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Jumping versus being bucked

4559 Views 14 Replies 9 Participants Last post by Boulder Pilot, Jul 21, 2010

BMeX

Discussion Starter · Jul 15, 2010

New to full suspension and trying to learn proper setup of my rear shock.

Was watching some videos and noticed it certainly appears that many people being 'bucked' after a landing might just have their shocks setup improperly. Is it preload or rebound that's killing it for them.....or did they need that 'pop' to get airborne in the first place?

Am I looking for a fine line between the two?

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the-one1

· #2 · Jul 15, 2010

Being bucked after landing is too fast of a rebound.

BMeX

Discussion Starter · #3 · Jul 15, 2010

the-one1 said:
Being bucked after landing is too fast of a rebound.

Thanks for that.

So, was their rebound too high cause they didn't know any better, or because they were attempting to get more 'pop' off of the jump?

I don't mind sticking to the ground like glue at all but some rock sections I'm sure would be faster if I just hopped over them completely.

Should I be looking for a compromise between 'proper handling' and having 'some' pop when I need it?

Or am I way off?

Thanks for your help.

jeffscott

· #4 · Jul 15, 2010

To simplify if you are getting bucked of you need a slower rebound setting, at least for that particular run....

Rebound set so I don't get bucked off doesn't seem to effect of high or far I can jump....

BMeX

Discussion Starter · #5 · Jul 15, 2010

jeffscott said:
Rebound set so I don't get bucked off doesn't seem to effect of high or far I can jump....

First off I'd like to say thank you for sharing your experiences. :thumbsup:

I'm not doubting your opinion at all, just hypothesizing outloud.

Although I'm new to mtn biking, I do have some offroad racing experience, though mostly with trucks and buggies. In a truck, suspension setup has everything to do with sticking a landing safely, but it also has a GREAT effect on it's attitude on takeoff....I'd go so far as to say an even greater effect than weight distribution.

Being a retired bmx guy, I still like to do some urban riding (skateparks and what not) and it sure seems to me that the more my bike absorbs (low preload and rebound), the faster I have to hit the same obstacle to clear it.

PissedOffCil

· #6 · Jul 15, 2010

BMeX said:
Although I'm new to mtn biking, I do have some offroad racing experience, though mostly with trucks and buggies. In a truck, suspension setup has everything to do with sticking a landing safely, but it also has a GREAT effect on it's attitude on takeoff....I'd go so far as to say an even greater effect than weight distribution.

When unloading the bike in preparation of the jump, rebound can indeed give you some some air since it "pushes you up". Too much rebound though and you get bucked on landing.

BMeX said:
Being a retired bmx guy, I still like to do some urban riding (skateparks and what not) and it sure seems to me that the more my bike absorbs (low preload and rebound), the faster I have to hit the same obstacle to clear it.

Absorption must not be confused with rebound. You don't want a shock/fork too plush when hitting jumps since the suspension will take away some force that you will not carry into the air.

BMeX

Discussion Starter · #7 · Jul 18, 2010

Thanks POC :thumbsup:

Confirms my thinking that it is possible to be 'too plush', will keep playing with settings.

jeffscott

· #8 · Jul 18, 2010

BMeX said:
First off I'd like to say thank you for sharing your experiences. :thumbsup:

I'm not doubting your opinion at all, just hypothesizing outloud.

Although I'm new to mtn biking, I do have some offroad racing experience, though mostly with trucks and buggies. In a truck, suspension setup has everything to do with sticking a landing safely, but it also has a GREAT effect on it's attitude on takeoff....I'd go so far as to say an even greater effect than weight distribution.Diffenece is I got two big legs with 2 feet of travel

Being a retired bmx guy, I still like to do some urban riding (skateparks and what not) and it sure seems to me that the more my bike absorbs (low preload and rebound), the faster I have to hit the same obstacle to clear it.

All it takes is the right rthyme for the pump given the rebound setting.

BMeX

Discussion Starter · #9 · Jul 18, 2010

jeffscott said:
All it takes is the right rthyme for the pump given the rebound setting.

Quite inexperienced here but I'm sure one day soon this will make sense to me, thanks.

Wonder if I can reach that rebound knob while in the air. :lol:

perttime

· #10 · Jul 18, 2010

Slow rebound may be good for absorbing a single hit. In other situations it does not work that well. Take a "washboard", where the a slow rebound setting does not let the suspension recover from a small hit before the next one comes.

weedkilla1

· #11 · Jul 19, 2010

In complete disagreement to most of the posters here, getting bucked after a landing usually has little to do with the settings for your rebound dial. When you land a big jump and bottom out the rear suspension the wheels and frame start to absorb the energy your suspension should be dealing with, when this starts to unwind and rebound, no damper can control the rebound and it does "buck". Getting bucked is usually a case of poor spring rate - check your sag - or too low high speed compression damping. If you are not bottoming out then it may be your high speed rebound is too fast.
The rebound clicker on your shock is almost certainly only low speed rebound, and will have very little affect in this situation. The internal settings for high speed compression and rebound is what gives PUSH their magic feel, and cant be achieved by twiddling the dials on your shock. Unless you are the right weight and riding style for the way the shock was set up at the factory, or you aren't fussy, or your good at riding "around" poor suspension behaviour consider getting a custom tune - it doesn't have to be PUSH, they wre just an example of someone who consistently does it well.

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NWS

· #12 · Jul 19, 2010

the-one1 said:
Being bucked after landing is too fast of a rebound.

Or landing with your weight too far forward.

There was a thread here recently that started with a video of a guy going over the handlebars... half the commenters said his rebound damping was too low, half (including me) said the rear wheel bounce was just a symptom of having very little weight on the rear wheel.

Not to say that too little rebound damping is harmless - after all, the whole point of it is to keep you from bouncing after a hit - but sometimes it's hard to tell the difference between cause and effect when two things are happening at the same time.

If your weight is centered on takeoff, and you're not rotating forward in the air, and you land centered, and then get bucked, then sure, more rebound damping is a good idea. If your weight is too far forward, the lack of weight on the rear wheel will cause it to rebound faster, to the point of bouncing back into the air - and more damping isn't going to help nearly as much as more practice.

eatdrinkride

· #13 · Jul 19, 2010

Every video I've seen of someone getting bucked off a bike is largely b/c they land rear wheel first and slam the front down, all the while having too much forward biased weight. I would suspect using this technique it would be possible, given a large enough miscue, to be bucked off a hardtail bike.

If you land correctly with the front tire slightly ahead of the rear or at least both at the same time...and your weight properly biased how can you possibly be bucked off?

Can you please post a video of someone being thrown forward off a bike using proper landing/jumping techniques? I have not been able to find it. Thanks
I suppose it's possible on a large enough hit and under the circumstances weedkilla outlines. I think for 99% of the people though, it just comes down to lousy technique. .

BMeX

Discussion Starter · #14 · Jul 21, 2010

Thanks for all of your replies, I have plenty of info to ponder over on my next climb. :thumbsup:

Boulder Pilot

· #15 · Jul 21, 2010

My experience has me agreeing with weedkilla1. Before rebound comes into play, you have to have compression to absorb the hit. If technique, spring rate, and compression are spot on, and rebound is too fast, I've experienced an unbalanced weight shift but not enough to catapault me like a lawn dart.

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