complient (pedaling definately separate from the suspension action).
This frame is very stiff. I am not a superclyde but with my weight, (~225 lbs with bike costume) I did not notice any lateral frame flex what so ever. The linkage and rearend definately look more substantial when lookin down while riding.
I did not notice the added .7" of travel (compliment). I am certain it was working and was getting full travel out of my rear shock. In the rough downhill sections it worked great. Nice feel (I need to play with rebound) on both the shock and fork.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=474010
2 Weeks Ago #11
JTBAZ
mtbr member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 724 I have owned Horst link and TNT Spots; and now I own a DW Spot. The Spot handles the rough stuff incredibly well. I have noticed rough sections of trail are smoother to ride through on my DW Spot. The suspension is smooth and plush. You can mash on the pedals and there is no noticeable or very little movement of the rear suspsension. It is incredibly stiff. It also maintains that classic Turner balanced feel. I would recommend it for the type of riding you described - you will not be disappointted.
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=474501
Copenhagen
mtbr member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 21 First impression
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alright, I spend +3 hrs on the new 09 Flux today. The bike is a freaking rocket. Turner has a hit here. The bike really impressed me on the climbs. Lots of traction both while seated and while standing. I was positively surprised by being able to clear steep rocky and root filled sections while standing. My old bike - a 2002 Trek Fuel (.. yeah, I know) never had traction out of the saddle in those areas.
Descending is awesome. The Flux is very confidence inspiring and comfortable. I felt, I could go downhill much faster that I used to and it didn't feel sketchy (credit to the tires too, I guess).
On the trails I rode it with propedal set to 1 and OFF, which seemed to work well. With rear sag set to ~30 percent the bike feels really soft when you initially sit on it but at the same time it pedals great and bob is not noticeable on the trail. The combination of the soft feel and the great pedaling is almost a little freaky the first time you experience it (I had the same experience on a Pivot Mach 5 that I demoed). I flipped the propedal ON (still in position 1) for a couple of section on pavement. That almost gave the rear a locked out feel so that worked well for the road and might work well for extended smooth climbs too.
Yeah, they suck and they are soooo expensive, I mean who the fokk would buy a full XT Turner for $4700 when you could have an imported frame and similar parts for the same price.
DT
edit!
Having come off of an Ibis Mojo, I can say that the number one difference in ride quality is without a shred of doubt, the STIFFNESS. An Uber Stiff rear end is a nice thing to have. I felt like I was on my Highline on some of the corners. Like riding on rails. Point and shoot. Even when subjected to the venerable parking lot- grab the tire , hold the saddle and pull- test the Spot passes with aplomb. Before I received my Spot Jarret at Turner told me that
this Spot was one of the stiffest frames thatTurner had ever produced. I figured he was hyping up the product. Turns out he was right on.
I ran the rp23 with about 35% (eyeballing) sag, and it seemed to keep up with the z1light just fine. I'm sure Push will be providing a nice upgrade to those who feel like they need it. I did bottom out the rear on couple of drops but I attribute that to poor rider style if anything.
Trail chatter was easily soaked up, it really feels like it has more than 5.5" of travel. I weigh 210 geared up, give or take a couple of burritos, and ran about 160 lbs of pressure in the large volume rp23 can.
On a section of trail that was downhill but littered with baseball sized mini baby heads, I purposely stayed seated just to feel the ride. The spot has a very smooth suspension path. It was so easy to just relax and let the bike do all the work.
I did notice on two occasions, a slight almost imperceptible pedal kick when climbing the rough in the granny gear. Not as pronounced as I've experienced on VPP bikes like the Intense 5.5 or 6.6, but still there. Not sure if its right to call it a pedal kick, maybe like a slight tug. Still, overall the ride quality matches the craftsmanship that Turner is famous for.
When climbing, the DW linkage shines. Really neat to look down and see very little movement, when you expect to see a whole lot of bobbing. This Spot is the perfect synergy of suspension design, frame craftsmanship, and fit. Add in the awesome Customer service and you;ve got a pretty cool thing going.
I think I'm gonna keep this one for a while. I may have to give up my Homer Poseur status this year.
http://www.mtbr.com/mfr/turner/allmtn-full-suspension/5spotdwlink/PRD_425923_1547crx.aspx
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8,202 Posts
Jeezus! Now I want a Sultan.
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1,420 Posts
Jaybo,
After this comeback post from DT, you better stay in the 29er forum.
Ouch!!!!!
totally want a sultan now!!!!!!!!!
After this comeback post from DT, you better stay in the 29er forum.
Ouch!!!!!
totally want a sultan now!!!!!!!!!
Joined
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4,278 Posts
That's because it's so good that it leaves people speechless. I think you should ride one.Jaybo said:
There are a number of in depth writeups, you just have to search for them. There is even a pretty decent write up by Aqua in the 29er forum.
I rode both a DW Spot and DW Flux at the 2008 THC. I'd owned a TNT Spot and Flux before and still own my Reborn Burner (horst link). I'm always comparing any bike I ride with my Burner which is totally dialed in for me. I'd really never ridden a bike that is as plush but bob-free as my Burner. That's why I sold my Spot and my Flux is 'cause I had (have) the Burner.
I first took out the DW Spot on Sovereign Saturday with the THC mob and didn't know what to expect. DT dialed in everyone's sag and we were off. To sum up, it accelerated faster than my Burner (!), was plusher (!) and handled beautifully. When we stopped I said to DT "this Spot feels just like a Turner...only better". I'm not really good at quantifying the why of it, it just felt better. So familiar but improved.
I took out a DW Flux the next day back to Sovereign while the rest of the THC crew rode Burro. I had to keep reminding myself I was on a Flux because the suspension soaked up the hits, square edge, big and small, so effortlessly. Compared to my Reborn Burner (I haven't told it this yet) both bikes were plusher and...better.
I first took out the DW Spot on Sovereign Saturday with the THC mob and didn't know what to expect. DT dialed in everyone's sag and we were off. To sum up, it accelerated faster than my Burner (!), was plusher (!) and handled beautifully. When we stopped I said to DT "this Spot feels just like a Turner...only better". I'm not really good at quantifying the why of it, it just felt better. So familiar but improved.
I took out a DW Flux the next day back to Sovereign while the rest of the THC crew rode Burro. I had to keep reminding myself I was on a Flux because the suspension soaked up the hits, square edge, big and small, so effortlessly. Compared to my Reborn Burner (I haven't told it this yet) both bikes were plusher and...better.
Sweet............I can't wait ! :thumbsup: TIG.jncarpenter said:Yup, any comments at this point would simply find me gushing. I'll reserve my collective thoughts until I have had ample time to fairly evaluate (I have 2.5 years on the tnt sultan)...however, there is just no comparison to Sultan v.1.
Sultan v.2 is heads & shoulders above v.1...yes, it is that dramatic a difference (this sums it up...no need to read further!).
Here are a couple stand out characteristics:
-V.2 feels bottomless in it's travel...nearly the complete opposite of v.1
-I have been riding mine with 40% sag and the traction seems incredible on most rough chop...yet no bottomout issues (yet). High speed choppy corners are just amazing...no hopping in the rear at all...just stays glued.
-V.2 lateral stiffness is so much better is is literal comical (I lol'd
It's real soon to weigh in with a verdict since durability is a major consideration & I have only a few rides...but the performance advantages alone on the new design are staggering. Keep in mind that the new sultan did add nearly an inch of travel & I am sure this is helping a bit, but this is truly a bike you need to test ride to appreciate.
...now if you're interested in a TNT Sultan in large, I might be able to help you out!
Joined
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284 Posts
After having four people spend time on the D W bike coming from previous Turners and other brands everyone has been very, very pleased.:thumbsup: Have also had twelve different people very impressed after several hours on the bike bikes after a shop, demo. No one has had an unwordly experience that I'm aware of though.Jaybo said:
If thats what you need, you may need something other then a new bike. Just a thought.
Joined
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9,546 Posts
Rome wasn't built in a day
I agree with the cactus, give it time, 2 models to come, ride before speak, and enjoy what ya got too, its not half bad, what is this an arms race!
Xmas be some positive!
DT getting around trying to give you guy's Demo's common give em a break how many companies do this, huh, it was always going to be a big mission, so hang in there patience peeps, ah I know I have none dam hard but ya could razz ya mates that have the dwl kool aid for a rip maybe too!
I'm just thinking how cool it is to be old school finally!
Oh I would like a dwl version too!
But I'm satisfied sort of really just want RIDE! that's my new years res, ride beyotch and ride hard which will be soft really
I agree with the cactus, give it time, 2 models to come, ride before speak, and enjoy what ya got too, its not half bad, what is this an arms race!
Xmas be some positive!
DT getting around trying to give you guy's Demo's common give em a break how many companies do this, huh, it was always going to be a big mission, so hang in there patience peeps, ah I know I have none dam hard but ya could razz ya mates that have the dwl kool aid for a rip maybe too!
I'm just thinking how cool it is to be old school finally!
Oh I would like a dwl version too!
But I'm satisfied sort of really just want RIDE! that's my new years res, ride beyotch and ride hard which will be soft really
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